Best XI of each decade

[AndyZaltzHair]

Good job AZH, though it speaks volumes about the quicks of the '80's that Border (though great) was the best bat of the decade.

Bowlers list next Andy?

Cheers kyear

Taking a shot at pace department

Best bowler by decades (pace)

1880s : Fred Spofforth
1890s : T Richardson
1900s : S F Barnes
1910s : S F Barnes
1920s : Harold Larwood
1930s : Harold Larwood
1940s : Ray Lindwall
1950s : Fred Trueman
1960s : Fred Trueman
1970s : Dennis Lillee
1980s : Malcolm Marshall
1990s : Curtly Ambrose
2000s : Glenn McGrath

Controversial list I suppose

 

[MrPrez]

2010-2019

Cook
Chandimal
Amla
de Villiers (C)
Bairstow
Kohli
de Kock (wk)
Ashwin
Steyn
Topley
Cummins

 

[fredfertang]

Cheers kyear

Taking a shot at pace department

Best bowler by decades (pace)

1880s : Fred Spofforth
1890s : T Richardson
1900s : S F Barnes
1910s : S F Barnes
1920s : Harold Larwood
1930s : Harold Larwood
1940s : Ray Lindwall
1950s : Fred Trueman
1960s : Fred Trueman
1970s : Dennis Lillee
1980s : Malcolm Marshall
1990s : Curtly Ambrose
2000s : Glenn McGrath

Controversial list I suppose

I'd be inclined to suggest Wes Hall or Mike Procter for the 1960s, but that apart can't really disagree with any of that.

 

[kyear2]

If it were bowlers overall would it be then

1930's : Bill O'Reilly
1950's : Jim Laker ?/ Ray Lindwall
2000's : Shane Warne

 

[watson]

If it were bowlers overall would it be then

1930's : Bill O'Reilly
1950's : Jim Laker ?/ Ray Lindwall
2000's : Shane Warne

Yes, the McGrath V Warne debate is an interesting one. Warne is probably the greater bowler because he changed the nature of the game after the 70s-80s - that is, spin bowling became central to a bowling attack once more after 20 years.

However, the following pie charts do tell an interesting story with respect to Pace V Spin;

McGrath;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

Gillespie;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

Lee;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

Warne;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

Laker;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

Muralitharan;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph

O'Reilly;
HowSTAT! Wickets by Batting Order Graph


So, it doesn't matter how great the spin bowler is, only a quarter of his wickets are top order batsman.

Significantly, out of the bowlers listed Warne has the largest disparity between Top Order Wickets and Tail End Wickets: Top Order = 23% Tail-End = 37%.

On-the-other-hand, McGrath's figures are almost the inverse: Top Order: 40% Tail End: 25%

If we consider that it is more important, and more difficult, to remove Top Order batsman then Pace bowlers are worth more to the team than Spin bowlers by definition.

Therefore, McGrath is the 'best' of his decade, although Warne is probably the greater bowler because he 'changed the game.'

 

[watson]

I'd be inclined to suggest Wes Hall or Mike Procter for the 1960s, but that apart can't really disagree with any of that.

I agree somewhat. Fred was possibly (??) past his prime in the 1960s, although still a very good bowler.

Wes Hall does spring to mind too, but I think that John Snow (1965-76) also deserves an honourable mention.

As for Proctor, well we find ourselves back at that annoying argument - did he play enough Test matches to justify his place among the elite?

 

[kyear2]

For this exercise dont think that Procter can qualify. Just didn't play long enough.

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

On basis of wicket taking McKenzie was ahead than everyone in 60s i.e. total tally of around 245 wickets but his strike rate was on the most higher side above 71. Then Trueman with SR of 49. Afterwards Pollock, Snow and Hall with strike rates running fairly close. Snow debuted in 65 and one of his best performance i.e. 7/40 vs Aus came in 70-71 season.

We are left with Trueman, Pollock, Hall and Procter. If we all agree that Trueman was past his prime and Procter as he debuted 67 both out of contention, that leaves us with Hall and Pollock as true contenders.

 

[Jager]

I'd give it to Procter myself - man was a genius

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

I'd give it to Procter myself - man was a genius

Always wondered how he generated so much pace with the bowling action he had

What a spell.
Mike Procter 6/13 vs Hampshire 1977 B+H Cup - YouTube

 

[fredfertang]

I'd give it to Procter myself - man was a genius

I agree - I think Procter did enough

 

[Jager]

Always wondered how he generated so much pace with the bowling action he had

What a spell.
Mike Procter 6/13 vs Hampshire 1977 B+H Cup - YouTube

Amazing how he can bowl around the wicket and still collect LBW/bowled dismissals! He took some very highly prized wickets there too, although Barry Richards has always said that he hit the ball that got him - probably the one of the only men who could have, alongside Sobers and Bradman

 

[kyear2]

Who was narating that piece?

 

[fredfertang]

Who was narating that piece?

