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Thread: Waqar Younus master of Revers swinging Yorker

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    Waqar Younus master of Revers swinging Yorker

    what would y say ? friends

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    he bowled sachin Tendulkar .

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    Quote Originally Posted by M.Adnan View Post
    he bowled sachin Tendulkar .
    so did Cronje

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    International Vice-Captain Faisal1985's Avatar
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    He made Lara drop to his knees and bowled him too....with a reverse swinging ball..coming into the lefty..... don't know if Cronje did that???

    To me was the best reverser of the ball.
    Last edited by Faisal1985; 02-07-2009 at 11:22 AM.
    BE AFRIDI!
    Be VERY AFRIDI!!


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    Quote Originally Posted by M.Adnan View Post
    what would y say ? friends
    You mean rivers ?

    Kidding.

    Waqar was a master pace bowler - period A modern day great. If he had the charisma of Imran or Wasim we would have appreciated him more than we are willing to do for a simpleton as he was.

    To call him a master of the reverse swinging yorker is to reduce his stature I think.

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    International Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    waqar was deadly on his day. but i always thought he was a one trick pony. very good with his banana swingers; but in overall mastery of nuances of pace bowling, he was a notch below akram and two below imran.

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    wasn't Wasim Akram better? both incredible though

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    Quote Originally Posted by bagapath View Post
    waqar was deadly on his day. but i always thought he was a one trick pony. very good with his banana swingers; but in overall mastery of nuances of pace bowling, he was a notch below akram and two below imran.
    There have been many really fast bowlers who have been truly fast, accurate and with movement but no other subtleties as such and they are considered amongst all time greats.
    Larwood, Holding, Tyson and even Jefff Thomson come readily to mind.

    If a bowler can bowl really fast as waqar surely did except in his latter days, and can swing the ball, as he could with both new and old balls, and can pitch it ine line and on the length you want, you dont need much else to get the wickets of the best which is what he did and his phenomenal strike rate is testimony to that. You dont need to do more if you can do that. Trust me if the fast bowlers of today could swing like that they would do nothing but that.

    And he was a complete bowler who bowled a mean bouncer, swung the ball prodigiously at great pace. The fact that we remember his yorkers so vividly is because of the dramatic effect they had on the batsman's furniture. And yes he did bowl them a lot because they got them wickets. In fact, although he had a mean bouncer, he has been known to consider bowling lots of bouncers a waste of time if the ball was swinging.

    Of course when you swing you pitch up - when you bowl yorkers you pitch further up so you will end up bowling half volleies at times. He did not mind that because at times even shin high full tosses at pace got him wickets with batsmen falling over themselves to avoid the furiously darting swinging ball. Most such bowlers will be wicket takers and a tad on the expensive side but they maintain the true tradition of great fast bowling.

    I dont want to compare him with the great Imran of to Wasim but I think to call Waqar a one trick pony is to do great injustice to one of the finest fast bowlers in living memory.

    A lot has been written about Waqar by his contemporaries which one can quote but here is something relevant (and right in front of my eyes as I was writing this post) from the book Letting Rip by Simon Wilde :-

    Waqar Younis and wasim Akram, Pakistan's opening bowlers have given you some uncomfortable moments. The most striking thing about them is that they are always trying something different. They are not just content to bowl just fast, or ping the ball around your head; they try to swing the ball and are capable of doing so both ways. . . Waqar, remarkably began by bowling at his top pace. He seemed to have no need to loosen up at all, he just started bowling fast from the outset. . . . he is capable of a distinctly lively pace and was reportedly still in his teens, when Martin Crowe, the New Zealand captain, said late in 1990 that Waqar was the fastest bowler he had ever faced.


    Wasim and Imran maybe better bowlers and were better bowlers but I wrote just to remind that Waqar was not just a mater of reverse swing, he was a very fast bowler who swung the new ball and also could reverse swing and that made him very dangerous indeed.

