*Official* England in Bangladesh Thread

[Rich2001]

A whole 2 seasons averaging over 35?

That's not that good in County Cricket!

It's better than what you could ever do :P

And Iam not sure if Richard checked the stats completly or just said it as a figure, but iam sure it must be higher than 35.

- He avg'ed 79 in 2001
- He hit over 1,000 runs in 2002 so must have been around 35
- This season he avg'ed just short of 38

His overall avg is about 38 too.

And next season he will break the 10,000 domestic runs too, so can't be that bad :saint:

 

[marc71178]

It's better than what you could ever do :P

I'm not being touted as a Test player

 

[iamdavid]

Fulton has averaged over 35 in each of the last 2 seasons and would, if you ask me, probably make a good Test opener, far better than his partner or his number-three.

But would he be better than Andrew Strauss , also age must be taken into account.

Correct me if Im wrong but I think Fulton's technique against spin bowling is a little suspect as well.

 

[iamdavid]

Yes, of course I will keep my presence on the ECF - without me that place simply wouldn't be the same, even if I say so myself.

I think Mr Gilham may get a little lonely without you , he will soon find someone else to pick on though , most likely me.

 

[Richard]

A whole 2 seasons averaging over 35?

That's not that good in County Cricket!

It's not brilliant but it's more than most batsmen manage.
He actually averaged over 37 in both seasons, but I just rounded it to the nearest 5.
There is too much acceptance of mediocrity in county cricket, too, and very few batsmen average over 45 in FC-cricket for consecutive seasons (for me the mark of a Test-player), despite the fact that the conditions this season were ridiculously batsmen-friendly and nowhere near enough of the bowlers are accurate enough (scoring-rates last 2 seasons were far too fast).
I would rate Fulton as one of the best English openers, along with Butcher and Strauss.

 

[Craig]

Richard I am so glad you joined up here, your presence is greatly enjoyed. To check out more of this forum though and in some time in the near future I will introduce you to the AAAS and why bad mouthing him is not a wise idea.

 

[Richard]

Richard I am so glad you joined up here, your presence is greatly enjoyed. To check out more of this forum though and in some time in the near future I will introduce you to the AAAS and why bad mouthing him is not a wise idea.

I've already come across it a few times; do you mean bad-mouthing Ajit himself of the founding father of the Society?

 

[Craig]

Ajit himself. Marc goes and issues fatwa's against those that do so.

 

[Neil Pickup]

It's not brilliant but it's more than most batsmen manage.
He actually averaged over 37 in both seasons, but I just rounded it to the nearest 5.
There is too much acceptance of mediocrity in county cricket, too, and very few batsmen average over 45 in FC-cricket for consecutive seasons (for me the mark of a Test-player), despite the fact that the conditions this season were ridiculously batsmen-friendly and nowhere near enough of the bowlers are accurate enough (scoring-rates last 2 seasons were far too fast).
I would rate Fulton as one of the best English openers, along with Butcher and Strauss.

FC averages mean not far from nothing as regards to marking a Test player. Hick, Vaughan, Ramprakash, Trescothick.

 

[iamdavid]

FC averages mean not far from nothing as regards to marking a Test player. Hick, Vaughan, Ramprakash, Trescothick.

You know I pretty much agree with you there , note the records of Waugh , Warne , Healy & McGrath when first picked aswell.

On the Cricinfo forums Richard & I would argue about this alot & trust me he wont give in.

 

[Neil Pickup]

On the Cricinfo forums Richard & I would argue about this alot & trust me he wont give in.

Ah well, we're used to broken records here

 

[marc71178]

But would he be better than Andrew Strauss , also age must be taken into account.

Correct me if Im wrong but I think Fulton's technique against spin bowling is a little suspect as well.

Why the talk of new openers when we currently have a very good pair that bat well together and are both relatively young?

 

[Richard]

Ajit himself. Marc goes and issues fatwa's against those that do so.

