kyear2's definition of an all rounder is slightly different.
Batsman + slip fielder = all rounder (this is his main criteria). Correct me if I am wrong kyear2?
And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW
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As highly as I rate the importance of fielding, it can't be included in the definition of an all-rounder.
The only three areas that contribute to being an AR are batting and bowling or wicketkeeping.
Slip fielding is very important, but doesn't make someone an AR.
Smali seems to be on a roll. Though I believe that being a good slipper adds value to a player and a side and when I do my drafts and A.T. teams I always try to include 3 good slip fielders, contrary to.what Smali I do not consider them to be all rounders.
Now, as England showed today and in the past, it is unwise to go into a test with just your front line bowlers and a legitimate fifth bowler, ala Sobers, Kallis, Weekes, Watson, Waugh ect is often required dor optimum team balance and while a bowling all rounder gives your batting depth (Imran, Hadlee, Broad ect) unless he can consistently bat in the top 6, doesn't offer you that 5th bowler to rest your front line seamers or give you that elusive break through. Miller and Botham were the exceptions as true all rounders, but Botham dropped of drastically and Miller was inconsistent with the bat and often under used with the ball. Hence I rate batting all rounders higher and more important, and additionally if you are relying on your #8 to save you match after match you have bigger problems.
Hence to smali's point, I do find a great batsman whos is great slipper (Lara, Ponting, Weekes) to be almost or just as important to a side as a bowling a/r, a batsman who can bat, bowl a bit and offer me a great slipper (Hammond, McCabe, Kallis, Sobers, Simpson, Chappell ect.) to much more important and crucial to a side than a bowling a/r.
So yes Kallis is to me just behind Sobers, though Imrans captaincy makes it a virtual dead heat.
nb: Not looking for a fight.
Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2
Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4
Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Cameron+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2
Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3
Miller's captaincy > Imran's IMO
But there are 2 big holes in each of kallis and Sobers' AR resumes.
If you are talking about under bowling Kallis has something like 1.8 wickets per match. That is low.
Also Sobers strikes every 15 or 16 overs. Heck even Tendulkar strikes that often in test matches. Also think twice about bowling Sobers against Pakistan. His bowling strike rate is something like 358 or something meaning that he will bowl all day against Pakistan and still won't take a wicket
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Define sustainable. I'd say 4 years or so is a pretty long time for it not be sustainable. Even in the worst recent performances (this Test aside) the 4 man attack was ****ing awesome and the batsmen (who you would want to weaken by removing one) were ****.
so the main usefulness of the batting all rounder is for the main bowlers to take a rest?
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