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Thread: Associate Nations' All Time XI

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    State Captain harsh.ag's Avatar
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    Associate Nations' All Time XI

    I was wondering if an Associates' ATXI will be competitive against the full members. So, this endeavor seeks to compose a team from the players of Ireland, Canada, Kenya, Netherlands, Scotland, Afghanistan, Bermuda, UAE... you get the point. Not including East Africa squads of "yore". Also, the pre-test era Bangladesh players qualify, so do the pre-1981 Sri Lankan players, but only the ones who played their entire careers as Associates.

    Secondly, I wanted to make sure this team includes players who truly represent the Associate Nations. For this reason, only the players who were born and brought up in non-test playing nations are eligible in my book. For example, players like Dirk Nannes, Trent Johnston, Tom Cooper, Rizwan Cheema learnt their craft in Australia and Pakistan, in a cricket friendly environment, hence it would not make sense to include them. On the other hand, someone like a Eoin Morgan finds a place because he did it all in Ireland. You may disagree with this approach, and I would welcome your inputs.

    So, this is the team I wound up with:

    Openers
    William Porterfield (Ireland)
    Alexei Kervezee (Netherlands)

    Middle Order
    Ed Joyce (Ireland)
    Eoin Morgan (Ireland)
    Ryan ten Doeschate (Netherlands)
    Steve Tikolo (Kenya)
    Niall o'Brien (w) (Ireland)

    Bowlers
    Thomas Odoyo (Kenya)
    George Dockrell (Ireland)
    Hamid Hassan (Afghanistan)
    William Boyd Rankin (Ireland)

    Ashish Bagai from Canada came really close to getting selected ahead of Niall o'Brien. Couldn't find a place for Kevin though. Do you think he should be in the side? If yes, then ahead of which player? Also, Paul Stirling really comes close to getting selected ahead of Kervezee. Would welcome suggestions for a better opener. As for the bowlers, Nannes and Johnston are ineligible due to my approach, and I left out Botha. Hassan from Afghanistan is a great prospect. Would like to know about better bowlers.

    So, the final list is dominated by the Irish. Seems like a team that could give many test playing nations a run for their money, what say?

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    International Coach uvelocity's Avatar
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    needs more dwayne leverock
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    International Debutant Jager's Avatar
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    But Eoin Morgan didn't play his entire career as an associate. Also, Chubb, rvd and Migara all tried their hands at this over in this thread...

    Best all time XI for each country

    so you might find their teams interesting. Most of your players are currently playing as well, intentional?
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    Cricket Web Staff Member stumpski's Avatar
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    I would try to find room for the Afghan all-rounder Nabi somewhere. Joyce hasn't really done much for Ireland so far has he?

    Also worth pointing out that Scotland and Ireland have both been playing f-c cricket for around 100 years, long enough for each to have their own all-time side. Mike Denness played for Scotland early on IIRC.
    Last edited by stumpski; 09-06-2012 at 06:58 AM.


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    Dan
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    Not so much an All-Time XI as a 'Semi-Current FC Standard Associate Players' XI.
    These are the sides I came up with a couple of days ago:

    Quote Originally Posted by rvd619323 View Post
    Associates XI
    1. Will Porterfield (Ireland)
    2. John Davison (Canada)
    3. Mohammad Shahzad (Afghanistan)
    4. David Hemp (Bermuda)
    5. Ryan ten Doeschate (Netherlands)
    6. Niall O'Brien (Ireland) [+]
    7. Steve Tikolo (Kenya) [c]
    8. Bart King (USA)
    9. Roland Lefebvre (Netherlands)
    10. Hamid Hasan (Afghanistan)
    11. Ole Mortensen (Denmark)


    George Dockrell (Ireland), Boyd Rankin (Ireland), Ashish Bagai (Canada) and Mohammad Nabi (Afghanistan) round out the squad.


    Second XI (Played for Test Nations, born/qualified in non-Full Member Countries.)
    1. Michael di Venuto (Italy & Australia)
    2. Archie Jackson (Scotland & Australia)
    3. Ted Dexter (Italy & England)
    4. George Headley (Panama & West Indies)
    5. Eoin Morgan (Ireland & England)
    6. Mike Denness (Scotland & England) [c]
    7. Geriant Jones (PNG & England) [+]
    8. Gavin Hamilton (Scotland & England)
    9. Tim Murtagh (Ireland & England)1
    10. Dirk Nannes (Netherlands & Australia)
    11. Ian Peebles (Scotland & England)


    Joe Scuderi (Italy & Australia)1, Dougie Brown (Scotland & England), Clayton Lambert (USA & West Indies), Hamish Marshall (Ireland & New Zealand), Ed Joyce (Ireland & England) & Tom Cooper (Netherlands & Australia)1 to sit on the bench.

    1 Cooper, Scuderi and Murtagh all represented their Full-Member nation at U/19 level.
    Both sides would probably be competitive in FC competitions, but wouldn't be likely to regularly trouble full-strength Test sides.

    EDIT: This second side is looking more and more test class by the minute. Especially with the addition of Headley, if he counts.
    Last edited by Dan; 09-06-2012 at 07:41 AM. Reason: Updated to reflect Nannes, Denness & Peebles qualifying. Then Archie Jackson. And then George Headley.
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    Dan
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    Quote Originally Posted by stumpski View Post
    I would try to find room for the Afghan all-rounder Nabi somewhere. Joyce hasn't really done much for Ireland so far has he?

