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Sachin Tendulkar Vs...
- Thread starter Shri
- Start date
Prince EWS
Global Moderator
GotSpin
Hall of Fame Member
Pretty stoked if I changed the opinion of that many people...Even though I'm sure the guys on CW are attempting to shove their opinion down the throats of just a select few who will never change their mind. Imagine Migara just saying, 'oh yeah, good point, in fact you've probably been right this whole time about Warne'
I am guessing this is the article that you are talking about where Imran questions Sachin as a match-winner. The match-winner thing is a tough one as cricket is a team game. It is unfair to expect one man to win the match. To me, as long as a batsman contributes his share of runs, especially under tough circumstances when everybody else is struggling, he has done his bit.You do have a point here. And it's not just the case with India. The same is the case with Pakistan as well. We do tend to deify our own heroes while putting down others. We can criticize greats of other countries no end but find it difficult (if not impossible) to accept the same for our own cricketers. I am sure if you start an Imran, Wasim, or Waqar belittling thread all the Pakistani posters on CW (although there are few regulars here) would spring into action (including me I think).
There is a HUGE fan following for Tendulkar in India. No doubt about that. And he is quite popular among cricket fans in Pakistan too (obviously they hate him when he does well against Pakistan.....). But like all great players Tendulkar has his weaknesses and not being a great match winner as some of the other players might be one of them (I hope I am not taken apart for writing this. I remember Imran Khan once saying that in India and boy did he get some flak for it). Which doesn't mean that he is not a great player. Arguably the finest since Bradman.
However at the same time it has to be acknowledged that on a lot of occasion for some reason Tendulkar is brought into arguments where there is no need to bring him in. Which is probably to tick off the "Tendulkar fanboys". And most of the time it works.....
Tendulkar has as much right to being criticized or analyzed as any other player in the history of the game. At the same time the criticism should be constructive (given the fact that there is so much adulation for Tendulkar amongst many cricket fans). A lot times the criticism seems to be there just to inflame the other side.
Don't remember Imran getting a lot of flak in India for this article. He did get a lot of flak for comparing Inzi with Sachin
. In any case, he gave a rat's ass as to what Indian public or Indian media thought about him. The guy was supremely confident in himself and never backed off from airing his views even if they were opposite to public perception. Even during the peak of Sachin's success in 1998, in an interview with mid-day (a Mumbai daily), he maintained "Ask Sachin to dominate great fast bowlers on fast pitches in Test cricket and then we shall see if he is the greatest ever." That just was his barometer, his taste. But he did club Sachin along with Greg Chappell, Barry Richards, Majid Khan as a great, classy batsman with an innate ability to time the ball beautifully.The one former cricketer who got a serious hiding from the Indian Media for criticizing Sachin was Barry Richards. Indian media and public ganged up on him. Unlike Imran, Barry Richards immediately changed his mind
The guy seriously got intimidated. A similar instance was Wisden not having any of Sachin's innings in the list of 100 greatest Test innings. It became a huge furore in India. Wisden quickIy made amends and made sure he was included in every list released thereafter 
. After all what Wisden needs is money and publicity. India is a huge market for cricket. And all Indian public/media need is a few confirming words of praise of their hero. It is a win-win situation.It was then the cricketers from rest of the world realized that unless you have major investments in an effigy making firm in India, it isn't worth criticizing Sachin. And they also made sure to wax eloquent praises on him, especially before any India tour or any book release.
It is difficult to classify positive criticism or negative criticism. It also depends on how it is taken. Lara was criticized severely during his career by his contemporaries as well as ex-cricketers. I don't think Trinidadians or West Indians went up in arms. I remember a former Australian cricketer wouldn't even call Viv Richards as great because of his incapability against leg-spin. Don't recall a riot in Antigua. Virtually every great cricketer was chided or berated by another great cricketer in some way.
All that is needed is a broad mind to accept the fact that people can have different opinions/tastes and a little confidence in one's own judgment.
