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Thread: Ramnarine: The Legend That Wasn't?

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Ramnarine: The Legend That Wasn't?

    I was in a nostalgic mood today, casting my mind back to various players from past days of cricket. It was a strange experience, because thinking back to players who were around just recently seems like a lifetime ago. It seems almost surreal to think of Sherwin Campbell and Adrian Griffith opening the batting together. And as I skimmed through Cricinfo profiles, whoever came to mind, I landed on Dinanath Ramnarine.

    As Richard alluded to in the Steve Smith thread, wristspin is an extremely difficult art to master, or even be decent at. The vast majority of wristspinners amount to nothing in no time at all. For a legspinner to be any good is rare, and for him to be Test class even more so. For West Indies, spin in general has been a barren department, but Ramnarine was special- a wristspinner with control and brains. Not only was he a good spinner, but probably as close to a world class bowler as any West Indian this side of Ian Bishop.

    It's a real shame that politics and prejudice denied him what could have been an outstanding career. At 34, who knows, he may still have had 3-4 good years left in him. 45 wickets in 12 Tests and 2.37 economy. Certainly comparable with the majority of spinners around in his time and since.

    I don't expect any conversation to come from this essay of an opening post. I just felt the need to show some appreciation for the man.
    Sreesanth said, "Next ball he was beaten and I said, 'is this the King Charles Lara? Who is this impostor, moving around nervously? I should have kept my mouth shut for the next ball - mind you, it was a length ball - Lara just pulled it over the church beyond the boundary! He is a true legend."

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    International Coach tooextracool's Avatar
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    Not really a fan to be honest. Leg spin is a difficult art in that it is hard enough to land it on the square, but what people routinely forget is that even accurate wrist spinners have struggled to be successful. This is because, leg spin is more than just being accurate and turning the ball, it is about being able to encorporate the other variables such as flight, drift etc into your bowling. Brad Hogg was one of the most accurate wrist spinners around, but he couldn't buy a wicket at the test match level. Kaneria is similar. Ramnarine, like his left handed counterpart in the Carribean Dave Mohammed, simply didnt toss the ball up enough or have control over drift and loop to be successful at the test match level.

    Perhaps had he played less against England and more against subcontinental teams or Australia his record might not be as rosy.
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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    I have to disagree with the assertion that he wasn't attacking enough. Ramnarine knew he wasn't Warne, but he was a very intelligent bowler. More so than protecting his record, I think he suffered from the lack of cricket on the subcontinent because he rarely got a chance to bowl in truly helpful conditions in the Caribbean. In Sri Lanka, for example, he bowled quite well. 10 wickets in 3 matches was a good return, but reports suggest he was better than that too.

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    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Easily the best WI spinner i've seen. Was very impressive vs SA 2001, not sure what happened to him afterwards..


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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Hooper happened.

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    Englishman BoyBrumby's Avatar
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    Isn't he supposed to be a rather, er, willful character?
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    My main memory of him is being curiously awarded the Man of the Match in a Test against England in the West Indies. I remember it mainly because the award was given by Roy Fredericks who I hadn't seen for many years and he looked so old and frail beyond his years.

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    International 12th Man JBMAC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Easily the best WI spinner i've seen. Was very impressive vs SA 2001, not sure what happened to him afterwards..
    He wasn't in the same class as Lance Gibbs
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    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBMAC View Post
    He wasn't in the same class as Lance Gibbs
    I started watching cricket in 1997, so i meant he was the best WI spinner i have seen in my time of watching cricket.

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    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mxyzptlk View Post
    Hooper happened.
    Have heard this before, from my trini relatives. By i cant remember the details, run it by me again..

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Have heard this before, from my trini relatives. By i cant remember the details, run it by me again..
    Short story is that he and Hooper had a fall out, with Hooper telling him that he'd never play for West Indies again as long as he was captain, or something similar. Although Hooper was replaced as captain, that wish came true. Ramnarine went on to be the outspoken vox populi.

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    U19 Debutant MrIncredible's Avatar
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    Hooper!! What a waste of talent. Probably as naturally gifted as say a Lara but for whatever reason never quite fulfilled his vast potential

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrIncredible View Post
    Hooper!! What a waste of talent. Probably as naturally gifted as say a Lara but for whatever reason never quite fulfilled his vast potential
    The West Indian Mark Waugh. And had a peculiar habit of seemingly sniffing his top lip whilst waiting for the ball to be delivered.

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    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Mxyzptlk View Post
    Short story is that he and Hooper had a fall out, with Hooper telling him that he'd never play for West Indies again as long as he was captain, or something similar. Although Hooper was replaced as captain, that wish came true. Ramnarine went on to be the outspoken vox populi.
    Yea that was it. I have never seen even proof of that actual fallout though. But Hooper being axed as captain before the AUS home series 03, was ever more criminal.

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    Request Your Custom Title Now! Mr Mxyzptlk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Yea that was it. I have never seen even proof of that actual fallout though. But Hooper being axed as captain before the AUS home series 03, was ever more criminal.
    But in his final Test - against Pakistan in 2001-02 - he had an on-field disagreement with Carl Hooper, the captain, and he also rubbed some people up in his hands-on role as president of the West Indies Players Association (WIPA). He found himself marginalised, despite solid domestic returns, and he quit in frustration to pursue his WIPA role fulltime.
    According to Cricinfo.

    Hooper's never, to my knowledge, denied it either.

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