The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

[watson]

If you can fit 5 real bowlers into the team while protecting the batting at the same time then why not?

Mark Waugh: Obviously a great bat but makes it into the team because of his superb fielding, and handy bowling if need be.

AB De Villiers: ODI average of 51, SR of 96, and great World Cup stats to match.

MS Dhoni's: The inclusion of Waugh squeezes out Gilchrist, so Dhoni is at No.6.

Kapil Dev: Easily a Top 10 ODI bowler from the 80s, as well as a proven No.7 hitter, so can't leave him out.

Shaun Pollock: Bowling figures close to the likes of McGrath, but can also bat. An ER of just 3.61 during 31 World Cup games is awesome for his era. An obvious big time player.

Richard Hadlee: The nearest bowler to Joel Garner during the 80s, plus he can also bat.

Saqlain Mushtaq: Almost as good as Murali, but bowled his doosra in a less controversial way. The best ODI spinner during the 90s, and comfortably ahead of Warne.

Tendulkar, Ponting, Richards, and Garner all pick themselves.

01. Mark Waugh
02. Sachin Tendulkar
03. Ricky Ponting
04. Viv Richards
05. AB De Villiers
06. MS Dhoni
07. Kapil Dev
08. Shaun Pollock
09. Richard Hadlee
10. Saqlain Mushtaq
11. Joel Garner

 

[watson]

And an Old Timers team to challenge the above team. Not sure who would win a series really.

01. Conrad Hunte
02. Victor Trumper
03. Donald Bradman
04. Neil Harvey
05. Ted Dexter
06. Denis Lindsay
07. Keith Miller
08. Alan Davidson
09. Ray Lindwall
10. Hedley Verity
11. Bill O'Reilly

 

[Saint Kopite]

No Azhar, SK! No. No. Noooooo.

Then, it has to be Viru opening the batting with everyone dropping one place down

 

[Saint Kopite]

All Time ODI XI:-

01. Adam Gilchrist. (+)
02. Sachin Tendulkar.
03. Ricky Ponting. (*)
04. Viv Richards.
05. Michael Bevan.
06. AB De Villiers.
07. Lance Klusener.
08. Wasim Akram.
09. Muttiah Muralitharan.
10. Joel Garner.
11. Glenn McGrath.

Had a tough time choosing between Kapil and Zulu. Kapil was a premier bowler but he ain't sharing the new ball with Garner, McGrath and Wasim at helm. Zulu though was a very good death over bowler with his blockholes and off-cutters. Another tricky part was the number six position. I was very tempted to include Symonds, especially due to his amazing fielding and handy bowling but went with AB because he was a more complete batsman and not that far off Symonds as a fielder. Seriously though, on another day I might choose Symonds instead of AB.

 

[harsh.ag]

Which six batsmen would you like to have in the side when chasing, say, a 300+ total in the 4th innings? Perhaps different answers for the sub-continent and elsewhere.

 

[OverratedSanity]

I think we've reached the point where Dhoni should be a mandatory selection. Has done enough to be up there with Viv and Tendulkar as the 3 greatest ODI bats.

 

[ankitj]

^ Or at least 4, Bevan included.

Only thing with Dhoni is that I want him to bat higher. He should have been batting at 5 all these years. He should not give himself the role of lower order batsman just because he is a wicketkeeper. In the current team, he can even bat at #4.

 

[Prince EWS]

^ Or at least 4, Bevan included.

Only thing with Dhoni is that I want him to bat higher. He should have been batting at 5 all these years. He should not give himself the role of lower order batsman just because he is a wicketkeeper. In the current team, he can even bat at #4.

I think #5 would be a really good spot for him, but I think #4 might be a bridge too far in some conditions. He'd be India's second best OD #4 option after Kohli right now, but I think he'd deliver more a spot lower.

 

[Pratters]

All Time ODI XI:-

01. Adam Gilchrist. (+)
02. Sachin Tendulkar.
03. Ricky Ponting. (*)
04. Viv Richards.
05. Michael Bevan.
06. AB De Villiers.
07. Lance Klusener.
08. Wasim Akram.
09. Muttiah Muralitharan.
10. Joel Garner.
11. Glenn McGrath.

Had a tough time choosing between Kapil and Zulu. Kapil was a premier bowler but he ain't sharing the new ball with Garner, McGrath and Wasim at helm. Zulu though was a very good death over bowler with his blockholes and off-cutters. Another tricky part was the number six position. I was very tempted to include Symonds, especially due to his amazing fielding and handy bowling but went with AB because he was a more complete batsman and not that far off Symonds as a fielder. Seriously though, on another day I might choose Symonds instead of AB.

