The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread - Page 62

LongHopCassidy · 24-10-2012, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prince EWS

Leaving Sobers out. That's a new one.

Must say I agree. Take away his bowling and he's still IMO the second best batsman of all time.

LongHopCassidy · 24-10-2012, 03:24 PM

I'm going to go ahead and pick an XI that succeeded routinely in crap conditions (top-class bowling/batting attacks, performance pressure, bad wickets relative to their role):

Presenting the Adversity XI:

1. G Boycott (very low standard deviation from his Test average of 48, superb record against Windies)
2. L Hutton (played a ridiculous amount of tremendous innings on sticky wickets)
3. RN Harvey (see Hutton)
4. AR Border (duh)
5. SR Waugh* (away average is almost 9 runs higher than his home record)
6. A Flower+ (held an entire minnow nation together for a decade)
7. N Kapil Dev (played half of matches on dustbowls)
8. H Verity (bowled on 1930s decks against the likes of Bradman, Ponsford and McCabe)
9. Wasim Akram (record even better than Kapil's on arguably even flatter home decks)
10. DK Lillee (recovery from injury and reinvention of self as a bowler)
11. GD McGrath (no outlier performance against any particular Test nation)

Honourable mentions go to Gavaskar, Headley, Glenn Turner, Chanderpaul, Hadlee and Imran.

watson · 24-10-2012, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongHopCassidy

I'm going to go ahead and pick an XI that succeeded routinely in crap conditions (top-class bowling/batting attacks, performance pressure, bad wickets relative to their role):

Presenting the Adversity XI:

1. G Boycott (very low standard deviation from his Test average of 48, superb record against Windies)
2. L Hutton (played a ridiculous amount of tremendous innings on sticky wickets)
3. RN Harvey (see Hutton)
4. AR Border (duh)
5. SR Waugh* (away average is almost 9 runs higher than his home record)
6. A Flower+ (held an entire minnow nation together for a decade)
7. N Kapil Dev (played half of matches on dustbowls)
8. H Verity (bowled on 1930s decks against the likes of Bradman, Ponsford and McCabe)
9. Wasim Akram (record even better than Kapil's on arguably even flatter home decks)
10. DK Lillee (recovery from injury and reinvention of self as a bowler)
11. GD McGrath (no outlier performance against any particular Test nation)

Honourable mentions go to Gavaskar, Headley, Glenn Turner, Chanderpaul, Hadlee and Imran.

What about George Headley? One of the best with regards to 'sticky wickets'. Not to mention propping up a West Indian team still wet behind the ears.

Howe_zat · 24-10-2012, 04:14 PM

Dravid perhaps?

Monk · 24-10-2012, 04:36 PM

I know it's popular to leave Bradman out, but surely you'd have him in an adversity XI, because the **** never failed.

watson · 24-10-2012, 04:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monk

I know it's popular to leave Bradman out, but surely you'd have him in an adversity XI, because the **** never failed.

Headley's record on bad wickets where the team score is low is significantly better than Bradman's. In other words, Bradman was not overly proficient in rescueing his team when the conditions were bad, and the batting order had subsequently collapsed.

I'll try and find the analysis.

watson · 24-10-2012, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Howe_zat

Dravid perhaps?

Dravid, NO

......

Even his name sounds boring and uninspiring.

kyear2 · 24-10-2012, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watson

What about George Headley? One of the best with regards to 'sticky wickets'. Not to mention propping up a West Indian team still wet behind the ears.

+1

I personally belive that Headley is one of the top 5 batsmen of All Time and on par with Sobers/Viv.

kyear2 · 24-10-2012, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watson

Since Barry Richards is in the team then we may as well re-establish the Richards-Pollock partnership to see if they can go one better than their famous Durban knock. Also, Knott is in the side for Tallon because he's just as good at keeping but can bat.

01. Jack Hobbs
02. Barry Richards
03. Don Bradman
04. Graeme Pollock
05. Keith Miller*
06. Garfield Sobers
07. Mike Procter
08. Alan Knott †
09. Alan Davidson
10. Shane Warnie
11. Malcolm Marshall

Ah, that's better. Order in the Universe restored.

This new trend of playing Miller in the top order of an All Time XI over Tendulkar, Richards, Headley, Hammond and Lara is bordering on rediculous, and that is even before he is placed ahead of Sobers in the batting order. He is not a World Class or even top class batsman, whats the deal?

Prince EWS · 24-10-2012, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LongHopCassidy

Must say I agree. Take away his bowling and he's still IMO the second best batsman of all time.

