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Thread: The ATG Teams General arguing/discussing thread

  1. #2071
    Hall of Fame Member NUFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watson View Post
    Not sure who should bat at No.3 for your second XI really
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  2. #2072
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NUFAN View Post
    Michael Slater is a worthy contender to make one of the 3 best teams of the 80s and 90s. I definitely think that their were periods throughout his career where he was the best opener in the world and one of the most enjoyable batsman to watch too.
    Slater was a fabulous batsman but there is a principle which says that you shouldn't play a batsman out of his natural position. Slater was an opener not a No.3.

    So here are some true No.3 batsman who averaged the highest in that position, and who played a reasonable number of Tests during the 80's and 90s;

    Blogs: Batsmen with highest averages at each position in Tests | Cricket Blogs | ESPN Cricinfo

    Viv Richards (61.54)
    Brian Lara (60.47)
    David Gower (49.42)
    Mohinda Armanath (47.66)
    Stephen Fleming (47.25)
    Richie Richardson (47.11)
    Last edited by watson; 21-05-2013 at 07:08 PM.

  3. #2073
    Hall of Fame Member NUFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watson View Post
    Slater was a fabulous batsman but there is a principle which says that you shouldn't play a batsman out of his natural position. Slater was an opener not a No.3.

    So here are some true No.3 batsman who averaged the highest in that position, and who played a reasonable number of Tests during the 80's and 90s;

    Blogs: Batsmen with highest averages at each position in Tests | Cricket Blogs | ESPN Cricinfo

    Viv Richards (61.54)
    Brian Lara (60.47)
    David Gower (49.42)
    Mohinda Armanath (47.66)
    Stephen Fleming (47.25)
    Richie Richardson (47.11)
    Cool story. Please read my post.

  4. #2074
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    Quote Originally Posted by NUFAN View Post
    Michael Slater is a worthy contender to make one of the 3 best teams of the 80s and 90s. I definitely think that their were periods throughout his career where he was the best opener in the world and one of the most enjoyable batsman to watch too.
    You mean this one and this bit?


  5. #2075
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NUFAN View Post
    Cool story. Please read my post.
    Got mislead by your post with the big arrow in it. I was talking about No.3 batsman so I thought that you were too.

    Anyway, even though David Boon averaged 'only' 40 at No.3 I think he's possibly a better option for those Second/third XIs than those formentioned players. After all, he is a true 80s-90s batsman, and probably had it tougher than anyone because of 2 tours of the West Indies and Pakistan etc etc.
    Last edited by watson; 21-05-2013 at 09:26 PM.

  6. #2076
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by watson View Post
    Got mislead by your post with the big arrow in it. I was talking about No.3 batsman so I thought that you were too.

    Anyway, even though David Boon averaged 'only' 40 at No.3 I think he's possibly a better option for those Second/third XIs than those formentioned players as he is a true 80s-90s batsman, and probably had it toughest because of 2 tours of the West Indies and Pakistan etc etc.
    Boon batted in the toughest position in cricket during the era of the most brutal and skilful pace bowling ever. Brilliant batsman.

    I'd imagine Boon'd average much higher than he did if he played in a different era.

  7. #2077
    Hall of Fame Member NUFAN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the big bambino View Post
    You mean this one and this bit?
    Correct. Also the fact that I said Slater was the best opener in the world at a time, makes NUFAN go something something when he gets someone trying to explain to him that he isn't a number 3 bat.

    Quote Originally Posted by watson View Post
    Got mislead by your post with the big arrow in it. I was talking about No.3 batsman so I thought that you were too.

    Anyway, even though David Boon averaged 'only' 40 at No.3 I think he's possibly a better option for those Second/third XIs than those formentioned players. After all, he is a true 80s-90s batsman, and probably had it tougher than anyone because of 2 tours of the West Indies and Pakistan etc etc.
    I made two different posts. One about Slater being in the first 3 teams as an opening batsman and I then quoted you suggesting that Boon is a good alternative for the number 3 spot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    Boon batted in the toughest position in cricket during the era of the most brutal and skilful pace bowling ever. Brilliant batsman.

