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Thread: The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

  1. #1351
    International Vice-Captain Red Hill's Avatar
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    I don't believe Marshall was a vastly greater bowler than Imran or Hadlee. But you could quite easily replace one of them with him. I'd take Lillee first if I was going to select bowlers on bowling merit only.

  2. #1352
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Great finds watson, Just amazing clips
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Cameron+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  3. #1353
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    I don't believe Marshall was a vastly greater bowler than Imran or Hadlee.
    Indeed not; but Hadlee wasn't a vastly greater batsman than Marshall either; and in fact I'm sure the difference in batting between them would be much lesser against a team of equivalent standard to the one we're picking than it was during their Test careers.

    Even in a "bat to 11" team, Marshall must play. He could seriously bat. Especially if you're picking Warne.
    ~ Cribbertarian ~

    Rejecting 'analysis by checklist' and 'skill absolutism' since December 2009

  4. #1354
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    If I wanted to bat to eleven:

    1 Hobbs
    2 Grace
    3 Bradman
    4 Tendulkar
    5 Headley
    6 Sobers
    7 Gilchrist
    8 Imran
    9 Benaud
    10 Hadlee
    11 Marshall

    Which is incidentally just straight up my usual team with Benaud in for Murali.


  5. #1355
    International Captain ankitj's Avatar
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    How will Faulkner be in place of Benaud?

  6. #1356
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8ankitj View Post
    How will Faulkner be in place of Benaud?
    Yeah that was my original thought but Benaud was the better bowler even though Faulkner was the better cricketer, and he's batting 9 with Hadlee at 10, so I went with Benaud. I also considered Briggs and Rhodes.
    Last edited by Prince EWS; 02-02-2013 at 10:41 PM.

  7. #1357
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Could have Faulkner for Benaud and then someone like Pollock, Miller or Procter for Headley to balance it out a bit and ensure the side still had four real quality bowlers I guess.
    Last edited by Prince EWS; 02-02-2013 at 10:41 PM.

  8. #1358
    International Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Indeed not; but Hadlee wasn't a vastly greater batsman than Marshall either; and in fact I'm sure the difference in batting between them would be much lesser against a team of equivalent standard to the one we're picking than it was during their Test careers.

    Even in a "bat to 11" team, Marshall must play. He could seriously bat. Especially if you're picking Warne.
    Hadlee was not vastly better than Marshall, but I believe him to be significantly better from what I saw on the TV,

    In the early 80s he was one of only 2-3 Kiwi batsman who had any idea against Dennis Lillee. I remember the following 50 by Hadlee as if it were yesterday. The team score was 152 all out;

    1st Test: Australia v New Zealand at Brisbane, Nov 28-30, 1980 | Cricket Scorecard | ESPN Cricinfo

  9. #1359
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Why Lawry over Trumper, Morris, Hayden or Ponsford in your AUS XI, watson?
    Oh for a strong arm and a walking stick

  10. #1360
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyear2 View Post
    Pollock is a class below any of the W.I. pace men and there is none of them quite the equal of Ambrose far less Marshall, but yes it is a very good attack with Procter probably being the best but never got the prolonged Test experience to prove it. If he and Richards has played full careers they may very well been locks in everyone's ATG side. As it is it's hard to place them above Hutton/ Gavaskar or Imran/Miller.
    Please justify what you say about Pollock. It's your opinion FFS, not a fact like you seem to make it out to be.

  11. #1361
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

    Yeah we don't crap in the first world; most of us would actually have no idea what that was emanating from Ajmal's backside. Why isn't it roses and rainbows like what happens here? PEWS's retort to Ganeshran on Daemon's picture depicting Ajmal's excreta

  12. #1362
    International Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    Why Lawry over Trumper, Morris, Hayden or Ponsford in your AUS XI, watson?
    Admittedly it's difficult to look past Bill Lawry's big nose, his rather over the top TV commentary, and the paronoid batting that infected his late career. He obviously lacks the charisma of someone like Victor Trumper or Arthur Morris.

    But if you do peer behind the facade you find a batsman who scored some truly great centuries against some awesome attacks. I don't think that Trumper, Morris, Hayden, or Ponsford scored runs of the same 'quality' on such a consistent basis.

  13. #1363
    International Captain ankitj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jager View Post
    Please justify what you say about Pollock. It's your opinion FFS, not a fact like you seem to make it out to be.
    Much like how I would respond too, but I didn't. Kyear has this peculiar habit.
    Last edited by ankitj; 03-02-2013 at 05:49 AM.

  14. #1364
    International Captain watson's Avatar
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    Centuries by Bill Lawry

    210 Barbados 1965: Hall, Griffith, Sobers, Gibbs
    205 MCG 1968: Edwards, Davis, Sobers, Gibbs
    166 Brisbane 1965: Brown, Higgs, Titmus, Allen
    157 MCG 1964: Pollock, Goddard, Partridge, Seymour
    151 SCG 1969: Hall, Griffith, Sobers, Gibbs
    135 The Oval 1968: Snow, Brown, Underwood, Illingworth
    130 Lords 1961: Trueman, Statham, Lock, Illingworth
    119 Adelaide 1966: Brown, Jones, Allen, Titmus
    108 MCG 1966: Brown, Jones, Knight, Titmus
    106 Old Trafford 1964 : Cartwright, Price, Rumsay, Mortimore, Titmus
    105 Brisbane 1968: Griffith, Holford, Sobers, Gibbs
    102 Old Trafford 1961: Trueman, Statham, Flavell, Allen
    100 MCG 1968: Prasanna, Chandrasekhar, Desai, Subramanya


    Trueman
    Statham
    Snow
    Underwood
    Hall
    Griffith
    Gibbs
    Pollock
    Prasanna
    Chandrasekhar


    I think that's a pretty impressive list of bowlers to score tons against. Definitely much better than what Morris had to face, and probably better than what Trumper, Ponsford and Hayden had to face.
    Last edited by watson; 03-02-2013 at 03:51 AM.

  15. #1365
    International Vice-Captain Mike5181's Avatar
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    What's a South African all-time XI look like now?



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