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Thread: The 2nd Greatest Cricketer From A Country

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by salman85 View Post
    Aww.Aren't you a cute little thing.
    Yep,

    Sober's peak rating as all rounder =669
    Kallis =610
    Botham =606

    Imran =513


    And he is certainity in AT XI.

  2. #17
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    not sure that peak rating is the best way to judge a player's quality. on that criterion, tendulkar, lara et al would be trumped by pietersen in all time 11s! i don't have the exact peak ratings but u catch my drift....
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by hang on View Post
    not sure that peak rating is the best way to judge a player's quality. on that criterion, tendulkar, lara et al would be trumped by pietersen in all time 11s! i don't have the exact peak ratings but u catch my drift....
    Imran khan in his 12(1980-92) years had rating of above 500 for only 7 months

    Sobers came below 500 points for only 1.5 year in his 12 years career.

    Even Botham and Kallis have rating of above 500 points for 3 years.

    Pietersen was above lara and Sachin for only few months. Sobers was above Imran by a long margin for 10 years.

    Check the graph
    http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/p...rs&name2=imran

    Even Kallis is better all rounder than Imran
    http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/p..._selected=2125

    And Keith Miller marginal better than Imran
    http://www.relianceiccrankings.com/p...e_selected=725

    Imran never performed consistently with bat and ball at same time as compared to Sobers, kallis and Miller.
    Last edited by sehwag fan; 09-05-2011 at 02:24 AM. Reason: adding graph

  4. #19
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    fair enough.


  5. #20
    International Debutant salman85's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sehwag fan View Post
    Yep,

    Sober's peak rating as all rounder =669
    Kallis =610
    Botham =606

    Imran =513


    And he is certainity in AT XI.
    Using Reliance Rating to prove a point.

    Cuter.

  6. #21
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    Aus - bradman,warne,mcgrath
    Wi - sobers,viv/marshall,lara/ambrose
    india -tendulkar,gavaskar,kumble/dravid
    Pak- imran,wasim,miandad
    Sl - Murali,snagakkara,de silva.
    Nz- hadlee,martin crowe,bond.
    SA- kallis,g.pollock,donald
    eng -Barnes, Botham,hutton,

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by salman85 View Post
    Using Reliance Rating to prove a point.

    Cuter.
    Sorry but Reliance is sponsor. It is ICC all rounder rating.

    And there is no definite way to compare all - rounders like batting or bowling.

  8. #23
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    All rounder's ratings can suffer if your bowling and batting peaks don't coincide. Better to look at peak batting and bowling ratings. I suspect Imran will suffer there too because he was not batting as often as some who batted higher up the order did. You can't ignore his batting average in last 10 years or so, though. Around 50, and in those times, is tremendous.

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by 8ankitj View Post
    All rounder's ratings can suffer if your bowling and batting peaks don't coincide. Better to look at peak batting and bowling ratings. I suspect Imran will suffer there too because he was not batting as often as some who batted higher up the order did. You can't ignore his batting average in last 10 years or so, though. Around 50, and in those times, is tremendous.
    Which means he was inferior all-rounder to Sobers, Kallis and Miller who have higher rating points than him for 10 years not 1 or 2 year.

    And how can you be termed great all-rounder if you are not batting and bowling well simultaneously.

    Imran khan had become a support bowler to Wasim in last 6 years of his career. He concentrated purely on batting.

    If today Sachin stops batting and concentrate on bowling and takes 70-80 wickets in 4 to 5 years , he won't be termed all-rounder.

  10. #25
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hang on View Post
    a lot of all time sides do not need a bowling all rounder as distinct from the 'regular' all rounder.....just all rounder does it. in which case, it is almost invariably sobers. while many might believe in the need for one, many also don't. (the cricinfo bunch would be a case in point, i would suppose).

    if a bowling allrounder were to be required, many could easily argue for the inclusion of miller over imran. nothing in the stats to separate them. or in the charisma stakes!

    also, not convinced that richards would be a certainty. headley, lara, pollock, hammond all have quite some arguments in their favour.
    Surely the SR and wickets per match is quite different for Imran and Miller right??

    Keith Miller | Cricket Players and Officials | ESPN Cricinfo

    Sure enough they are different but not that different really. Why then does Miller have such a low wicket per match ratio????

    Quote Originally Posted by salman85 View Post
    Aww.Aren't you a cute little thing.
    And smalishah's avatar is the most classy one by far Jan certainly echoes the sentiments of CW

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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Surely the SR and wickets per match is quite different for Imran and Miller right??

    Keith Miller | Cricket Players and Officials | ESPN Cricinfo

    Sure enough they are different but not that different really. Why then does Miller have such a low wicket per match ratio????









    We are talking about their ability as all-rounder not bowler. Imran was a better bowler than Miller.

    Imran never performed consistently with bat as well as bowl at the same time as compared to sobers, kallis and Miller.

  12. #27
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sehwag fan View Post
    Which means he was inferior all-rounder to Sobers, Kallis and Miller who have higher rating points than him for 10 years not 1 or 2 year.

    And how can you be termed great all-rounder if you are not batting and bowling well simultaneously.

    Imran khan had become a support bowler to Wasim in last 6 years of his career. He concentrated purely on batting.

    If today Sachin stops batting and concentrate on bowling and takes 70-80 wickets in 4 to 5 years , he won't be termed all-rounder.
    Maybe I can use the same selective application of statistics as you to make a point.

    Since you were using peak ratings here is Imran's peak bowling rating # 3 in the all time bowlers list

    Reliance ICC Player Rankings

    And yes if for the next 5 years Tendulkar can bat like he is batting and get 100+ wickets at an average of less than 25 then I would say that he is an all rounder and VERY good all rounder at that.

  13. #28
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    He said "if he stops" batting tbf. It's an interesting question, can you really call someone an allrounder if they're good at both disciplines over the course of their career, but never at the same time? Ie. always good at one of batting or bowling at any point in their career, but not both?
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  14. #29
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend smalishah84's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sehwag fan View Post






    We are talking about their ability as all-rounder not bowler. Imran was a better bowler than Miller.

    Imran never performed consistently with bat as well as bowl at the same time as compared to sobers, kallis and Miller.
    Imran was never a match winning batsman but he saved a number of test matches. Doesn't mean he did not perform them together. Also Imran did not get as much opportunity to bat because he came in at number 7 and 8. Was still a more than decent batsman. Saved a number of matches against WI and Aus that I can recall.

    When did Kallis perform so well simultaneously with the ball and bat????

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by smalishah84 View Post
    Maybe I can use the same selective application of statistics as you to make a point.

    Since you were using peak ratings here is Imran's peak bowling rating # 3 in the all time bowlers list

    Reliance ICC Player Rankings

    And yes if for the next 5 years Tendulkar can bat like he is batting and get 100+ wickets at an average of less than 25 then I would say that he is an all rounder and VERY good all rounder at that.
    Miller had better all-rounder rating than Imran for 10 years. Not for few months. And btw did Imran retain that peak rating for 10 years. Go and check again.
    Last edited by sehwag fan; 09-05-2011 at 04:23 AM.

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