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Thread: Australians have alot to say now that they're winning ? - Tony Cozier

  1. #16
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend honestbharani's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    They defeated a better SA team at home before the Ashes. AUS problem to date in this post McWarne era has been inconsistent cricket & poor selections. AUS lost the Ashes more so than ENG won it - they weren't outplayed like in 2005.



    Haa yea that ENG team in 2007 didn't even have its full strenght attack. Plus nobody was talking about IND being a top test team in 2007.

    So what if SA won in ENG 08. AUS just defeated SA in SA.
    SA juz defeated Aus in Aus.
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    In the end, I think it's so utterly, incomprehensibly boring. There is so much context behind each innings of cricket that dissecting statistics into these small samples is just worthless. No-one has ever been faced with the same situation in which they come out to bat as someone else. Ever.
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  2. #17
    Cricketer Of The Year four_or_six's Avatar
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    The Australian media does usually go pretty harshly at opposing teams. But at the same time, I'm not sure it's much harsher than the criticism of the WI by the English media this summer and I thought that was justified at the time.

    The record the West Indies have over the last few years is beyond dire, I think someone has to cop a lot of criticism. The question is whether the right people are, I suppose.
    Last edited by four_or_six; 02-12-2009 at 12:35 AM. Reason: clarity

  3. #18
    Global Moderator Matt79's Avatar
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    Would just like to clarify that neither Ben Dorries or Aussie speak for most of the Aussie fans. Dorries is ****e, even in terms of the very low regard I have for journos. The conspiracy theories trotted out suggesting there's anything more at play than dumb **** journos being lazy in search of stuff for their columns is amusing however.
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  4. #19
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend honestbharani's Avatar
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    lol.. I know aussie doesn't really speak for the majority of Aussie fans, mate.. Juz find it laughable that the guy is turning into a mini-Richard.. At least Richard acknowledges that he is wrong sometimes and doesn't always maintain as if he knows everything about cricket...


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    What i hate is channel 9 talking up how good our players are,how good are they,they we're beaten by england,s africa and india in 12 months,sack the channel 9 team and get some humble media.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by four_or_six View Post
    The Australian media does usually go pretty harshly at opposing teams. But at the same time, I'm not sure it's much harsher than the criticism of the WI by the English media this summer and I thought that was justified at the time.

    The record the West Indies have over the last few years is beyond dire, I think someone has to cop a lot of criticism. The question is whether the right people are, I suppose.
    Did the WI media make a big deal about ENG after WI bowled out eng for 51 ?

    Are you slow ?

    If there is one team that should never bad talk WI its eng.

  7. #22
    Global Moderator Prince EWS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    If it is you are suggesting that there is a natural biasness by defualt, when judging players in from your own team in cricket. For some people i guess yea. But i personally have never taken that approach, always try to call a spade a spade.
    Whether or not the bias has a significant impact on your judgement is not the issue; the bias is there whether it effects you or not.
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  8. #23
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    lol.. I know aussie doesn't really speak for the majority of Aussie fans, mate.. Juz find it laughable that the guy is turning into a mini-Richard..


    BTW just to note some of the criticism identified by Cozier there is indeed utterly ridiculous and OTT; and also to note that David Frith and West Indian teams of the 1970s and 1980s is not a combination anyone should take seriously. He honestly was like a man possessed, and would often make utterly nonsensical criticisms of them.
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  9. #24
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Ninety View Post
    Ben Dorries is a sorry excuse for a writer and I'm embarrassed to even be in the same city as the paper he 'writes' for.
    It's funny how that chap has been denounced by pretty much everyone I've ever heard comment on him on CW, yet he continues to be employed to write.

    He must be very popular among the rabble if the aristocracy hold him in such universally low regard.

  10. #25
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    An inconsistent team cannot be called "clearly" #1 in the world... mate, you have unproven seamers, unreliable spinners and good batting..
    How is AUS current pace trio unproven?. All of them have proven themselves in test cricket in various ways in the last 12 months & currently are better than IND & SA at full strenght & depth wise.

    IND & SA has ONE quality seamer in Steyn & Khan. Everything else either inconsistent/unproven/passed their best (IND - Sharma, RP Singh, Sreesanth, Patel) - (SA - Parnell, Morkel, McLaren, Ntini, Langevelt, De Wet)

    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    How does that make your side better than India or RSA? They are equal...
    They are equal in batting. Nothing else. I would AUS to beat SA in test right now & IND (in AUS). The only issue with AUS is given the lack of world class spinner they would struggle to repeat the heroics in the sub-continent like during the glory years.

    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    And the claim about depth is just BS as usual..
    AUS fast bowling depth is clearly better in IND & SA come on. Behind Hilfy/Johnson/Siddle AUS can call on:

    - Lee, Nannes, Bollinger, McKay, Noffke. Which could make all international test teams ATM.

