• Welcome to the Cricket Web forums, one of the biggest forums in the world dedicated to cricket.

    You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join the Cricket Web community today!

    If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us.

Bangladesh & Zimbabwe Improving?

laksh_01

State Vice-Captain
In recent series of England & West Indies both Bangladesh & Zimbabwe both showed lot of courage. Wat do guys think these guys will have for 2011 Cricket World Cup?
 

_Ed_

Request Your Custom Title Now!
I think Bangladesh, particularly in games that they host, might be a surprise package at the World Cup.
 

GIMH

Norwood's on Fire
Bangladesh will be competitive to an extent, only in as much that their games won't be assumed walkovers. Still can't see them going far though.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Athlai

Not Terrible
Their spin attack will probably see victories at home become more likely but their total lack of a pace attack means they'll still be facing defeats abroad for along time to come.
 

Jungle Jumbo

International Vice-Captain
Their spin attack will probably see victories at home become more likely but their total lack of a pace attack means they'll still be facing defeats abroad for along time to come.
Bit like India for the best part of the twentieth century then.

Bangladesh offer the only reasonable chance (possibly, just possibly with the exception of Afghanistan) of another Test-class nation emerging in the foreseeable future. They have a huge population, cricket is the number one sport in the country, they aren't reliant on players from southern hemisphere backgrounds or expats. The big problems are financial, the apparent mental cricketing deficiencies of many of the players and a population with a relatively small average height, which will make producing a pace attack and a batting lineup which can survive on fast pitches far more difficult to obtain. If Bangladesh can become a Test-class side in 20 years time, regardless of the one-sided clashes in between, I think that would be a success story. Saying that they shouldn't have been promoted in the first place is not helping the situation, as correct as that statement may be - they are here to stay now and forcing them to play other nations' A sides, Australian states or associate nations on a permanent basis would just destroy Bangladesh's interest in the game.

Besides, there are bigger issues at stake here. Bangladesh is a poor country, the vast majority of the population living in poverty. Have a look at India and the importance of cricket to the people: it's the country's biggest pride. Take Bangladesh's cricket team away from the people and what have they got to represent them on a world stage?
 

nick-o

State 12th Man
Best batsmen so far in 2010

Or you could look at it this way:

Team W - D - L
AUS 3 - 0 - 0
IND 3 - 0 - 1
SAf 2 - 1 - 1
ENG 2 - 1 - 1
NZl 1 - 0 - 1
PAK 0 - 0 - 2
BAN 0 - 0 - 5

Or you could calculate it this way: so far in 2010, each wicket taken in test cricket has cost on average 38.41 runs. So a 3 wicket win can be equivalent to (3 x 38.41 runs) = 115.2 run win. In which case the table looks like this:

AUS plus 651.1
IND plus 548.1
SAf plus 407.1
ENG plus 68.6
NZl minus 263.1
PAK minus 267.0
BAN minus 1,144.8

Not quite approaching test class yet.
 
Last edited:

Sir Alex

Banned
Or you could look at it this way:

Team W - D - L
AUS 3 - 0 - 0
IND 3 - 0 - 1
SAf 2 - 1 - 1
ENG 2 - 1 - 1
NZl 1 - 0 - 1
PAK 0 - 0 - 2
BAN 0 - 0 - 5

Or you could calculate it this way: so far in 2010, each wicket taken in test cricket has cost on average 38.41 runs. So a 3 wicket win can be equivalent to (3 x 38.41 runs) = 115.2 run win. In which case the table looks like this:

AUS plus 651.1
IND plus 548.1
SAf plus 407.1
ENG plus 68.6
NZl minus 263.1
PAK minus 267.0
BAN minus 1,144.8

Not quite approaching test class yet.
Did I say they are a great team now? No.

