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Thread: Swing and Seam

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    International Coach Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    Swing and Seam

    Is it possible to bowl a delivery which not only swings but also uses the seam of the ball? For example can a fast bowler bowl a delivery that swings inwards and is also an off-cutter?

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Spikey's Avatar
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    pretty sure there's a steyn ball like this

    edit or maybe he just angled it in, i dunno know
    Last edited by Spikey; 17-08-2011 at 06:40 AM.
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    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    Is it possible to bowl a delivery which not only swings but also uses the seam of the ball? For example can a fast bowler bowl a delivery that swings inwards and is also an off-cutter?
    It is possible for a ball to swing and then go the opposite direction off the seam but it happens by chance. I dont believe it is a delivery that a bowler could bowl on command.

    An intentional off-cutter, for example, will not swing as the fingers come down the side of the ball and the seam does not stay 'proud.' Few bowlers today bowl genuine off or leg cutters. They rather do 'a bit off the seam' and concentrate on getting the seam in good positions rather than putting action on the ball.
    If I only just posted the above post, please wait 5 mins before replying as there will be edits

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Howe_zat's Avatar
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    Yeah, I can't see how a cutter would swing. I have seen a few balls move off the seam after swinging though. A recent example would be Anderson's ball to bowl Laxman, second innings at Trent Bridge - swung in and then seamed away.
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    Global Moderator Spark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spikey View Post
    pretty sure there's a steyn ball like this

    edit or maybe he just angled it in, i dunno know
    Nah don't think so. Steyn doesn't really use his inswinger, assuming he has one.

    Anderson has one (a ball that swings in and seams away, that is). Asif had one.
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    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agent Nationaux View Post
    Is it possible to bowl a delivery which not only swings but also uses the seam of the ball? For example can a fast bowler bowl a delivery that swings inwards and is also an off-cutter?
    Yes. Inswingeres generally move out after hitting the seam, but there are bowlers who swing and seam it both in. Prime examples are Javagal Srinath and Nuwan Kulasekara. Fanie de Villiers used to do the vice versa.
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    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Howe_zat View Post
    Yeah, I can't see how a cutter would swing. I have seen a few balls move off the seam after swinging though. A recent example would be Anderson's ball to bowl Laxman, second innings at Trent Bridge - swung in and then seamed away.
    Ha! then have a look at Srinath then.

    Javagal Srinath's fiery spell of bowling - YouTube - ball to Stewart

    another instance: Javagal Srinath 6/21 vs South Africa 1st test 1996/97 Ahmedabad - YouTube

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBenckVnkqA: Slater gets an inswing-incut ball.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    Yes. Inswingeres generally move out after hitting the seam, but there are bowlers who swing and seam it both in. Prime examples are Javagal Srinath and Nuwan Kulasekara. Fanie de Villiers used to do the vice versa.
    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    Ha! then have a look at Srinath then.

    Javagal Srinath's fiery spell of bowling - YouTube - ball to Stewart

    another instance: Javagal Srinath 6/21 vs South Africa 1st test 1996/97 Ahmedabad - YouTube

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BBenckVnkqA: Slater gets an inswing-incut ball.
    Yes, though none of those are off/leg cutters, where the fingers are intentionally rolled over one side of the ball. No one is arguing that after a ball swings, it can't hit the seam and move away or into the batsmen. That happens all the time.

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    International Coach Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    So are these deliveries, where the ball swings, and then moves away or into the batsman after hitting the seam controllable?

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    International Coach Agent Nationaux's Avatar
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    Would you consider the very first delivery to get Rahul (not Dravid) out, one that we are discussing? It seems like an in-swinger and then seams away.

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    Don't think they can control it, else they'd be doing it every other ball. That sort of thing usually happens as long as you've got a good seam position on which the ball lands or due to assistance from the pitch. I may be wrong but that's the to the best of my knowledge.

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    Cricketer Of The Year Manee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goughy View Post
    Few bowlers today bowl genuine off or leg cutters. They rather do 'a bit off the seam' and concentrate on getting the seam in good positions rather than putting action on the ball.
    Why is this, in your opinion?
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    International Coach tooextracool's Avatar
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    Swing and seam happens all the time, its just that it is rarely noticed. An outswinger that hits the seam and moves away (which happens very regularly btw) is still considered to be an outswinger and not a seamer/legcutter.
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    Hall of Fame Member Goughy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manee View Post
    Why is this, in your opinion?
    Good question. Possibly because they take a lot of skill and practice to bowl consistently well. Maybe because coaches now concentrate on a fixed wrist position to keep the seam poud and bowlers are less comfortable with the grip for cutters. It could be that people concentrate on pace and swing and cutters take a few kph off the ball and it will not swing. Also, tracks at the top level are not as conducive to cutting the ball off the seam as they used to be.

    If you take a look at the grip for an off-cutter



    It can feel awkward in the hand. I practiced for years bowling this ball but I can count the number of occasions on one hand where I bowled it in a game.

    Whatever the reason, it is now something of a lost art.
    Last edited by Goughy; 17-08-2011 at 01:17 PM.

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