    Batting wise its the same thing. Hughes, Jaques, Rogers, Ferguson, D Hussey, Bailey. (SA could probably compare with this depth in batting). Plus as i mentioned Brad Hodge just retired from FC cricket, so that technically rules him out as option in AUS "depth", but he would clearly make every international test team ATM.

    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    I dunno what you know of Indian reserves but I have enough faith in Badri, Vijay, Pujara and Rahane to tell you that our test depth is nothing like our ODI depth... We have enough depth in batting and reasonable depth in bowling for tests...
    I have seen a few them yes Badrinath & Vijay definately alot. Plus Tiwary was in AUS the other day, i saw Pandey when he scored than hundred in the IPL 09 & of course Sharma & Raina. You personally may have enough faith. But if history us is to be a guide. Their is no guaranteed that those IND young talented batsmen are ready ATM to take over or will be as good as Dravid/Tendy/Laxman.

    Even SJS recently was sharing his concern about this.

    After all over the last 19 years. The IND middle-order has basically revolved around Dravid/Tendy/Laxman/Azhar/Ganguly. The other players that have gotten chances in a few tests where never test quality. IND have no Stuart Law or Jamie Cox etc type players who could say where unlucky not to play test cricket.

    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    And Australia's reserves haven't been tested yet. We will see when they are...
    Yes they aren't tested. But again using history as guide & the fact that AUS the best domestic system in the world & training, coaching etc. I would always back those players to step up & international level faster than most teams especially IND.


    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani View Post
    SA juz defeated Aus in Aus.
    Yes this proves my point about AUS inconsistency in this McWarne era thus far. AUS losted that series more so to poor selection & SA took advantage of them. As aforementioned if SA & AUS play in test series right now i would back AUS to win.

  11. #26
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prince EWS View Post
    Whether or not the bias has a significant impact on your judgement is not the issue; the bias is there whether it effects you or not.
    Favouritism would be a better word than bias in this case.

  12. #27
    Hall of Fame Member aussie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt79 View Post
    Would just like to clarify that neither Ben Dorries or Aussie speak for most of the Aussie fans. Dorries is ****e, even in terms of the very low regard I have for journos. The conspiracy theories trotted out suggesting there's anything more at play than dumb **** journos being lazy in search of stuff for their columns is amusing however.
    I dont need to, want to or have to. This is a cricket chat forum where everyones opinion is as good as the other person.

    FTR. I dont agree with this Ben Dorries individual, i was just responding to post by an individual that i disagree with, before dishonestbharani came out throwin the stupid "i am biased" crap.

    Quote Originally Posted by honestbharani
    lol.. I know aussie doesn't really speak for the majority of Aussie fans, mate.. Juz find it laughable that the guy is turning into a mini-Richard.. At least Richard acknowledges that he is wrong sometimes and doesn't always maintain as if he knows everything about cricket...
    No this is your usual inaccurate interpretation of my views on cricket.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    That doesn't mean anything. In 2002/03 according to those rating systems SA became # 1in the world after AUS had smoked them over 6 tests.

    Australia are no longer the dominant force of 95 to 2006/07. But they remain the best test nation in the world clearly.
    Um, no. SA are just ahead of them based on recent form in test cricket. Though they each won a series against each other in the winter, Australia in the last year lost to both England and India whereas SA did far better in their tours there. Before SA lost to Australia, they were undefeated for 12 series.

    You could also make the case that SA are a better ODI side than Australia given that they trounced them 4-1 both home and away in the winter as well.

  14. #29
    Cricketer Of The Year four_or_six's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ilovecric View Post
    Did the WI media make a big deal about ENG after WI bowled out eng for 51 ?

    Are you slow ?

    If there is one team that should never bad talk WI its eng.
    There was a pretty harsh reaction after England got bowled out for 51, but I don't read the WI media so I don't know what their reaction was.

    I don't see why someone from England can't comment negatively on the performance of the West Indies just because England lost a test match to them this year.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    How is AUS current pace trio unproven?. All of them have proven themselves in test cricket in various ways in the last 12 months & currently are better than IND & SA at full strenght & depth wise.
    Johnson was supposed to be the next big deal but was completely average in England. Siddle is lively but hardly seems the type to run through any side and lacks penetration when the pitch doesn't offer something. Both of these guys are inconsistent and none of Aussie's bowlers are on Steyn's level. They also looked toothless when they last played in the subcontinent. Not so Steyn.

    Quote Originally Posted by aussie View Post
    Yes this proves my point about AUS inconsistency in this McWarne era thus far. AUS losted that series more so to poor selection & SA took advantage of them. As aforementioned if SA & AUS play in test series right now i would back AUS to win.
    No, Australia lost that series primarily because of their bowlers' inability to dismiss SA. And shouldn't SA who didn't lose their last 12 series before they lost recently to Australia be rated higher for their consistency?
    Last edited by subshakerz; 02-12-2009 at 09:36 AM.

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