Regarding worshipping players from one's own country, and putting down the rest, I wonder how many people even watch Test cricket with any degree of passion or intensity if their home country is not involved in any way. For example, how many Indians or Australians would have actually watched Saeed Anwar's delightful 118 against Donald & co. at Durban in 1997 or Gooch's magnificient 154* against West Indies? My guess is, very few. If they didn't, their only way of judging Anwar or Gooch would be using stats or scorecards. Once you are no longer seriously involved, your perception of an innings (or a player) completely changes.
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robelinda
International Vice-Captain
Only saw highlights of Anwar's knock but saw Gooch's in full, no doubt the most impressive knock ive seen. Very rarely do you see a big score against the best bowling attack in unbelievably bowler friendly conditions. Which brings me to another point, watching a few highlights is not the same as seeing the whole innings, seeing a few fours smacked away off bad balls means nothing. Seeing how a batsman copes with the good balls is what I want to see, and you just dont get that in highlights. Ive seen Gooch's 154* in highlights and it just looks like a flat deck, cutting and pulling easily. But if you watch a few overs in full and see all the ridiculous movement off a length Marshall was getting and see how well Gooch countered that, supreme innings.
smash84
The Tiger King
The article that you have mentioned is not the one I am talking about where Imran says that he does not think Sachin is a match winner.I am guessing this is the article that you are talking about where Imran questions Sachin as a match-winner. The match-winner thing is a tough one as cricket is a team game. It is unfair to expect one man to win the match. To me, as long as a batsman contributes his share of runs, especially under tough circumstances when everybody else is struggling, he has done his bit.
Don't remember Imran getting a lot of flak in India for this article. He did get a lot of flak for comparing Inzi with Sachin
The one former cricketer who got a serious hiding from the Indian Media for criticizing Sachin was Barry Richards. Indian media and public ganged up on him. Unlike Imran, Barry Richards immediately changed his mind
It was then the cricketers from rest of the world realized that unless you have major investments in an effigy making firm in India, it isn't worth criticizing Sachin. And they also made sure to wax eloquent praises on him, especially before any India tour or any book release.
It is difficult to classify positive criticism or negative criticism. It also depends on how it is taken. Lara was criticized severely during his career by his contemporaries as well as ex-cricketers. I don't think Trinidadians or West Indians went up in arms. I remember a former Australian cricketer wouldn't even call Viv Richards as great because of his incapability against leg-spin. Don't recall a riot in Antigua. Virtually every great cricketer was chided or berated by another great cricketer in some way.
All that is needed is a broad mind to accept the fact that people can have different opinions/tastes and a little confidence in one's own judgment.
Regarding worshipping players from one's own country, and putting down the rest, I wonder how many people even watch Test cricket with any degree of passion or intensity if their home country is not involved in any way. For example, how many Indians or Australians would have actually watched Saeed Anwar's delightful 118 against Donald & co. at Durban in 1997 or Gooch's magnificient 154* against West Indies? My guess is, very few. If they didn't, their only way of judging Anwar or Gooch would be using stats or scorecards. Once you are no longer seriously involved, your perception of an innings (or a player) completely changes.
He talks about it here
Tendulkar not a match-winner: Imran Khan
This seems to belong more in Viv as the greatest ever thread
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ankitj
Hall of Fame Member
The part in bold is just rhetorics. Most of the rest I tend to agree with.I am guessing this is the article that you are talking about where Imran questions Sachin as a match-winner. The match-winner thing is a tough one as cricket is a team game. It is unfair to expect one man to win the match. To me, as long as a batsman contributes his share of runs, especially under tough circumstances when everybody else is struggling, he has done his bit.
Don't remember Imran getting a lot of flak in India for this article. He did get a lot of flak for comparing Inzi with Sachin
The one former cricketer who got a serious hiding from the Indian Media for criticizing Sachin was Barry Richards. Indian media and public ganged up on him. Unlike Imran, Barry Richards immediately changed his mind
It was then the cricketers from rest of the world realized that unless you have major investments in an effigy making firm in India, it isn't worth criticizing Sachin. And they also made sure to wax eloquent praises on him, especially before any India tour or any book release.
