Has Tim Southee "arrived"?

[Bahnz]

Originally Posted by M0rphin3

Hopefully. Although tbf mostly had to bowl in harsh conditions even before - when was it when he looked utterly dire?

Pretty much his entire career except his debut.

[Cabinet96]

Really rate him. Always thought he'd do well after the 2011 World Cup, where he showed an ability to reverse it at pace. Hope he can continue his progress.

[Burgey]

I didn't know he'd left.

Badabing!!!

[NUFAN]

Tim Southee? Should be Tim Northee.

He's arrived, needs to learn how to bowl in good bowling conditions though.

[Inferno]

These arguments about conditions being helpful and non helpful conditions based on what country you are playing in are some of the weakest ever. I feel like most people that do that just sterotype rather than actually watching that series. Seriously just because pitches happened to be flat for one particular series doesn't mean its always going to be flat. Do people seriously believe that the Hobart pitch NZ won in last year was always green? If these pitches were so flat the ball wouldn't be doing so much. I am willing to bet the pitches NZ produced for SA last year were flatter than this. They certainly couldn't make the ball do so much in that series.

Not taking anything away from Southee he was awesome but these pitches weren't that flat. The pitches in which Aus vs SA series that's going on now those would be flat pitches.

[SteveNZ]

Originally Posted by Inferno

If these pitches were so flat the ball wouldn't be doing so much. I am willing to bet the pitches NZ produced for SA last year were flatter than this. They certainly couldn't make the ball do so much in that series.

Southee is a swing bowler. The methods of his wicket-taking in recent times have been through the air, not off the seam. In the latest Test, we scored 412 before Southee took his 5-for. In India, prior to his seven-for, we managed 360 odd and runs weren't that hard to come by. So I'd challenge you to belittle his achievements by saying they were on green seamers. Colombo in particular was a road. Not a Perth road, but a road.

He's a completely different bowler than the one that played SA last summer. Sure, he'll find bigger tests in all meanings of the word over the next six months but those who have watched his career closely can see that he is up to it, and that his form over the last six months suggest he is a genuine world-class bowler.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by SteveNZ

Southee is a swing bowler. The methods of his wicket-taking in recent times have been through the air, not off the seam. In the latest Test, we scored 412 before Southee took his 5-for. In India, prior to his seven-for, we managed 360 odd and runs weren't that hard to come by. So I'd challenge you to belittle his achievements by saying they were on green seamers. Colombo in particular was a road. Not a Perth road, but a road.

He's a completely different bowler than the one that played SA last summer. Sure, he'll find bigger tests in all meanings of the word over the next six months but those who have watched his career closely can see that he is up to it, and that his form over the last six months suggest he is a genuine world-class bowler.

I am not saying they were green seamers at all. All I said was these weren't as flat of a pitch as its being made out to be. That doesn't mean I'm saying they were easy conditions for bowling though.

Colombo wasn't a road. In the game you played against SA in Dunedin last year in which Southee was crap you got 273 and 137/2 against Steyn and co. earlier this year. In fact the only reason you didn't get to 300+ in the first dig was because your batsmen failed to convert their starts and gave it away which is not uncommon for NZ. Anyways, I would certainly consider that equally and if not more hard than scoring 400 once against SL where your main bowler is Herath.

If you want to see a genuine road look at Adelaide.

[Bahnz]

Originally Posted by Inferno

I am not saying they were green seamers at all. All I said was these weren't as flat of a pitch as its being made out to be. That doesn't mean I'm saying they were easy conditions for bowling though.

Colombo wasn't a road. In the game you played against SA in Dunedin last year in which Southee was crap you got 273 and 137/2 against Steyn and co. earlier this year. In fact the only reason you didn't get to 300+ in the first dig was because your batsmen failed to convert their starts and gave it away which is not uncommon for NZ. Anyways, I would certainly consider that equally and if not more hard than scoring 400 once against SL where your main bowler is Herath.

If you want to see a genuine road look at Adelaide.

Colombo was very flat. You only had to look at how difficult wicket taking was after the first 20 odd overs, to realise that. As soon as the shine wore off, wicket taking became extremely difficult for both teams, even against lower order batting (Randiv batted for nearly 3 hours on day 3 without difficulty, but looked utterly clueless once the new ball was taken). The bounce was modest and predictable, and there was very little sideways movement on offer. It was a definite road, though I agree the tracks at Adelaide and Perth (at least from day 2 onwards) were even better for batting.

[Flem274*]

Colombo was a complete road. You must have been watching a different match.

Anyway, how else do you think we scored 400?