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Test Seond innings highest averages?

SaeedAnwar

U19 Debutant
If you only count the second innings test batting averages, who has the highest average? also who has the most runs, most centuries batting in second innings????
 

Furball

Evil Scotsman
If you only count the second innings test batting averages, who has the highest average? also who has the most runs, most centuries batting in second innings????
Minimum qualification: 30 innings

Highest average: Don Bradman (2299 runs @ 104.50)
Most runs: Allan Border (4,371 runs @ 54.63)
Most centuries: Allan Border, Sunil Gavaskar, Matthew Hayden (11 centuries)
 

The Sean

Cricketer Of The Year
Minimum qualification: 30 innings

Highest average: Don Bradman (2299 runs @ 104.50)
Most runs: Allan Border (4,371 runs @ 54.63)
Most centuries: Allan Border, Sunil Gavaskar, Matthew Hayden (11 centuries)
Do you have a full list, or even a top 10/20?
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Pretty surprised to see Tendulkar and Lara are that far down on the list and how far up guys like Hayden and Kallis are. What with the whole "difficult conditions" perceptions people have with respect to these batsmen.
 

SaeedAnwar

U19 Debutant
this is interesting, the reason i created this thread is that in second innings it is harder to bat then the first because mostly likley the pitch is old be then. This really shows some interesting results, Lara averages only 38
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Pretty surprised to see Tendulkar and Lara are that far down on the list and how far up guys like Hayden and Kallis are. What with the whole "difficult conditions" perceptions people have with respect to these batsmen.
There's no rule whatsoever about whether the first-innings is more or less difficult than the second-innings. Sometimes the first-innings will be much easier, sometimes slightly easier, sometimes there'll be for-all-intents-and-purposes no difference, sometimes the second-innings will be much easier, sometimes slightly easier. And each batsman's case will be different. There is no way any overall record means, well, anything much really.
 

Sylvester

State Captain
Bradman with a poor 1st innings average of 97 compared to his 104 in the 2nd :) Interesting that no fast bowler dominates the bowling list, I know two spinners are way ahead in terms of overall wickets but I would have thought McGrath or Walsh would have got them in the 1st innings.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
There's no rule whatsoever about whether the first-innings is more or less difficult than the second-innings. Sometimes the first-innings will be much easier, sometimes slightly easier, sometimes there'll be for-all-intents-and-purposes no difference, sometimes the second-innings will be much easier, sometimes slightly easier. And each batsman's case will be different. There is no way any overall record means, well, anything much really.
Wow, this must be a record of consistent crap in the last few days. Keep goin' mate. Nevermind the fact that most bowlers average considerably better in the 3rd/4th innings than they do in the 1st/2nd innings.
 
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aussie

Hall of Fame Member
Wow, this must be a record of consistent crap in the last few days. Keep goin' mate.
Although he has played down the obvious difficulty of 4th innings batting, generally i think Rich is on point you know.

Two perfect examples to come to mind from AUS test matches over the years that kind of back up his argument are: Antigua 2003 & Perth 2005. Where batting last was clearly easier than batting first in both of these tests.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Although he has played down the obvious difficulty of 4th innings batting, generally i think Rich is on point you know.

Two perfect examples to come to mind from AUS test matches over the years that kind of back up his argument are: Antigua 2003 & Perth 2005. Where batting last was clearly easier than batting first in both of these tests.
The fact that it occurs is not what I am disputing, but it still usually is pretty correct to say that bowling gets easier as the pitch ages. This is reflected in bowlers' stats - of which I just checked - especially so for spinners. And going through bowlers, none of them have such a lopsided 1st and 2nd match innings as some batsmen here do.

The lopsidedness of Lara's innings record can't be explained away like that - so trying to is a bit dishonest.
 
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aussie

Hall of Fame Member
The fact that it occurs is not what I am disputing, but it still usually is pretty correct to say that bowling gets easier as the pitch ages. This is reflected in bowlers' stats - of which I just checked - especially so against spinners. And going through bowlers, none of them have such a lopsided 1st and 2nd match innings as some batsmen here do.

The lopsidedness of Lara's innings record can't be explained away like that - so trying to is a bit dishonest.
Well yes generally this is the case indeed. Circumstances like Antigua 03 & Perth 05 dont happen that often.
 

Ikki

Hall of Fame Member
Well yes generally this is the case indeed. Circumstances like Antigua 03 & Perth 05 dont happen that often.
Exactly, which is a far stretch from "there is no rule whatsoever...", as Richard tried to argue. Yeh, there may not be, but it's pretty darn consistent regardless.
 

bagapath

International Captain
sachin has been pretty disappointing in the second innings throughout his career. despite the match saving hundred in manchester in 90 and the two match winning hundreds in chennai against aus (98) and eng (08) he has more than once failed to save games. the pak hundred in chennai (99) was historic. leaving that aside i feel he should have done a lot more in the second innings in tests against SA and SL in the last three years. also remember him fumbling against pak in the second innings of a home test that resulted in a loss
 
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honestbharani

Whatever it takes!!!
The fact is batting second can be easier in a LOT of tracks.. even in India recently batting last has not been as difficult as it used to be. I wonder if we can dig out stats of the second innings in the 90s alone before we start comparing people..


The fact that second innings performances are ALWAYS directly impacted by what went on in the first innings.. For instance, a number of the Aussies who debuted or played most of their cricket after 97 or so, during their time as clear #1, would have taken the field 80% of the time with a sizeable lead behidn them.. So not so attacking fields, tired bowling attacks and basically bowlers waiting for declaration would have had HUGE bearing on their bulked up averages, compared to say, a West Indies having to face up to HUGE leads and batting with backs to the walls almost EVERY time...


And then again, there is a WORLD of difference between 3rd and 4th innings too...
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Wow, this must be a record of consistent crap in the last few days. Keep goin' mate.
If this even made grammatical sense it'd be a start, but even then it'd still be the same tired cliches over and over and over and over and over and over and over again. Try some new material sometime eh?
Nevermind the fact that most bowlers average considerably better in the 3rd/4th innings than they do in the 1st/2nd innings.
Yup, never mind indeed. Completely and totally irrelevant, but I'm really not going to bother going into why because some people never listen. Those who will realise will realise already.
 

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