    I often tell my children who are great fans of Tendulkar, naturally, that if there is one thing which gave me even more pleasure and a great tingling sensation all over was when Waqar Younis started his run up. You always expected something dramatic to happen with every delivery. I cant think of feeling that way with any other bowler except Imran during one India Pakistan series.

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    what about mark ealham

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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS View Post
    There have been many really fast bowlers who have been truly fast, accurate and with movement but no other subtleties as such and they are considered amongst all time greats.
    Larwood, Holding, Tyson and even Jefff Thomson come readily to mind.

    If a bowler can bowl really fast as waqar surely did except in his latter days, and can swing the ball, as he could with both new and old balls, and can pitch it ine line and on the length you want, you dont need much else to get the wickets of the best which is what he did and his phenomenal strike rate is testimony to that. You dont need to do more if you can do that. Trust me if the fast bowlers of today could swing like that they would do nothing but that.

    And he was a complete bowler who bowled a mean bouncer, swung the ball prodigiously at great pace. The fact that we remember his yorkers so vividly is because of the dramatic effect they had on the batsman's furniture. And yes he did bowl them a lot because they got them wickets. In fact, although he had a mean bouncer, he has been known to consider bowling lots of bouncers a waste of time if the ball was swinging.

    Of course when you swing you pitch up - when you bowl yorkers you pitch further up so you will end up bowling half volleies at times. He did not mind that because at times even shin high full tosses at pace got him wickets with batsmen falling over themselves to avoid the furiously darting swinging ball. Most such bowlers will be wicket takers and a tad on the expensive side but they maintain the true tradition of great fast bowling.

    I dont want to compare him with the great Imran of to Wasim but I think to call Waqar a one trick pony is to do great injustice to one of the finest fast bowlers in living memory.

    A lot has been written about Waqar by his contemporaries which one can quote but here is something relevant (and right in front of my eyes as I was writing this post) from the book Letting Rip by Simon Wilde :-

    Waqar Younis and wasim Akram, Pakistan's opening bowlers have given you some uncomfortable moments. The most striking thing about them is that they are always trying something different. They are not just content to bowl just fast, or ping the ball around your head; they try to swing the ball and are capable of doing so both ways. . . Waqar, remarkably began by bowling at his top pace. He seemed to have no need to loosen up at all, he just started bowling fast from the outset. . . . he is capable of a distinctly lively pace and was reportedly still in his teens, when Martin Crowe, the New Zealand captain, said late in 1990 that Waqar was the fastest bowler he had ever faced.


    Wasim and Imran maybe better bowlers and were better bowlers but I wrote just to remind that Waqar was not just a mater of reverse swing, he was a very fast bowler who swung the new ball and also could reverse swing and that made him very dangerous indeed.

    I often tell my children who are great fans of Tendulkar, naturally, that if there is one thing which gave me even more pleasure and a great tingling sensation all over was when Waqar Younis started his run up. You always expected something dramatic to happen with every delivery. I cant think of feeling that way with any other bowler except Imran during one India Pakistan series.

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    International Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    thanks SJS... agree with what you say....

    but somehow i thought waqar could be dominated by a good batsman for an extended period of a match that could spell doom for his team. tendulkar in toronto, lara in sharjah and jadeja in b'lore come to mind. of course, even great bowlers like him have off days. but not having a plan B when his original plan was torn apart by a rampaging batsman was waqar's biggest weakness. i cant really single out spells from wasim or imran or mcgrath or ambrose that could have cost matches on their own. that is why i think waqar is a limited bowler within the coterie of the great bowlers.

    in a one-day international in 1987 ravi shastri was going hammer and tongs when india was chasing 270 + in a truncated game. i remember him whacking qadir and tauseef out of the part when imran brought himself on. shastri made room for himself and hit imran straight over his head for the most beautiful six i have seen (of course, it is not the best six ever; but for a school kid it was enough and i still hold that moment dear!). it was followed by a trademark flick to the square leg boundary. i remember gavaskar, the non-striker, having the widest grin on his face.