Oh, well, I've always rather liked Agarkar myself, as I recently mentioned I've just about given-up hope on him by now but if he ever gets more chances and takes them I'll be happy.

 

[Richard]

FC averages mean not far from nothing as regards to marking a Test player. Hick, Vaughan, Ramprakash, Trescothick.

As david tells you, I disagree very strongly with the notion that county records are not a good indicator of international potential.
It is as simple as this: the rules are the same, they're not two different games. Generally, someone who is better than someone at one will be better than him at the other, too.
Of course you get anomalies - you will get them in anything, and Hick and Vaughan are two that spring to mind (and Vaughan's FC average has risen very fast since his Test selection).
These two anomalies (I disagree with the notion that Ramps is a Test failure, his Test average since 1998 is 37 when you exclude the opening innings) don't cancel-out the fact that, for recent examples, Butcher, Atherton, Hussain, Stewart, Thorpe, Gough, Caddick and at times White have done well for their counties and developed into Test players, too.

 

[Richard]

Why the talk of new openers when we currently have a very good pair that bat well together and are both relatively young?

Personally I have always believed Vaughan is better at four in Tests than at two, and while Trescothick has enjoyed himself at The Oval in recent years, he hasn't done much apart from that.
If you ask me, Butcher, Fulton and Strauss are better players than Trescothick.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

I disagree with the notion that Ramps is a Test failure, his Test average since 1998 is 37 when you exclude the opening innings

Let's look at some facts...

1/ Ramprakash played Test cricket as a specialist batsman.
2/ Ramprakash played 52 Test matches and 92 Test innings.
3/ Ramprakash scored just 2350 runs in those 52 Tests and 92 innings.
4/ Ramprakash averages 27.32 at Test cricket.
5/ Ramprakash has scored 23223 FC at 46.39 per innings.
6/ Ramprakash has 66 FC hundreds and 110 fifties.
7/ Ramprakash has 2 Test hundreds and 12 fifties.

Interesting...

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

Fulton and Strauss

Untried...

 

[Neil Pickup]

As david tells you, I disagree very strongly with the notion that county records are not a good indicator of international potential.
It is as simple as this: the rules are the same, they're not two different games. Generally, someone who is better than someone at one will be better than him at the other, too.
Of course you get anomalies - you will get them in anything, and Hick and Vaughan are two that spring to mind (and Vaughan's FC average has risen very fast since his Test selection).
These two anomalies (I disagree with the notion that Ramps is a Test failure, his Test average since 1998 is 37 when you exclude the opening innings) don't cancel-out the fact that, for recent examples, Butcher, Atherton, Hussain, Stewart, Thorpe, Gough, Caddick and at times White have done well for their counties and developed into Test players, too.

Words fail me.

Forget Ramprakash's average. The times he's screwed up in important positions is beyond belief and he's failed with almost certainty whenever he was needed most.

Tests and FC can be a very different game - look at Ed Smith's very "tailender-y" dismissals flashing outside off stump compared to his mutilation of county attacks.

Whilst "FC ability" will be a contributory factor to Test success, you also need mental strength and to be able to cope with the intensity. Richard Dawson could do the latter but not the former. You need them both and the selectors for the most part do a very good job of calling it.

 

[Mr Mxyzptlk]

The times he's screwed up in important positions is beyond belief and he's failed with almost certainty whenever he was needed most.

My dreams are still haunted by that wild swash he took at a length ball from Warne in the 2001 Ashes. England were 100odd for 5 (?) for goodness sake! You're the last recognized batsman! Warne is a class act! Yet you charge down the pitch?!?!? What???

Now I'm upset again.:!(

 

[gibbsnsmith]

oh yeah i remeber now..and also that fury that came along with it...:!( , youve would ve thought common sense woudlve prevailed over him but OH NO HES A GIMP WHOS GONNA CHASE WARNE :!(