Strongest First-Class Competition

[SeamUp]

Originally Posted by morgieb

Shield is probably still #1. Too many gun Saffies don't play in their domestic comp, and the Pommy one is propped up by overseas players.

Only really Dale Benkenstein and Martin Van Jaarsveld and they wouldn't make a difference now in our domestic comp because they are a bit over-the-hill.

SuperSportSeries has a good mix of senior pro's and youngsters with experience. SSS is a very strong competition.

[BoyBrumby]

Originally Posted by SeamUp

Only really Dale Benkenstein and Martin Van Jaarsveld and they wouldn't make a difference now in our domestic comp because they are a bit over-the-hill.

SuperSportSeries has a good mix of senior pro's and youngsters with experience. SSS is a very strong competition.

I'd think Trott and Pietersen would probably strengthen it too, in all fairness.

Both made their FC bows in SA after all.

[SeamUp]

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

I'd think Trott and Pietersen would probably strengthen it too, in all fairness.

Both made their FC bows in SA after all.

and both struggled a little bit.

KP was a wierd one because we all know he was an offie who just liked to smack it around down the order.

Trott always had talent as a school-boy (went to my school) and played SA U19's. He just struggled to get into a strong WP line-up that included G. Kirsten, HD Ackerman, Ashwell Prince, John Commins, Andrew Puttick & Brian McMillan. Gibbs and Kallis were often on international duty but played at times as well.

[BoyBrumby]

Originally Posted by SeamUp

and both struggled a little bit.

KP was a wierd one because we all know he was an offie who just liked to smack it around down the order.

Trott always had talent as a school-boy (went to my school) and played SA U19's. He just struggled to get into a strong WP line-up that included G. Kirsten, HD Ackerman, Ashwell Prince, John Commins, Andrew Puttick & Brian McMillan. Gibbs and Kallis were often on international duty but played at times as well.

Fair point. Both unquestionably moved up a couple or even more levels after they threw their lots in with England, but equally both might've developed had they not utilised their UK passports.

Guess we'll never know.

[SeamUp]

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

Fair point. Both unquestionably moved up a couple or even more levels after they threw their lots in with England, but equally both might've developed had they not utilised their UK passports.

Guess we'll never know.

Yeah exactly, thats why I don't blame them for what they did. They have arguably developed greatly as players becasue they got their prolonged opportunity. If they waited for an opportunity in SA...they had to make sure they grabbed it because they were no certainites to retain their spots even if they did well.

I will be honest, I actually want them to do well for England apart from when they play South Africa.

[SeamUp]

I posted this on the SA domestic thread...eventhough the Kolpak rulings have got tighter...there are still so many SA born players playing in England.

Friedel De Wet & Neil McKenzie (Both Hamps), Zander De Bruyn (Surrey), Claude Henderson (Leicester) are Kolpak.

Other SA players playing who don't play in SA domestic comps anymore or who never have...Benkenstein & Michel Richardson (Both Durham), Johan Myburgh & Nic Pothas (Hampshire), Charl Willoughby & Alfonso Thomas (Both Somerset), Kirk Wernars (Sussex), Ant Botha & Neil Carter (Warks), Gerard Brophy (Yorkshire), Tim Groenewald, Wayne Madsen & Greg Smith (Derby), Ryan ten Doeschate (Essex), Martin Van Jaarsveld (Kent), Jacques Du Toit (Leicester), Gareth Berg & Dawid Malan (Middlesex), and Andrew Hall (Northants).

Obviously there are others under the England radar and are officialy English now like the obvious 2 in Trott and KP...others like Michael Lumb, Craig Kieswetter, Jade Dernbach and Stuart Meaker.

[vcs]

LOL, ECB and CSA might as well team up and field a joint side.

[Borges]

Originally Posted by SeamUp

SuperSportSeries has a good mix of senior pro's and youngsters with experience. SSS is a very strong competition.

Very strong. From what I know of domestic national FC competitions, the strongest in the world. If SA could find somehow unearth a few quality spinners, it would be insanely strong.

[Jacknife]

Originally Posted by Athlai

Because it includes the 2nd division.

That's like saying the English Premier League isn't the best football league in the world because it has the Championship underneath and division 1 under that, that makes no difference to the quality of the top division.

[Jono]

Originally Posted by silentstriker

Unfortunately, what it might do is just marginalize Ranji trophy as people don't feel like adjusting to the longer format or adapt their games for it. This is doubly true as it seems that the selectors seem to be prioritizing IPL over Ranji trophy as the competition to feed the national side.

What examples are there?

If you name players that did well in the IPL, like Jadeja or Ashwin, and then got put into the international side, that was on the basis of their domestic records (first class and list A). And both of them haven't been in the test side anyway, only the ODI.

There is not one player you can say who was put into the test team on the basis of IPL. Raina was chosen because of his ODI performances (which isn't a good thing, but is not the IPL's fault).

It's a myth that the IPL is being used as the criteria for selecting players.

[Shri]

I don't agree with this **** too often but I do agree this time.

[Marcuss]

Originally Posted by SeamUp

Other SA players playing who don't play in SA domestic comps anymore or who never have... Dawid Malan (Middlesex)

Born in Roehampton tbh.

[Prince EWS]

Originally Posted by Jono

What examples are there?

If you name players that did well in the IPL, like Jadeja or Ashwin, and then got put into the international side, that was on the basis of their domestic records (first class and list A). And both of them haven't been in the test side anyway, only the ODI.

There is not one player you can say who was put into the test team on the basis of IPL. Raina was chosen because of his ODI performances (which isn't a good thing, but is not the IPL's fault).

It's a myth that the IPL is being used as the criteria for selecting players.

I know it was only ODIs and not Tests, but I don't think Manpreet Gony had any domestic record to speak of when he was picked for India.

[Athlai]

Originally Posted by Jacknife

That's like saying the English Premier League isn't the best football league in the world because it has the Championship underneath and division 1 under that, that makes no difference to the quality of the top division.

Yeah but the County Championship includes both divisions. If you were to say the English first division is the strongest first class competition, then you might be right.

[Ikki]

A question: Indian seamers, and bowling in general, seems to get big knocks against it for not being of a high standard. The domestic setup isn't lauded for being particularly good either. So how do they produce fine batsmen so regularly? You'd think they'd be shocked by the jump in standard at Test level.