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Thread: CW Draft League

  1. #76
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    Indeed it is, but even in that period it can be split between batting well and not bowling or bowling well and not batting.

    All time great bowler who could bat 8, yes, but all rounder, no.
    I would tend to agree. Sensational to have at No.7 or 8 depending on the batting ability of the keeper and what the tail is like.
    Last edited by watson; 01-07-2012 at 06:58 PM.
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  2. #77
    International Vice-Captain kyear2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    Indeed it is, but even in that period it can be split between batting well and not bowling or bowling well and not batting.

    All time great bowler who could bat 8, yes, but all rounder, no.
    This.
    Aus. XI
    Simpson^ | Hayden | Bradman | Chappell^ | Ponting | Border* | Gilchrist+ | Davidson3 | Warne4^ | Lillee1 | McGrath2


    W.I. XI
    Greenidge | Hunte | Richards^ | Headley* | Lara^ | Sobers5^ | Walcott+ | Marshall1 | Ambrose2 | Holding3 | Garner4

    S.A. XI
    Richards^ | Smith*^ | Amla | Pollock | Kallis5^ | Nourse | Waite+ | Procter3 | Steyn1 | Tayfield4 | Donald2

    Eng. XI
    Hobbs | Hutton*^ | Hammond^ | Compton | Barrington | Botham5^ | Knott | Trueman1 | Laker4 | Larwood2 | Barnes3

  3. #78
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    Indeed it is, but even in that period it can be split between batting well and not bowling or bowling well and not batting.

    All time great bowler who could bat 8, yes, but all rounder, no.
    That's true, and it's nice to have a guy averaging nearly 40 with the bat at number 7 or 8 in an all time team who is also a strike bowler (avg. 22). He is an all-rounder, a bowling all-rounder. An average of 38 definitely gives him the title. In the ATG team you select him as a bowling all-rounder, as one of your three pace men.

    It's similar to Sobers, who was a batting all-rounder. Sobers bowling average of 34 and SR of 92 would never get him a game as a bowler, but it's primarily as a batsman he gets selected. So he's a batting AR.

    And I'd nearly always have both, along with Gilchrist, providing three highly skilled all-rounders in an ATG team.

  4. #79
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    I guess it comes down to sematics.

    But whatever the definition I'd love to have Imran batting in my side if possible.


  5. #80
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    I've always thought the truly elite TRUE all rounders were the ones with a 30 plus batting average and a sub 30 bowling average.

  6. #81
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Don't know where this Imran hate is coming from, he's on level terms with Miller and perhaps early Botham and that's all.
    Oh for a strong arm and a walking stick

  7. #82
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    I don't think that anyone is hating Imran Khan. There's nothing to 'hate'.

  8. #83
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Hate is the wrong word, you're right. How people saying he isn't an all-rounder though, I have no idea.

  9. #84
    Eyes not spreadsheets marc71178's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monk View Post
    I've always thought the truly elite TRUE all rounders were the ones with a 30 plus batting average and a sub 30 bowling average.
    I don't think career averages can be used as a guide at all.

    By your definition the greatest of them all wouldn't be classed as one.
    marc71178 - President and founding member of AAAS - we don't only appreciate when he does well, but also when he's not quite so good!

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  10. #85
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Cevno timed out.

    That means Blakus, MrPrez and watson are up. Cevno may choose whenever he gets on.


    R1
    kingkallis- Garfield Sobers
    Himannv- Imran Khan
    Marcuss- Adam Gilchrist
    Cabinet96- Keith Miller
    Eds- Malcolm Marshall
    Cevno- Richard Hadlee
    Blakus- Vivian Richards
    MrPrez- Jaques Kallis
    watson- Glenn McGrath
    Jager-
    AndyZaltzHair-
    kyear2-
    Last edited by Jager; 02-07-2012 at 06:31 AM.

  11. #86
    Hall of Fame Member Cevno's Avatar
    Simon Champion!
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    Richard Hadlee

  12. #87
    International Vice-Captain Monk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    I don't think career averages can be used as a guide at all.

    By your definition the greatest of them all wouldn't be classed as one.

    I guess you mean Sobers?

    I see your point, and I classify him as an all-rounder definitely.

    Maybe a batting average of 25 plus and a bowling average of under 35 is a better guide?

    What I mean is that a true all-rounder should be able to gain his place in a team almost on one discipline.


    Would Miller have been selected for Australia as a batsman only OR a bowler only? - yes

    Would Imran have been selected for Pakistan as a batsman only OR a bowler only - I think so

    Would Botham have been selected for England as a batsman only or a bowler only - I think so

    Would Kapil have been selected for India as a batsman only OR a bowler only - likely


    Would Sobers have been selected for WIs as a batsman only OR a bowler only - definitely as a batsman, only possibly as a bowler

    Would Kallis be selected for SA as a batsman only OR a bowler only - definitely as a batsman, only possibly as a bowler

    Would Hadlee be selected for NZ as a batsman only OR a bowler only - definitely as a bowler, only possibly as a batsman




    They are all all-rounders in my mind, but there are different types (obviously).
    Last edited by Monk; 02-07-2012 at 04:10 AM.

  13. #88
    State Vice-Captain MrPrez's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marc71178 View Post
    No, they're not.
    Yeah they really are. Certainly much closer than Bradman and any other batsman.
    @CowsCorner - 202 followers and counting!

    Disclaimer: I am a biased South African. Anything I say is likely to have something in it that ultimately favours the Proteas.

  14. #89
    International Vice-Captain watson's Avatar
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    Good choice by Cervo - a BOWLING ALL-ROUNDER

  15. #90
    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    Good points around Kallis and Hadlee, Monk. Sobers was actually orginially in the team as a left-arm spinner, though!

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