The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[Dan]

Sticky Wicket XI

1. Len Hutton
2. Jack Hobbs
3. George Headley
4. Neil Harvey
5. Stan McCabe
6. Monty Noble
7. George Hirst
8. Jack Blackham
9. Hedley Verity
10. Derek Underwood
11. Sydney Barnes

12. VVS Laxman

Hutton's 62* at the Gabba in the early 1950s (year escapes me) was one hell of a knock on a terrible pitch, so he gets in solely based on that. Hobbs had a fantastic technique and was described as playing well on tough pitches. Similarly, Headley's reputation on sticky wickets is well renowned.

Harvey seems like a good player to be able to adjust to poor conditions, and if in doubt McCabe is included to hit out - if he comes off, he's turned the game; if not, it's another batsman back in the shed. But McCabe always came off when he was needed. Monty Noble comes in as an all-rounder used to that style of pitch.

Hirst's "we'll get 'em in singles" knock typifies the notion that he was better on tracks affording help to bowlers, and his style of bowling not be enjoyable to face on a bad track - making use of swing and seam from the left-armer's angle.

Blackham is probably the most qualified wicketkeeper in such a position, with anecdotes suggesting he'd batted and kept with distinction on pitches featuring ridges and troughs. Then the bowling attack of Verity, Underwood and Barnes would take some facing; the former mixing his impeccable line and length with sharp bounce and turn, Underwood providing the unplayable deliveries he was so well known for, and Barnes zipping the ball around both ways off the pitch at a bit above medium. Surely unplayable.

VVS Laxman is also included, probably competing with Noble, for his modern exploits on testing pitches. Hirst-Verity-Underwood-Barnes is a competent enough attack (if extremely left-armed), especially on those pitches, so Noble's bowling may be surplus to requirements.

[watson]

Originally Posted by rvd619323

Sticky Wicket XI

1. Len Hutton
2. Jack Hobbs
3. George Headley
4. Neil Harvey
5. Stan McCabe
6. Monty Noble
7. George Hirst
8. Jack Blackham
9. Hedley Verity
10. Derek Underwood
11. Sydney Barnes

12. VVS Laxman

Hutton's 62* at the Gabba in the early 1950s (year escapes me) was one hell of a knock on a terrible pitch, so he gets in solely based on that. Hobbs had a fantastic technique and was described as playing well on tough pitches. Similarly, Headley's reputation on sticky wickets is well renowned.

Harvey seems like a good player to be able to adjust to poor conditions, and if in doubt McCabe is included to hit out - if he comes off, he's turned the game; if not, it's another batsman back in the shed. But McCabe always came off when he was needed. Monty Noble comes in as an all-rounder used to that style of pitch.

Hirst's "we'll get 'em in singles" knock typifies the notion that he was better on tracks affording help to bowlers, and his style of bowling not be enjoyable to face on a bad track - making use of swing and seam from the left-armer's angle.

Blackham is probably the most qualified wicketkeeper in such a position, with anecdotes suggesting he'd batted and kept with distinction on pitches featuring ridges and troughs. Then the bowling attack of Verity, Underwood and Barnes would take some facing; the former mixing his impeccable line and length with sharp bounce and turn, Underwood providing the unplayable deliveries he was so well known for, and Barnes zipping the ball around both ways off the pitch at a bit above medium. Surely unplayable.

VVS Laxman is also included, probably competing with Noble, for his modern exploits on testing pitches. Hirst-Verity-Underwood-Barnes is a competent enough attack (if extremely left-armed), especially on those pitches, so Noble's bowling may be surplus to requirements.

Yes, that Hutton innings is quite famous;

PLAYER HIGHLIGHTS

No.1 Len Hutton

62 V Australia, Brisbane 1950
http://www.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/match/62713.html

Australia batted first and scored 228. But then the wicket turned into a quagmire. England were bowled out for 68 and Australia then replied with 7/32 declared. Hutton and Compton batted at No.8 and No.9 respectively in an effort to let the wicket dry out. In the end Hutton made 62 out of a team score of 122 in what has been described as one of the greatest exhibitions of defensive batting seen.

[Jager]

Trumper's my first choice on a wet wicket tbh! Surprised to see him omitted

[fredfertang]

Interesting idea - Sticky wicket XI comprising those who never played on them, well Gavaskar did briefly, obviously

Gavaskar
Atherton
Dravid
Tendulkar
Lara
Inzamam
Russell
Warne
Alderman
McGrath
Murali

[watson]

I was about to say, why aren't modern fast bowlers often selected as first choice sticky wicket bowlers? We tend to go with the 'spin-swerve' bowlers like Noble as a matter of course.

I would like to nominate Mlacolm Marshall as an obvious sticky wicket bowler. Intuition tells me that his low trajectory, combined with the ball skidding off the pitch would be a nightmare in wet conditions.

[smalishah84]

and probably wasim too

[kyear2]

Originally Posted by Spooony

Sutcliffe
Hutton
Bradman
Kallis
S Waugh
Chanderpaul
Gilchrist
Thomas Richardson,
George Lohmann
Malcolm Marshall
Mendis

Is this your All Time XI?

[Spooony]

Originally Posted by kyear2

Is this your All Time XI?

Sticky

Did you guys had a Bookies XI yet?

[bagapath]

dour XI

boycott
h.sutcliffe
dravid
kallis
chanderpaul
shastri
kirmani
kumble
srinath
mcgrath
walsh

[Flametree]

Originally Posted by bagapath

dour XI

boycott
h.sutcliffe
dravid
kallis
chanderpaul
shastri
kirmani
kumble
srinath
mcgrath
walsh

A criminal lack of Kiwis in that team. Turner, Richardson, Chatfield, Larsen, Vettori (with the ball, he's quite enterprising with the bat...) are all strong contenders.

[Days of Grace]

DoG's Alltime XI

Hobbs
Hutton
Bradman (c)
Richards
Sobers
Gilchrist (wk)
Imran Khan
Hadlee
Warne
Marshall
Muralitharan

Thoughts?

Going with 5 batsmen and 5 bowlers. Sobers is left to concentrate on his batting. And besides, with the Don I will have the equivalent of 6 batsmen. The tail may look long but in reality everyone is extremely capable of a quick 50 except for Murali. And I have bowling to burn for all types of conditions.

[Prince EWS]

Yeah not enough batting IMO.

[Mike5181]

Something a bit different with Kallis as the fifth bowler:

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Len Hutton
3. Don Bradman
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Garry Sobers
6. Jacques Kallis
7. Adam Gilchrist +
8. Imran Khan (c)
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. Shane Warne
11. Glenn McGrath

[Days of Grace]

Originally Posted by Prince EWS

Yeah not enough batting IMO.

What if I compare the total batting average of my 11 players to any other Alltime XI you wish to post:

Hobbs 56.94
Hutton 56.67
Bradman 99.94
Richards 50.23
Sobers 57.78
Gilchrist 47.60
Imran Khan 37.69
Hadlee 27.16
Marshall 18.85
Warne 17.32
Muralitharan 11.67

That's a total of 481.85, as opposed to Mike5181's 512.17.

However, the average of my 5 bowlers is 22.83, compared to Mike's 24.69.

So, my team should be able to measure up to almost all others.

[benchmark00]

Out of control.