The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[SJS]

Actually Graveney did pick Hall (but at the expense of Roberts, not Garner), I just forgot and got it wrong when I first put it up as I'm doing all this from memory. Have now edited.

Graveney actually rated Hall the greatest of all West Indian fast bowlers, and second only to Ray Lindwall in the post-1945 era from all countries.

Ah. That makes sense. It would be awful to have someone like Graveney, who has played Hall, even though the man was thirty then, to prefer Garner over him. :o)

[L Trumper]

Great to see Lindsay Hassett in those aussie sides.

[SJS]

Great to see Lindsay Hassett in those aussie sides.

I have always noticed that Hassett is one of the most under rated Australian cricketers by the fans and very highly rated by those he played with and against. I thought this happened only in India where a 'glamour quotient' is attached to cricketers which decides whether they are 'stars' or not and for the common fan in India, only the stars are good cricketers and super stars are Gods.

[Monk]

Feel like it's time for some discussion (I'm bored as). I'm on a bit of a Lara fan tangent atm, so here is my current ATG team


- Jack Hobbs
- Bill Lawry
- Don Bradman
- Brian Lara
- Viv Richards
- Garry Sobers
- Imran Khan *
- Shane Warne
- Godfrey Evans +
- Malcolm Marshall
- Dennis Lillee

This'd be my second XI:

- Sunil Gavaskar
- Len Hutton
- George Headley
- Greg Chappell
- Wally Hammond
- Frank Worrell *
- Allan Knott +
- Richard Hadlee
- Wasim Akram
- Curtly Ambrose
- Bill O'Reilly

[Prince EWS]

This'd be my second XI:

- Sunil Gavaskar
- Len Hutton
- George Headley
- Greg Chappell
- Wally Hammond
- Frank Worrell *
- Allan Knott +
- Richard Hadlee
- Wasim Akram
- Curtly Ambrose
- Bill O'Reilly

No Tendulkar in either side is a big call.

[Coronis]

Great to see Lindsay Hassett in those aussie sides.

One of my favourites, personally. Easily makes my 2nd Aus XI.

[kyear2]

Will stick the teams in my sig, just two notes.
One reason for me why Warne is a lock for me is that bowling or batting being equal, any eztra quality one has would make the difference, and the fact that Warne was a much better bat aside, much more importantly with Warne not in the first team it forces Tendulkar or someone else equally unaccostomed and unsuited into the cordon.
Greg Chappell is really under rated, in WSC he averaged just about the same as Viv and his test career was just spectacular added to his graceful batting was his useful legspin and he was probably the best second slip of all time. He was to Viv as Lara was to Tendulkar, not that far behind and some thought the better player.

[Monk]

No Tendulkar in either side is a big call.

True. I consider Headley the second best number 3. And I consider G.Chappell and Hammond both superior players to Tendulkar (very marginally). So it comes down to a choice between Tendulkar and Worrell. And I'll admit it's more to personal preference than anything to do with skill. I like the idea of Worrell as captain as well.

My third XI would definitely contain Tendulkar. In a few months he might be in my 1st XI. All subjective!

Third XI
- Arthur Morris
- Herb Sutcliffe
- Ricky Ponting
- Sachin Tendulkar
- Victor Trumper
- Jaques Kallis
- Adam Gilchrist
- Michael Holding
- Fred Trueman
- Glenn McGrath
- Clarrie Grimmett

[kyear2]

No Murali in any of your top three Monk?

[Monk]

No Murali in any of your top three Monk?

Prefer a leg spinner to an offspinner. Warne, O'Reilly and Grimmett would all be selected over Murali in my teams.

[NUFAN]

Post Expo 88 Team
1. Mark TAYLOR (c)
2. Matthew HAYDEN
3. Ricky PONTING
4. Mark WAUGH
5. Michael CLARKE
6. Steve WAUGH
7. Adam GILCHRIST +
8. Peter SIDDLE
9. Shane WARNE
10. Jason GILLESPIE
11. Glenn MCGRATH

- Siddle favoured over McDermott, Lee, Hughes, Johnson for his ability to take key wickets.
- Terrific fielding unit and brilliant captain
- This lineup has lost 0 matches as a unit, so its unlikely they would ever lose a Test match.

[Monk]

Post Expo 88 Team
1. Mark TAYLOR (c)
2. David Boon
3. Ricky PONTING
4. Mark WAUGH
5. Michael CLARKE
6. Steve WAUGH
7. Adam GILCHRIST +
8. Craig McDermott
9. Shane WARNE
10. Jason GILLESPIE
11. Glenn MCGRATH

- Siddle favoured over McDermott, Lee, Hughes, Johnson for his ability to take key wickets.
- Terrific fielding unit and brilliant captain
- This lineup has lost 0 matches as a unit, so its unlikely they would ever lose a Test match.

I'd make two changes.

[NUFAN]

I don't think any opening bat from Australia (that fits the criteria) could have performed the role that Hayden performed as successfully so he is a pretty safe bet for me, as much as I like Boon.

No worries about McDermott, great bowler.

[smalishah84]

how could you prefer Siddle over McDermott

McDermott was a very good bowler

[NUFAN]

Its very easy for me to prefer Sid, but even looking objectively for a minute (and only a minute) there records are almost identical:

Billy
ave 28.63
econ 3.01
sr 56.9

vs

Big Heart
ave 28.51
econ 3.02
sr 56.6

Records aren't the only thing to consider, its team dynamics and since I've already included a terrific opening ball pairing in McGrath and Gillespie I'm happy to select a bowler used to bowling first change like Siddle and I like how often he takes important wickets.