I just said their batting has improved by a huge margin as compared to what they were 2 years back.
 

marc71178

Eyes not spreadsheets
So you're saying the game just completed is equivalent to about a 350 run win? Bit of a flaw there methinks.
 

nick-o

State 12th Man
So you're saying the game just completed is equivalent to about a 350 run win? Bit of a flaw there methinks.
Obviuously it's just a way of playing with numbers. I'm not suggesting it's a meaningful statistical measure. But I think it gives an idea of comparative standing. Not absolute.
 

nick-o

State 12th Man
Caculate WI over the last 2 or so years eh?
At a rough glance:

From 01 Jan 2008 to present:

PAK 1 - 4 - 6
WIN 2 - 8- 11
BAN 2 - 1 - 14

Average "cost" of a wicket: 36.14

PAK minus 631
WIN minus 1,922.9
BAN minis 4,035.1

Like I say, just a fun way of playing with numbers. Although for a longer period like this, average deficit per match would be more meaningful:

PAK minus 57.4
WIN minus 91.6
BAN minus 237.4

Obviously not test class yet.
 

nick-o

State 12th Man
Did I say they are a great team now? No.

I just said their batting has improved by a huge margin as compared to what they were 2 years back.
Yeah, I hope I didn't sound aggressive. Sure they've come on, and I hope they come on a lot further. I always root for them, whoever they're playing.

They have some great new talent, but they fall a long way short at the moment.

As you can see, I enjoy playing with numbers.

Since Bangladesh gained test status, the average cost of a wicket has been about 34.2. So you could say that a batsman who averages 34.2 or more, and a bowler who averages 34.2 or less, is "test class"

In which case (taking 20 innings minimum qulaification) Bangladesh have produced exactly two test class cricketers so far (Tamim and Shakib are the only ones who meet that critria).

But I'm sure the number will grow, and I look forward to that.
 

jeevan

International 12th Man
How have Bangladesh not improved in the last couple of years as a test team?

They almost had India on the mat, but for SRT and Nafees,Ashraful in the first test. They were not completely outclassed in NZ, and then against England especially in the second test. And this is after losing the one pacer that they almost ever produced in Mashrafe.

Especially in their batting - it seems at least one of their 4 (Tamin,Shakib,Mahmudullah,Mushfiq) shows up in each innings. That was not the case before.
 

Langeveldt

Soutie
Zimbabwe
Are improving, but will be held back until the slowly improving situation in the country improves a hell of a lot more.. AFAIK guys like Heath Streak are involved in the coaching setup.. There is a viable and reasonably competitive, televised, domestic competition now.. Fuel and Food are able to be bought a hell of a lot easier in the country now.. And guys like Blignaut, Taibu, Vermeulen are making their way back into the fold.. This can only be a good thing
 

Aritro

International Regular
I'd be curious to see what the standard in Zimbabwe's franchise cricket is like and how it compares to, say, Melbourne first grade cricket.

As for Bangladesh, yes we are obviously improving. We have 4 test class batsmen now IMO, Mushfiq, Tamim, Shakib and Mahmdullah have all been averaging 40+ for a while now.

I think we'd have won a test against quality opposition in the last 18 months if not for two factors:

a) Mortaza getting injured. He's comfortably short of test class most of the time, but is a fine bowler on his best days.
b) Shahadat Hossain's spectacular demise as a test bowler. After his 20th test match, he had a strike rate of 50 with the ball and a very legitimate claim to being called a test standard bowler. What's happened to him since has been as unfortunate as it has been bewildering.

If we'd have had those two available at somewhere near their best to support Shakib, we'd have had no trouble taking 20 wickets in several of our recent matches.

Sadly, we haven't, and have had to endure watching one test standard bowler attempting to take all 20 opposition wickets.
 
Last edited:

Pratters

Cricket, Lovely Cricket
Bangladesh is certainly an improving side and will be much better 5 years from now.

Zimbabwe on talent per player available basis is one of the best sides around but the politics always hampers them. They became so strong when Andy Flower was blooming a decade ago.
 

andmark

International Captain
In 2007, they Bangladesh played 5, lost 4 and drew one. In 2008, Bangladesh won 0 matches (out of nine matches, and they drew one). In 2009, Bangladesh won 2 matches (out of the three they played. It's worth noting, they only lost to Sri Lanka).

Overall, I've noticed a large difference in Bangladesh since 2005. Despite what the stats say, I've noticed a huge improvement.

As for Zimbabwe, I have noticed a bad decrease in the little skill they had, and I can only blame the government and economy of Zimbabwe because of this. In one match with Zimbabwe competing in it, inflation was that rapid, that printing out tickets had to be cancelled, because it was worked out that the inflation would cause an almost certain loss in money. Spectators were then let in for free. The political situation is that bad, that no one's played an international test there since 2005/06.
 
Last edited:

Top