    I'd imagine Boon'd average much higher than he did if he played in a different era.
    Boon'd

  8. #2078
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    I have it on good authority that every time Boonie made a ton, he'd snarl to the opposition "You've been Boon'd".

    Apparently he says it to his wife some nights also.

  9. #2079
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    lol
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  10. #2080
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    Pre WWII XI
    Hobbs
    Sutcliffe
    Bradman*
    Headley
    Hammond
    Ames+
    Faulkner
    Gregory
    Grimmett
    Larwood
    Barnes

    Yes, no O'Reilly. I think Grimmett would complement Barnes far better, but thats me. Sure I could squeeze him in somehow.
    ATG World XI
    1. J.B Hobbs 2. H. Sutcliffe 3. D.G Bradman 4. W.R Hammond 5. G.S Sobers 6. M.J Procter 7. A.C Gilchrist 8. M.D Marshall 9. S.K Warne 10. M. Muralitharan 11. G.D McGrath

  11. #2081
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coronis View Post
    Pre WWII XI
    Hobbs
    Sutcliffe
    Bradman*
    Headley
    Hammond
    Ames+
    Faulkner
    Gregory
    Grimmett
    Larwood
    Barnes

    Yes, no O'Reilly. I think Grimmett would complement Barnes far better, but thats me. Sure I could squeeze him in somehow.
    Not a great fan of Ames' batting as he struggled somewhat against Australia as far as I can tell. Faulkner more solid at No.6 I think.

  12. #2082
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    Quote Originally Posted by watson View Post
    OK, swapping Healy and Imran around in the batting order. Dujon is tempting, but Healy and Warne are a pretty legendary partnership.

    Can't see Waqar being superior to Imran, Hadlee, Marshall, or Ambrose; unless you take a short window of about 2 years when he was in his pomp.

    Best of the 80s and 90s
    01. Sunil Gavaskar
    02. Gordon Greenidge
    03. Viv Richards
    04. Sachin Tendulkar
    05. Brian Lara
    06. Steve Waugh
    07. Imran Khan
    08. Ian Healy
    09. Richard Hadlee
    10. Malcolm Marshall
    11. Shane Warne
    Would bat Lara at 4 and Sachin at 5 just to cushion in the left hander between the right handers..
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    Quote Originally Posted by vic_orthdox View Post
    In the end, I think it's so utterly, incomprehensibly boring. There is so much context behind each innings of cricket that dissecting statistics into these small samples is just worthless. No-one has ever been faced with the same situation in which they come out to bat as someone else. Ever.
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  13. #2083
    International Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    fixers XI

    salman butt
    herschelle gibbs
    mohammad azharuddin
    salim mailk (c)
    hansie cronje
    ajay jadeja
    kamran akmal (wk)
    ajay sharma
    mohammad amir
    mohammad asif
    santhakumaran sreesanth

    reserves: kapil dev, shane warne, mark waugh, wasim akram, waqar younis

    it will be impossible to lose to this team. each and every time, someone would have taken cash to underperform for sure. all the shirt pulling, looking at the sky, tapping, tying/ untying of shoe laces and towel in pocket gestures would keep all sorts of bookies around the globe super busy throughout the game.

  14. #2084
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    What would a peak XI look like? Haven't looked too much into it, but Botham, Ponting and Waqar are all names that come to mind. Anyone care to have a go at compiling one?

  15. #2085
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coronis View Post
    What would a peak XI look like? Haven't looked too much into it, but Botham, Ponting and Waqar are all names that come to mind. Anyone care to have a go at compiling one?
    I've fiddled around with some stats on this before and I think one of the great under-rated batting peaks is that of Steve Waugh.

    A Batsman's 'Prime'
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    Rejecting 'analysis by checklist' and 'skill absolutism' since December 2009



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