Yeah I'm not big on Sobers's bowling either and I rate Imran a better overall cricketer, but even just on batting alone he surely has to get a gig. The fact that he could bowl a bit is just a handy aside that means you can just pick the six best batsmen (of which he is unquestionably apart) and not have to worry about picking an a mix-and-match allrounder for balance.

Monk · 24-10-2012, 07:53 PM

Here's mine today.....

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Geoff Boycott
3. Don Bradman
4. George Headley
5. Viv Richards
6. Garry Sobers
7. Allan Knott
8. Wasim Akram
9. Malcolm Marshall
10. Shane Warne
11. Dennis Lillee

Jager · 24-10-2012, 08:33 PM

Partnerships XI
Jack Hobbs
Herbert Sutcliffe
Don Bradman
Everton Weekes
Keith Miller
Clyde Walcott
Frank Worrell
Ray Lindwall
Shane Warne
Sonny Ramadhin
Glenn McGrath

Jager · 24-10-2012, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by watson

Since Barry Richards is in the team then we may as well re-establish the Richards-Pollock partnership to see if they can go one better than their famous Durban knock. Also, Knott is in the side for Tallon because he's just as good at keeping but can bat.

01. Jack Hobbs
02. Barry Richards
03. Don Bradman
04. Graeme Pollock
05. Keith Miller*
06. Garfield Sobers
07. Mike Procter
08. Alan Knott †
09. Alan Davidson
10. Shane Warnie
11. Malcolm Marshall

Ah, that's better. Order in the Universe restored.

FATB for that side! Pretty colours. Would definitely put Tallon in though if I was only allowed one change.

Prince EWS · 24-10-2012, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jager

FATB for that side!

Monk · 24-10-2012, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jager

Partnerships XI
Jack Hobbs
Herbert Sutcliffe
Don Bradman
Everton Weekes
Keith Miller
Clyde Walcott
Frank Worrell
Ray Lindwall
Shane Warne
Sonny Ramadhin
Glenn McGrath

Slightly different take on the partnerships XI....

Jack Hobbs
Herb Sutcliffe
Don Bradman
Arthur Morris
Kumar Sangakkara*
Mahela Jayawardene
Keith Miller
Ray Lindwall
Dennis Lillee
Jeff Thomson
Bishen Bedi
12th- Chandresaker (sp)

24-10-2012, 03:24 PM	#917 (permalink)
LongHopCassidy International Captain Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: www.edcowan.com Posts: 5,062	I'm going to go ahead and pick an XI that succeeded routinely in crap conditions (top-class bowling/batting attacks, performance pressure, bad wickets relative to their role): Presenting the Adversity XI: 1. G Boycott (very low standard deviation from his Test average of 48, superb record against Windies) 2. L Hutton (played a ridiculous amount of tremendous innings on sticky wickets) 3. RN Harvey (see Hutton) 4. AR Border (duh) 5. SR Waugh* (away average is almost 9 runs higher than his home record) 6. A Flower+ (held an entire minnow nation together for a decade) 7. N Kapil Dev (played half of matches on dustbowls) 8. H Verity (bowled on 1930s decks against the likes of Bradman, Ponsford and McCabe) 9. Wasim Akram (record even better than Kapil's on arguably even flatter home decks) 10. DK Lillee (recovery from injury and reinvention of self as a bowler) 11. GD McGrath (no outlier performance against any particular Test nation) Honourable mentions go to Gavaskar, Headley, Glenn Turner, Chanderpaul, Hadlee and Imran. Last edited by LongHopCassidy; 24-10-2012 at 03:36 PM.

24-10-2012, 08:33 PM	#927 (permalink)
Jager International Debutant Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: The land of Siddle Posts: 2,876	Partnerships XI Jack Hobbs Herbert Sutcliffe Don Bradman Everton Weekes Keith Miller Clyde Walcott Frank Worrell Ray Lindwall Shane Warne Sonny Ramadhin Glenn McGrath __________________ Oh for a strong arm and a walking stick

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24-10-2012, 04:14 PM	#919 (permalink)
Howe_zat International Coach Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Top floor, bottom buzzer Posts: 13,881	Dravid perhaps?

24-10-2012, 04:36 PM	#920 (permalink)
Monk International Debutant Join Date: May 2012 Location: Australia Posts: 2,578	I know it's popular to leave Bradman out, but surely you'd have him in an adversity XI, because the **** never failed.

24-10-2012, 07:53 PM	#926 (permalink)
Monk International Debutant Join Date: May 2012 Location: Australia Posts: 2,578	Here's mine today..... 1. Jack Hobbs 2. Geoff Boycott 3. Don Bradman 4. George Headley 5. Viv Richards 6. Garry Sobers 7. Allan Knott 8. Wasim Akram 9. Malcolm Marshall 10. Shane Warne 11. Dennis Lillee

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