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New Zealand doom and gloom thread

Athlai

Athlai

Not Terrible
WindieWeathers said:
Couldn't it be argued that England were there for the taking considering they'd lost badly in Barbados, had no permanent head coach in place and also the whole "KP" thing hanging over the whole squad? NZ were great in spells but i get the feeling they never truly believed they could win the game, hence they let England off the hook time and time again until England finally took full advantage.

That's just my opinion.
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Yes they were and they were obviously rattled in the first hour. And then on the back of some immense batting from Root and Stokes they didn't let New Zealand dictate the game. And then Broad and to a lesser extent Wood did the same with the ball. And then Cook rose up to push England ahead, and then Broad knocked us down.

If England allowed us to push them over we would have and while they shook they ended up standing tall.
 
OverratedSanity

OverratedSanity

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Athlai said:
Na that wasn't doom and gloom, that was cricket. Good teams don't just hand you victories, England won out some key moments to get ahead in a game that we had almost taken control of. We should be applauding them not grumbling about ourselves*

*except Craig, #bringbackJeets
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You can do both though. Definitely feel NZ should be kicking themselves for the way they batted in the first innings and how Watling didn't get enough support. As well as England played, I think NZ did in some stages of the match contribute to their own loss.
 
Athlai

Athlai

Not Terrible
OverratedSanity said:
You can do both though. Definitely feel NZ should be kicking themselves for the way they batted in the first innings and how Watling didn't get enough support. As well as England played, I think NZ did in some stages of the match contribute to their own loss.
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I'm all for criticism, but this is the "doom and gloom" thread.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

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OverratedSanity said:
You can do both though. Definitely feel NZ should be kicking themselves for the way they batted in the first innings and how Watling didn't get enough support. As well as England played, I think NZ did in some stages of the match contribute to their own loss.
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Absolutely 100% right. To deny that is just being blind.

England were good & came at us hard in the last two days in particular, but unfortunately, we just didn't respond. I thought we were extremely poor on day 4 the way we bowled to Cook. Felt we played right into his hands by bowling too short or on his pads. All this when we had a massive lead. We need to be more patient with him at Headingley.
 
Athlai

Athlai

Not Terrible
Zinzan said:
Absolutely 100% right. To deny that is just being blind.

England were good & came at us hard in the last two days in particular, but unfortunately, we just didn't respond. I thought we were extremely poor on day 4 the way we bowled to Cook. Felt we played right into his hands by bowling too short or on his pads. All this when we had a massive lead. We need to be more patient with him at Headingley.
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Yeah, thats not what I was saying at all. Doom and gloom this is not.
 
Zinzan

Zinzan

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Athlai said:
Yeah, thats not what I was saying at all. Doom and gloom this is not.
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Who said you were saying anything? I was responding to overratedSanity's point that absolutely NZ contributed to their own loss especially over the last 2 days.
 
NZTailender

NZTailender

I can't believe I ate the whole thing
SACK THEM ALL

ANDREW ELLIS FOR CAPTAIN

SIDDONS FOR COACH

OPEN THE BOWLING AND BATTING WITH DEVCICH

etcetc
 
Flem274*

Flem274*

123/5
Just some boring thoughts for you.

This year is pudding year. NZ have shown they can win series a good side is expected to win - West Indies home and away, India on our own turf, Sri Lanka on our own turf etc. Even poor New Zealand teams have made life very difficult and rarely lost to some classy Indian and Sri Lankan sides when they tour here.

The only exception was the Pakistan series. They dealt with Australia and I've just been reminded of what they did to England a few years ago. The UAE is about as alien to New Zealand conditions as you can get. We got smashed in the first, almost won the second and then got them in the third.

That's the result that sticks out to me as being the best case for NZ being good rather than decent. That was a really really good win. That case needs that test too because NZ has had some speed wobbles - dropping a test to West Indies (can happen, they can seriously bowl, and play in general when they click) and our stupid first day green top obsession required Herculean efforts from McCullum, Williamson and Watling (twice!) to fend off embarrassing losses to crappy pace attacks.

This year we have England in England, Sri Lanka come back and then Aussie home and away. This year will be much much harder. We fell short in and deserved to lose the first test last week because we had numerous opportunities to kick England in the ribs when they were on the ground but we didn't.

There are lots of little things that need to happen for us to be right up there

1. Opener. Obvious.
2. Some batsmen need to be less horrible starters. Guptill, Taylor, Baz, Anderson, Neesh and Watling are all more dubious than most early on.
3. It's nice we have a spinner who can win matches, but more consistency from Craig is needed. When he's not playing winning hands we need him to be economical.
4. We need to settle the third seamer argument.
5. We need Southee back at his best.
6. Baz will go too soon. We don't have any Baz's, Kane's or Ross's running around the Shield so we need someone to step up and improve like Rigor/Styris/Astle/Watling did.
7. No more green tops that are only green for the first day. The toss shouldn't all but decide the match barring the intervention of BJ Watling and A.N. Other.
 
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