Great team. AB far more reliable than Symonds.

 

[Red]

Which six batsmen would you like to have in the side when chasing, say, a 300+ total in the 4th innings? Perhaps different answers for the sub-continent and elsewhere.

Boycott
Gavaskar
Bradman
G.Chappell
Miandad
M.Hussey

 

[ankitj]

^ How about Graeme Smith in place of Boycott?

 

[Red]

Why?

 

[bagapath]

All Time ODI XI:-

01. Adam Gilchrist. (+)
02. Sachin Tendulkar.
03. Ricky Ponting. (*)
04. Viv Richards.
05. Michael Bevan.
06. AB De Villiers.
07. Lance Klusener.
08. Wasim Akram.
09. Muttiah Muralitharan.
10. Joel Garner.
11. Glenn McGrath.

To play with them...

Hayden
Jayasuriya
Kohli
Hussey
Symonds
Dhoni (wk)
Kapil
S. Pollock
Warne
Waqar
Donald

 

[ankitj]

Why?

Smith has a superb 4th innings record. Averages 52 with 4 hundreds. Boycott isn't shabby either now that I looked it up.

 

[OverratedSanity]

Smith is actually the first guy I'd pick for a 4th innings chase.

 

[Prince EWS]

Smith is actually the first guy I'd pick for a 4th innings chase.

I'd pick Bradman tbh.

 

[anil1405]

To play with them...

Hayden
Jayasuriya
Kohli
Hussey
Symonds
Dhoni (wk)
Kapil
S. Pollock
Warne
Waqar
Donald

I'd probably have same team except Deano in for Symonds.

 

[watson]

Boycott
Gavaskar
Bradman
G.Chappell
Miandad
M.Hussey

So many people wonder who has made the most runs, most century and who averages the best in last innings of a test match when the batting is the toughest so here's are few lists to set the record straight.

Most runs in 4th innings of test match

1515 runs = Sachin Tendulkar (Ind), 3 century, 7 fifty, 39.86 average.
1507 runs = Rahul Dravid (India), 1 century, 9 fifty, 42.80 average.
1440 runs = Brian Lara (WI), 2 century, 7 fifty, 35.12 average.
1406 runs = Shiv Chanderpual (WI), 2 century, 10 fifty, 44.00 average.
1398 runs = Sunil Gavaskar (Ind), 4 century, 8 fifty, 58.25 average.
1383 runs = Gordon Greenidge (WI), 3 century, 6 fifty, 53.19 average.
1675 runs = Michael Atherton (Eng), 2 century, 9 fifty, 41.66 average.
1362 runs = Ricky Ponting (Aus), 4 century, 5 fifty, 54.48 average.
1322 runs = Graeme Smith (SA), 3 century, 8 fifty, 52.88 average.
1287 runs = Mathew Hayden (Aus), 1 century, 9 fifty, 49.50 average.

The record of most century in 4th innings of a test match is 4 centuries, held jointly by Younis Khan of Pakistan, Ramnaresh Sarwan of West Indies, Ricky Ponting of Australia and Sunil Gavaskar of India. If we talk the best average in 4th innings, Don Bradman made 73.40 runs per innings while Geoff Boycott made 58.76, Sunil Gavaskar made 58.25 whereas Younis Khan makes 57.57 runs.

Who has scored most runs in fourth innings of test cricket? - Its Only Cricket.

Based on those volume of runs and/or averages I'd go;

01. Sunil Gavaskar
02. Gordon Greenidge
03. Don Bradman
04. Brian Lara
05. Ricky Ponting

Boycott unlucky to miss-out, but if both Gavaskar and Boycott opened then the run chase is too likely to get bogged down. Lara gets the nod because he played probably the greatest 4th innings of all time - 153* against Australia, 1999.

If each of those 5 batsman hits their 4th innings average (at least) then the total would be 274 runs. The remaining 6 batsman should be able to scrape together the remaining 26 required runs for victory.

Note: Special mention to Michael Atherton - to average 42 in the 4th innings against McGrath, Warne, Ambrose, Wasim, Waqar, Donald etc etc is a great effort. WAG.

 

[Red]

Smith is actually the first guy I'd pick for a 4th innings chase.

Both Sunny and Boycs have better 4th innings records....

 

[Red]

Boycott unlucky to miss-out, but if both Gavaskar and Boycott opened then the run chase is too likely to get bogged down.

Maybe, but Sunny could move things along, and I don't think Boycs was that slow. I'd basically want the two guys opening who are most likely to get me to 0/100.