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Thread: Ross Taylor likely to be shafted from the captaincy?

  1. #331
    International Captain Howsie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    I don't really know why the lawnbowls guy is continuously brought up.

    There's no evidence of his incompetence here.


    Edit: Oh, I get what you mean. Too late though, Nicol stays.
    Last edited by Howsie; 06-12-2012 at 01:50 AM.
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  2. #332
    International Coach Hurricane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howsie View Post
    Trent Woodhill - The way @RossLTaylor has been treated by the CEO, Blackcaps manager & coaching staff is a bloody disgrace. They should be made accountable.

    A lot of support coming through for Taylor, from ex players, coaches, the public. Personally I can't see how Mike Hesson makes it to 2013, he's done. How he was hired to begin with if he had no desire to work with Taylor I have no idea but it's either him or Ross and in no shape or form can you back Hesson.
    Both the WI board and PCB would back Hesson in the same circumstance. Just wondering if we have sunk to the same level.
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  3. #333
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    This situation has actually developed in a very different way to what I was imagining. I was expecting the players and support staff to be divided somewhere close to 50/50 and an almighty rift to form in New Zealand Cricket, but - so far anyway - all we've seen is support for Taylor. It seems as if Taylor has a huge amount of backing from everywhere other than where it counts which makes this a completely suicidal move from Hesson and the board.

    The timing has just been absolutely absurd though. I can't believe they've chosen now of all times, even if it's true that they tried to push Taylor before the series. I mean, it even would've made sense for McCullum to come in as captain the minute Hesson was appointed as coach as a new partnership going forward; people would've swallowed that a lot better. Taylor being fit to captain the side for the tour of Sri Lanka but not now just makes absolutely no sense at all, and I think even many of those who may have believed McCullum was a better man for the job previously would agree that the timing of this decision is completely bonkers.
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  4. #334
    International Coach Hurricane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    I don't really know why the lawnbowls guy is continuously brought up.

    There's no evidence of his incompetence here.
    He is part of the leadership team so him, Buchanan and the rest are all in the dog house. There doesn't seem to be a virtuous leader or any common sense among any of them.

    Lawnbowls guy draws comment because he has no qualifications. So he would have pleasantly surprised if things had worked out rosy. But was always going to be mocked if things became a farce. Which they have.


  5. #335
    State Vice-Captain BackFootPunch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    I don't really know why the lawnbowls guy is continuously brought up.

    There's no evidence of his incompetence here.
    Yeah I'm inclined to agree with this. Always seemed like a reasonable bloke and the selections they've come up with haven't been horrendous (Nicol is ave but he had performed domestically and in ODIs tbf).

    Funnily enough, when Littlejohn got the job wasn't everyone crying out for Hesson to be appointed selection manager and form some sort of dream team with Wright?

  6. #336
    International Captain hendrix's Avatar
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    The structure is a little confusing to me.

    Selection panel:
    Kim Littlejohn and Mike Hesson. Littlejohn's role is to consult with the domestic coaches and identify players. Mike Hesson has the final say. Greatbatch and Crowe and Turner are also scouts or something.

    CEO: David White

    Director: John Buchanan.

    So presumably Buchanan is in charge of the national teams, while David White is more responsible for the finances and competitions and advertising deals etc etc?

    And these people are all answerable to the board?

    Is this a standard structure?

  7. #337
    International Coach Zinzan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post

    The timing has just been absolutely absurd though. I can't believe they've chosen now of all times, even if it's true that they tried to push Taylor before the series. I mean, it even would've made sense for McCullum to come in as captain the minute Hesson was appointed as coach as a new partnership going forward; people would've swallowed that a lot better. Taylor being fit to captain the side for the tour of Sri Lanka but not now just makes absolutely no sense at all, and I think even many of those who may have believed McCullum was a better man for the job previously would agree that the timing of this decision is completely bonkers.
    Yup, bang on the money about the timing. Doing it immediately following a rare Test victory does nothing more than confirm that Hesson had an ulterior motive the whole time.

  8. #338
    Cricket Web Owner James's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zinzan View Post
    Yup, bang on the money about the timing. Doing it immediately following a rare Test victory does nothing more than confirm that Hesson had an ulterior motive the whole time.
    Exactly.