    Also worth pointing out that Scotland and Ireland have both been playing f-c cricket for around 100 years, long enough for each to have their own all-time side. Mike Denness played for Scotland early on IIRC.
    Yep, he was a Scotsman.

    Ian Peebles was also Scottish.

    EDIT: Ted Dexter was born in Italy, Amjad Khan from Denmark, and Graeme Hick came from Rhodesia, before it gained Test status. Archie Jackson was born in Scotland, too.

    EDIT 2: And George Headley was born in Panama. Let's chuck him in the side as well.
    Last edited by Dan; 09-06-2012 at 07:37 AM.

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    International Coach uvelocity's Avatar
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    If it's an associate XI, that should have players from test countries before getting the test status too. And a pre-test status all time SL XI will be competitive against a lower ranked test teams of today. There were few players from Ceylon of nothe worthy.

    Mahadevan Sathasivam, was probably the best batsman played for an associate. He was a belligerent player of both spin and pace, and averaged 40+ against touring test sides.

    Daya Sahabandu was a Underwood esque spinner, and definitely was one of the better spinners of late 50s.

    TB Kehelgamuwa was a lively fast medium bowler, and possibly the quickest bowler to play for an Associate, if you discount players like Nannes.

    If players of current era is only included,

    William Porterfield (IRE)
    Ahmad Shezard (AFG)
    Steven Tikolo* (KEN)
    Ryan ten Doschate (NED)
    Eoin Morgan (IRE)
    Niall O'Brien+ (IRE)
    John Davidson (CAN) / Maurice Odumbe (KEN)
    Thomas Odoyo (KEN)
    Gavin Hamilton (SCO)
    Hamid Hasan (AFG)
    Boyd Rankin (IRE)
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    International 12th Man weeman27bob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by uvelocity View Post
    needs more dwayne leverock
    Not sure there could be much more of him, to be honest.

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    State Vice-Captain BackFootPunch's Avatar
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    We're picking this team on the basis of their performance in two-innings cricket yeah? Generally all-time XIs are for Test cricket.

    So John Davison probably shouldn't be anywhere near contention, nor should Alexei Kervezee.

    Most of the teams put forward so far are reasonable though - could do with more Mohammad Shahzad in a couple of them though. Also Craig Williams from Namibia has done pretty well for himself.

    On the bowling front I'd suggest Hiren Varaiya and Leverock should really both be ahead of Dockrell at this stage. And Gerrie Snyman from Namibia should also be worth a look.

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    State Captain Chubb's Avatar
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    This is the team I came up with, but I'd agree Davison shouldn't be there for 5-day cricket... there must be another associate batsman out there good enough to open. I didn't pick anyone who played a test match.

    W. Porterfield (Ireland)
    J. Davison (Canada)
    S. Tikolo (Kenya)
    R. ten Doeschate (Holland)
    J. Lester (Gentlemen of Philadelphia)
    G. Patterson (Gentlemen of Philadelphia)
    N O'Brien + (Ireland)
    B. King (Gentlemen of Philadelphia)
    H. Hasan (Afghanistan)
    R. Lefebvre (Holland)
    O. Mortensen (Denmark)

    There were a couple of others I thought of picking: Percy Clark, who opened the bowling for Philadelphia with Bart King and was pretty handy, and Mohammad Nabi. I would probably have picked Amjad Khan but he has a cap for England. More bowlers than batsmen available and I allowed my soft spot for the Gentlemen of Philadelphia to influence me.
    Last edited by Chubb; 10-06-2012 at 02:50 AM.
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    Chubb, haven't heard of Mr. Sathasivam?

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    Great thread and some interesting nominations. New on here and glad I found this place.

    Thought about this after the last world cup and came up with this:-

    OutspokenRabbit: OutspokenRabbit's non-Test nations XI

    The team was:-

    Jon Davison (Canada)
    Ed Joyce (Ireland)
    Steve Tikolo (Kenya)
    Ryan Ten Doeschate (Netherlands)
    Eoin Morgan (Ireland)
    Kevin O'Brien (Ireland)
    Niall O'Brien (Ireland)
    Thomas Odoyo (Kenya)
    Roland Lefebrve (Netherlands)
    Ole Mortensen (Denmark)
    Boyd Rankin (Ireland)

    Worth asking about Ole Mortensen, given his first class statistics and economy rate in particular. Would he have been qualified to play for England at some point in the late 1980s or not?

    I appreciate he was playing for Denmark in World Cup Qualifiers etc, but presumably these don't count as first class matches?

    Slightly before my time, so if someone could clarify the point...did he refuse to play for England, was he ineligible or did he inexplicably not get capped when virtually any county journeyman could?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rvd619323 View Post
    Not so much an All-Time XI as a 'Semi-Current FC Standard Associate Players' XI.
    These are the sides I came up with a couple of days ago:



    Both sides would probably be competitive in FC competitions, but wouldn't be likely to regularly trouble full-strength Test sides.

    EDIT: This second side is looking more and more test class by the minute. Especially with the addition of Headley, if he counts.
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    Cricketer Of The Year zaremba's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    If it's an associate XI, that should have players from test countries before getting the test status too.
    These three spring to mind:

    Clarrie Grimmett
    Ranji
    Andy Flower

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