    imran, contrary to what others might have tried at the moment, did not try to york shastri and feed him on his strong leg side. instead he controlled his anger, great fast bowlers dont like to be driven straight for sixers - hooking is somewhat okay, and controlled his line and length. shastri who at that time was batting on 39 from 16 balls (an unheard of SR in those days) started struggling for runs. imran tightened the line and length further and further frustrating the batsman in such good form (shastri was the man of the series despite india losing the series big time) and finally bowled him a beautiful out swinger when shastri moved to the leg and created room once again. ravi tried the straight drive again. but with the ball swinging away this time, it caught a wrong spot on the bat and ballooned to the mid wicket and the indian challenge was over.

    waqar won so many matches for his team. but when the going got tough he crumbled more often than other greats. not taking anything away from him. just trying to find a more suitable place for him in the pantheon of greats.
    Last edited by bagapath; 03-07-2009 at 12:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bagapath View Post
    thanks SJS... agree with what you say....

    but somehow i thought waqar could be dominated by a good batsman for an extended period of a match that could spell doom for his team. tendulkar in toronto, lara in sharjah and jadeja in b'lore come to mind. of course, even great bowlers like him have off days. but not having a plan B when his original plan was torn apart by a rampaging batsman was waqar's biggest weakness. i cant really single out spells from wasim or imran or mcgrath or ambrose that could have cost matches on their own. that is why i think waqar is a limited bowler within the coterie of the great bowlers.

    in a one-day international in 1987 ravi shastri was going hammer and tongs when india was chasing 270 + in a truncated game. i remember him whacking qadir and tauseef out of the part when imran brought himself on. shastri made room for himself and hit imran straight over his head for the most beautiful six i have seen (of course, it is not the best six ever; but for a school kid it was enough and i still hold that moment dear!). it was followed by a trademark flick to the square leg boundary. i remember gavaskar, the non-striker, having the widest grin on his face.

    imran, contrary to what others might have tried at the moment, did not try to york shastri and feed him on his strong leg side. instead he controlled his anger, great fast bowlers dont like to be driven straight for sixers - hooking is somewhat okay, and controlled his line and length. shastri who at that time was batting on 39 from 16 balls (an unheard of SR in those days) started struggling for runs. imran tightened the line and length further and further frustrating the batsman in such good form (shastri was the man of the series despite india losing the series big time) and finally bowled him a beautiful out swinger when shastri moved to the leg and created room once again. ravi tried the straight drive again. but with the ball swinging away this time, it caught a wrong spot on the bat and ballooned to the mid wicket and the indian challenge was over.

    waqar won so many matches for his team. but when the going got tough he crumbled more often than other greats. not taking anything away from him. just trying to find a more suitable place for him in the pantheon of greats.
    I dont know about the specific instances so cant comment but its possible. As you mentioned any bowler can be taken to the cleaners and I have seen Imran getting hammered too.

    But I would not criticise Waqar for sticking to his strengths just like I would not criticise Bishen Bedi for continuing to flight the ball and tempting the batsman again even when he was being hit. Most flair players will play their way. Amongst batsmen, Milburn and Sehwag come readily to mind. We all get upset with Sehwag when he plays a shot completely out of place in the circumstances and gets out but thats what he is and we still take him as he is. If he batted differently he may, who knows, score more or score less but would we want to risk losing such a masterful stroke player.

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    SJS! your analogy is right on the money. waqar is similar in attitude to bedi and sehwag. i am just saying he is no akram, warne or sachin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bagapath View Post
    SJS! your analogy is right on the money. waqar is similar in attitude to bedi and sehwag. i am just saying he is no akram, warne or sachin.
    I never said he is

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    Quote Originally Posted by SJS View Post
    I never said he is
    of course u never did. i wasn't arguing with you (or anyone else). just expressing my opinion on waqar. and i think i have consistently referred to his legitimate claim to greatness even when running him down in comparison with more all-round fast bowlers.

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