    What I'm wondering about is which "senior players" are backing McCullum for captain in place of Taylor. You look at our recent teams, and long-timers Vettori, Mills, Oram not being involved in Sri Lanka - who is actually "senior"?

    It really does sound a toxic environment to be involved with from the top all the way down to the team itself.

  9. #339
    International Coach Hurricane's Avatar
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    Mills was over there for the ODIs - Franko has been around for a while although in and out of the side recently.

    Oram may still be counted amongst the mix as he has been in the team recently.

  10. #340
    International Coach Zinzan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by James View Post
    Exactly.

    What I'm wondering about is which "senior players" are backing McCullum for captain in place of Taylor. You look at our recent teams, and long-timers Vettori, Mills, Oram not being involved in Sri Lanka - who is actually "senior"?

    It really does sound a toxic environment to be involved with from the top all the way down to the team itself.
    In terms of longevity the senior players are Franklin, Patel, Guptill, Flynn and Southee. With the exception of Franklin, hardly old-timers.

  11. #341
    International Coach Hurricane's Avatar
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    Sky Sports: Coach Mike Hesson's and Taylor's relationship is now described as untenable. Hesson called Taylor on Monday to offer him the peace offering of the test captaincy. The conversation was breif.
    I can see why he turned it down if it was Hesson who offered it to him. That was a bad move from NZC.

  12. #342
    Cricketer Of The Year Bahnz's Avatar
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    Based on the "bowling attack supporting McCullum" rumour, I'd have to guess that Southee is against Taylor. He's the only member of the bowling unit who's been around long enough to be classified as a "senior" player. It also seems plausible that Boult (being very new) would follow his former u19 team-mate's lead.

    This is wild speculation though.
    Last edited by Bahnz; 06-12-2012 at 02:36 AM.
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  13. #343
    International Coach Zinzan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    The structure is a little confusing to me.

    Selection panel:
    Kim Littlejohn and Mike Hesson. Littlejohn's role is to consult with the domestic coaches and identify players. Mike Hesson has the final say. Greatbatch and Crowe and Turner are also scouts or something.

    CEO: David White

    Director: John Buchanan.

    So presumably Buchanan is in charge of the national teams, while David White is more responsible for the finances and competitions and advertising deals etc etc?
    Yup & to add to the confusion; Buchanan, Hesson's boss, supposedly backs Taylor.
    Quote Originally Posted by hendrix View Post
    And these people are all answerable to the board?

    Is this a standard structure?
    Correct, Boock is the president and there are 7 board members with Chris Moller as the Chair.

    Unfortunately during his skirmish interview yesterday, White seemed to imply the board were behind NZ cricket's decision.

  14. #344
    Cricket Web Owner James's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zinzan View Post
    In terms of longevity the senior players are Franklin, Patel, Guptill, Flynn and Southee. With the exception of Franklin, hardly old-timers.
    And that's where my line of thought is leading me, you look at these players and arguably all of them are under-performing (Southee aside perhaps) and hardily commanding a place in the team to be classed as "senior players". They should be trying to improve their own games than alongside the coach, attempting to de-rail the captain.

    Without looking up stats, I think I could safely say Taylor has been clearly our best batsmen for the past 12+ months and to effectively hang him out to dry over this is just shocking. Along with the fact he's lead us to Test victories over Australia and Sri Lanka in the past year and with a bit of luck, we would have gone further in the T20 WC.

    Either the coach has to go, or I can't see Taylor remaining in the team personally. Certainly couldn't blame him for telling NZC to go stuff themselves and make his dollars in the T20 leagues around the world.

  15. #345
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bahnz View Post
    Based on the "bowling attack supporting McCullum" rumour, I'd have to guess that Southee is against Taylor. He's the only member of the bowling unit who's been around long enough to be classified as a "senior" player. It also seems plausible that Boult (being very new) would follow his former u19 team-mate's lead.

    This is wild speculation though.
    Yeah, I reckon Southee would feel a bit aggrieved about how he'd been handled at times during Taylor's reign too, rightly or wrongly.

    I'm getting the overwhelming sense of this "senior players" thing to be largely guff though. Hesson has wanted McCullum at the top ever since he arrived and that's the reason this is happening; nothing more. The more we hear on the matter, the more we keep hearing from people who support Taylor, at least at the current time, and that includes the players. I don't think there's been a coup from inside the team at all.

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