• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

The 2nd Greatest Cricketer From A Country

salman85

International Debutant
While there is a widespread consensus over the greatest cricketers to play for each of the current Test Playing countries,or most of them atleast,the question of the 2nd best cricketer from the respective countries is more debatable.

To put it in simplistic terms,there's a far bigger gap between the The Best Cricketer and the 2nd Best Cricketer,then there is between the 2nd Best and 3rd Best.So,who would the 2nd Best Cricketers be from the current Test Playing countries(minus Bangladesh since they don't have enough cricketing history)?

For the record,we can use the following cricketers as the greatest ever to play for their countries :

Pakistan : Imran
India : Tendulkar
Australia : Bradman
Srilanka : Murali
West Indies : Sobers
NewZealand : Hadlee
England : Botham?Hutton?Gooch? (Not a clear winner here IMO.This can be debated too)
SouthAfrica : Kallis?Donald?Pollock Sr.?Pollock Jr.? (This too,is very debatable)

So,who would be the 2nd best cricketers from each country?Also,we can debate on the best to emerge from England and SA since it's too close to call IMO,unlike th other countries.

Personally,i think Australia has a clear cut 2nd best cricketer ever in Warne,but it's very very close as far as Pakistan(Wasim?Miandad?Waqar?),India (Kapil?Gavaskar?Kumble?),Srilanka (Sanath?Aravinda?Vaas?),West Indies (Richards?Lara?Marshall?) and New Zealand (Cairns?Vettori?Crowe?) are concerned.

So,Fire away!:)
 

ankitj

Hall of Fame Member
I will post the top 2 from each test nation.

Australia - Bradman, Miller
England - Barnes, Hobbs
India - Tendulkar, Kapil (could be Gavaskar on other days)
New Zealand - Hadlee, Cairns (John Reid close too)
Pakistan - Imran, Wasim
South Africa - G Pollock, Kallis
Sri Lanka - Murali, Sangakkara
West Indies - Sobers, Viv Richards (cursing myself for leaving out Marshall)
 
Last edited:

salman85

International Debutant
West Indies have the closest battle as far as the 2nd greatest cricketers go TBH.Because all 3 of Sobers,Marshall and Richards are guaranteed a place in every All Time 11.No other country can boast of their 3 greatest cricketers having a guaranteed spot in an All Time 11,or atleat not with so much certainty as West Indies IMO.
 
Last edited:

Blaze 18

Banned
West Indies have the closest battle as far as the 2nd greatest cricketers go TBH.Because all 3 of Sobers,Marshall and Richards are guaranteed a place in every All Time 11.No other country can boast of their 3 greatest cricketers having a guaranteed spot in an All Time 11,or atleat not with so much certainty as West Indies IMO.
Bradman, Warne, McGrath? Imran, Waqar, Wasim?
 

salman85

International Debutant
Bradman,Warne and Imran are the ones who are 100% guaranteed to make an All-Time 11.

While Waqar,Wasim and McGrath are amongst the greatest fast bowlers to play the game,they would not be in EVERY all-time 11 ever compiled.Bradman,Warne and Imran would be there 100%.
 

hang on

State Vice-Captain
bradman and sobers would make every all time 11.

certainly not imran! (he didn't even make the cricinfo one, not that i agreed with that)

or warne. or tendulkar. or richards. or lara.
 
Last edited:

salman85

International Debutant
Richards,Warne and Imran would.Richards probably has a higher probability of being there than Imran and Warne.While you could bring up arguments to not have Imran and Warne there,Richards is a sureshot inclusion.

Imran would slot in as the greatest bowling all-rounder of all time.Warne would make most all-time sides too,but yes,he could probably be replaced by Murali in as many sides as he gets picked in.It's all subjective as far as Murali and Warne go.

Imran would have to be there because the gap between him,Botham,Kapil and Hadlee is greater than the gap between Murali and Warne.

Anyway,that discussion ir for another thread.Not this one.We're talking about the 2nd greatest crickets from the respective countries.
 
Last edited:

hang on

State Vice-Captain
a lot of all time sides do not need a bowling all rounder as distinct from the 'regular' all rounder.....just all rounder does it. in which case, it is almost invariably sobers. while many might believe in the need for one, many also don't. (the cricinfo bunch would be a case in point, i would suppose).

if a bowling allrounder were to be required, many could easily argue for the inclusion of miller over imran. nothing in the stats to separate them. or in the charisma stakes!

also, not convinced that richards would be a certainty. headley, lara, pollock, hammond all have quite some arguments in their favour.
 

vcs

Request Your Custom Title Now!
Gilchrist also, but that's partly because of the uniqueness of his role.
 

hang on

State Vice-Captain
the second greatest from each country:

aus - warne
bang - bashar
eng - hutton
ind - gavaskar
nz - crowe
pak - akram
saf - pollock g.
sl - sangakkara
zim - streak
 

sehwag fan

School Boy/Girl Captain
Richards,Warne and Imran would.Richards probably has a higher probability of being there than Imran and Warne.While you could bring up arguments to not have Imran and Warne there,Richards is a sureshot inclusion.

Imran would slot in as the greatest bowling all-rounder of all time.Warne would make most all-time sides too,but yes,he could probably be replaced by Murali in as many sides as he gets picked in.It's all subjective as far as Murali and Warne go.

Imran would have to be there because the gap between him,Botham,Kapil and Hadlee is greater than the gap between Murali and Warne.

Anyway,that discussion ir for another thread.Not this one.We're talking about the 2nd greatest crickets from the respective countries.
When Sobers is the best all - rounder, Imran is not even among top 5 bowler , then how is he a certainity in AT XI. Even kallis is better all rounder than Imran according to ICC all rounder rating.
 

hang on

State Vice-Captain
not sure that peak rating is the best way to judge a player's quality. on that criterion, tendulkar, lara et al would be trumped by pietersen in all time 11s! i don't have the exact peak ratings but u catch my drift....
 

sehwag fan

School Boy/Girl Captain
not sure that peak rating is the best way to judge a player's quality. on that criterion, tendulkar, lara et al would be trumped by pietersen in all time 11s! i don't have the exact peak ratings but u catch my drift....
Imran khan in his 12(1980-92) years had rating of above 500 for only 7 months

Sobers came below 500 points for only 1.5 year in his 12 years career.

Even Botham and Kallis have rating of above 500 points for 3 years.

Pietersen was above lara and Sachin for only few months. Sobers was above Imran by a long margin for 10 years.

Check the graph
http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/...ed2=1803&graph=rating&name=sobers&name2=imran

Even Kallis is better all rounder than Imran
http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/...ed=943&name_selected2=1803&name_selected=2125

And Keith Miller marginal better than Imran
http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/...ted=943&name_selected2=1803&name_selected=725

Imran never performed consistently with bat and ball at same time as compared to Sobers, kallis and Miller.
 
Last edited:

Top