It is difficult to classify positive criticism or negative criticism. It also depends on how it is taken. Lara was criticized severely during his career by his contemporaries as well as ex-cricketers. I don't think Trinidadians or West Indians went up in arms. I remember a former Australian cricketer wouldn't even call Viv Richards as great because of his incapability against leg-spin. Don't recall a riot in Antigua. Virtually every great cricketer was chided or berated by another great cricketer in some way.
All that is needed is a broad mind to accept the fact that people can have different opinions/tastes and a little confidence in one's own judgment.
Regarding worshipping players from one's own country, and putting down the rest, I wonder how many people even watch Test cricket with any degree of passion or intensity if their home country is not involved in any way. For example, how many Indians or Australians would have actually watched Saeed Anwar's delightful 118 against Donald & co. at Durban in 1997 or Gooch's magnificient 154* against West Indies? My guess is, very few. If they didn't, their only way of judging Anwar or Gooch would be using stats or scorecards. Once you are no longer seriously involved, your perception of an innings (or a player) completely changes.
smash84
The Tiger King
I pretty much agree with all of it.
smash84
The Tiger King
Also to be fair Viv Richards rates Ponting and Sachin as the best of the lot these days
from cricinfo
"Richards picked Test cricket's two highest run-getters - Sachin Tendulkar and Ricky Ponting - as his top batsmen in the game. "Ricky Ponting is the most aggressive for me. I have always liked his aggression. But the role Sachin is playing for India, that's batsmanship at its very best for me. The things Sachin is doing now and the way he did them in the past, are two completely different chapters in his career.""
For the full article
West Indies board ostracising former players - Viv Richards | Cricket News | Global | Cricinfo.com
ankitj
Hall of Fame Member
The definition of a "match-winner" is a contention here. In ODIs, I don't agree at all with anyone who says that Sachin is not a match winner. He has played countless innings that have helped India win matches. I can't even begin to list them down. And of course, there are performances in finals and in world cups that stand testimony to his ability to win ODIs.
In tests, it becomes a little more complicated. Being a longer format, there are so many things that influence the outcome that it is difficult to consider an individual contribution as match-winning. Moreover, in tests bowlers influence the outcomes more than the batsmen. If however, performances in the 4th innings is taken as a proxy for match-winning ability of a batsman, then I think it is fair to say that Tendulkar has not been among the most successful. Sachin's greatness owes to other factors when it comes to tests.
As for Imran Khan, as great as a cricketer he is, he can sometimes be little unwise with his comments. He said once that Inzamam-ul-Haq is the best player of fast bowling, which of course is too far fetched.
In tests, it becomes a little more complicated. Being a longer format, there are so many things that influence the outcome that it is difficult to consider an individual contribution as match-winning. Moreover, in tests bowlers influence the outcomes more than the batsmen. If however, performances in the 4th innings is taken as a proxy for match-winning ability of a batsman, then I think it is fair to say that Tendulkar has not been among the most successful. Sachin's greatness owes to other factors when it comes to tests.
As for Imran Khan, as great as a cricketer he is, he can sometimes be little unwise with his comments. He said once that Inzamam-ul-Haq is the best player of fast bowling, which of course is too far fetched.
Migara
Cricketer Of The Year
Tendulkar vs Mangos is the best.If every fan of Sachin(casual fan, die hard fan, even a general fan of the game who says something positive about him for once) is going to called a fan boy in this forum and looked upon condescendingly without his posts being treated on merit, well, at least every one of those fans can at least have the chance to be guilty of the thing that they are being accused of. I will be starting threads that are civil and clean without any flame wars in CC from now on. And I will be comparing various batsmen to SrT in said threads. Just a heads up.
Sick of the ridiculous branding that is going on around here by the usual **** **** brigade. Ciao.
Burgey
Request Your Custom Title Now!
This.
Jono
Virat Kohli (c)
Cool heads like Burgey prevented that from happening
weldone
Hall of Fame Member
He saw the next Malcolm Marshall in Mohammad Sami is a far far better example.
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