Brian Johnston

 

[Biryani Pillow]

1890-1899:

Andrew Stoddart
Tom Hayward
Ranjitsinhji
Clem Hill
Joe Darling
The Hon F.S.Jackson
Jack Kelly
Hugh Trumble
George Lohmann
J.T.Hearne
Tom Richardson

Some sparkling batsmen and a fine bowling attack.

1900-1909

Victor Trumper
Jack Hobbs
John Tydesley
Clem Hill
The Hon. F.S.Jackson
Monty Noble
Wilfred Rhodes
Aubrey Faulkner
Dick Lilley
Sydney Barnes
John Barton King

A batting line up full of players great in a tough situation and dangerous when on top. A bowling side to pose all kinds of problems - King was the first notable swing bowler, but American,


1920-1929:

Jack Hobbs
Bill Ponsford
Charlie McCartney
Walter Hammond
Alan Kippax
H.B.Cameron
Jack Gregory
Maurice Tate
Harold Larwood
Clarrie Grimmett
Ted MacDonald

Might be a bit weak in the lower middle order but a great pace attack.

1930-1939:
George Headley
Herbert Sutcliffe
Don Bradman
Walter Hammond
Maurice Leyland
Les Ames
Learie Constantine
Mohammed Nissar
Harold Larwood
Hedley Verity
Bill O'Reilly

Frightening top 5, interesting pace attack bt the spinners would cause a ton of problems.

1940-1949:

Len Hutton
George Headley
Don Bradman
Denis Compton
Everton Weekes
Keith Miller
Godfrey Evans
Ray Lindwall
Alec Bedser
Jim Laker
Doug Wright

The bowling drops off quickly but the main 4 are pretty useful.

1950-1959:

Len Hutton
Hanif Mohammed
Peter May
Neil Harvey
Clyde Walcott
Gary Sobers
Vinoo Mankad
Godfrey Evans
Frank Tyson
Brian Statham
Sonny Ramadhin

Tough openers, powerful middle order, fierce pace attack and very good spinners. And no, I'm not a Trueman fan. Too much of a self publicist and too many I've known who saw his career reckon he was nowhere near as good as he claimed.

1960-1969

Conrad Hunte
Bob Simpson
Rohan Kanhai
Graeme Pollock
Ken Barrington
Gary Sobers
Mike Procter
Alan Knott
Richie Benaud
Derek Underwood
Wes Hall

Barry Richards only had one series otherwise he'd likely be in (ok, Benaud only had 2 but they were good ones). Deep batting and a fine bowling attack.

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

And no, I'm not a Trueman fan. Too much of a self publicist and too many I've known who saw his career reckon he was nowhere near as good as he claimed.

Not surprising though from a bowler who had a strike rate of 49 and maintained that over his career with an average of 21.57 claiming himself one of the best. On the contrary, many claimed him one of the best for example John Arlott- "T'Greatest Fast Bowler Who Ever Drew Breath."

If he's a self publicist, then that's an off field issue and imo shouldn't be the deciding factor nominating the best performer across decades.

 

[kyear2]

His stats were greatly aided by all three of the minnows of his day.

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

Trueman against Australia, SR 55.2 with five 5 fers

against West Indies even better, SR 53.6 with 6 five fers

against SA, SR 47.8

Trueman got Frank Worrell- 9 times
Rohan Kanhai- 9 times
Neil Harvey- 8 times
Garry Sobers, Bob Simpson and Bill Lawry- 7 times each

It's true his average gets a boost as he performed exceptionally against India, New Zealand and Pakistan but those stats above speaks volumes about the ability of the man

 

[kyear2]

Never said he wasn't a ATG.

Why is it that May is seen as better than Sir Everton Weekes in the 50's. Weekes was the better batsman.

 

[AndyZaltzHair]

Why is it that May is seen as better than Sir Everton Weekes in the 50's. Weekes was the better batsman.

I think it has to do more with valuable factor. If we compare Weekes' scores to May's as which had more impact and contributed more to the team's winnings, May edges Weekes.

Some of the tons made by Weekes were somewhat overshadowed by other two Ws, Worrell and Walcott's contribution too or resulted in a drawn match.

For example,

Weekes 129 vs Eng, Worrell scored 261
Weekes 139 vs Aus, Walcott scored a century too
Weekes 206 vs Eng, Worrell scored 167 and Walcott scored a century too. Weekes played a valuable role in the series to give WI 3-1 against Trueman, Statham and Laker scoring 90* and 94 with that double ton. After he hit three centuries against NZ in 1956, his form declined.

On the other hand, May was reaching his prime in 1954. Under Hutton, May played a major role in retaining Ashes facing Lindwall and Davidson. In 1955, May had a great series against South Africa scoring 112, 117 against Adcock, Heine and Tayfield. Then against Australia in 1956, his average was around 90 on tough pitches.

Weekes and May run very close but I think for the quality of scores and match winning contributions, May just edges Weekes for 1950s season.