SehwagVsGilchrist

[metallics2006]

Am I the only one who skipped the 1/11, 1/18, etc stuff here completely?

[Sanz]

This thread started off so well, but, like most comparison threads, it has followed the same route to become crap. I must say, its not just Warne Vs. Murali threads but almost all comparison threads end up same way.

Can we put a ban on comparison threads for a while in order to encourage members to be more creative with thread topics ?

[honestbharani]

Originally Posted by wfdu_ben91

A country is not a continent though.

Pitches in the subcontient are fairly similar to eachother and a subcontient player plays about 70-80% of his career in the subcontient - so obviously his record in the subcontient is going to outweight his average outside of the subcontient. It's basically like having a longer career at home. Here is a relevant statistic when it comes to comparing Hayden & Sehwag and the contrasting conditons they play in...

Sehwag averages 56 in the subcontient and 43 outside the subcontient.
Hayden averages 50 in the subcontient and 50 outside the subcontient.

As far as the Ponting average in India goes, I only went-by that because during the latter end of that series they showed a graphic of the leading runscorers in the series and Ponting averaged 46. I just assumed and obviously forgot that he failed in his last Test innings of that series, which would've brought his average down. My bad.

India toured Sri Lanka only once with Sehwag was a regular test player and we toured Pakistan twice... That is 3 tours in his career of almost 8 years... How is that going to MAJORLY affect his rating? And why is it difficult to look at Hayden's figues home and away and see how it compares with Sehwag????



I agree reg. your assessment about Sehwag being similar to Gayle and Tresco but so was Hayden. Ok, he was a little bit better than Sehwag but then Hayden had time to work on his weaknesses as well.. Let us see how Sehwag goes as he gets more matches and experience into himself... Where Sehwag (and Hayden, for that matter) differ from blokes like Tresco (Gayle, I feel, has talent similar to these two, so his issue, for me, is different), is that they are ridiculously good when the conditions are favourable to them.. They do things that not even a Lara or a Tendulkar or a Ponting can do most of the times... They score so fast (Sehwag quite quicker than Hayden) that they invariably create winning opportunities on flat tracks.. That is sometimes as difficult to achieve as achieving a draw on a difficult track... Hayden for me is about 25% better than Sehwag in swinging and seaming conditions (I put them equal in spinning tracks) but that is made up by the fact that Sehwag is almost that much ahead in terms of destructiveness on the good batting tracks, where you need all the time you can gain to force a result... And he constructs bigger knocks than Hayden does too.... All these things need to be factored in...


And the thing about flat tracks is... it is STILL cricket. I can understand someone like Jayawardene who almost invariably struggles in difficult conditions and cashes in on easy paced tracks but with someone like Sehwag.... when he struggles, most of the time the others struggle too and for those occassions when he gets found out while others do well, there is the fact that he does so so much more than most other players on the flat tracks which gives his side a HUGE chance to get a result if they are good enough....


I have said before that Haydos and Sehwag are criminally underrated here... Nothing has changed..

[0RI0N]

Originally Posted by metallics2006

Am I the only one who skipped the 1/11, 1/18, etc stuff here completely?

/no

[wfdu_ben91]

Originally Posted by honestbharani

India toured Sri Lanka only once with Sehwag was a regular test player and we toured Pakistan twice... That is 3 tours in his career of almost 8 years... How is that going to MAJORLY affect his rating? And why is it difficult to look at Hayden's figues home and away and see how it compares with Sehwag????



I agree reg. your assessment about Sehwag being similar to Gayle and Tresco but so was Hayden. Ok, he was a little bit better than Sehwag but then Hayden had time to work on his weaknesses as well.. Let us see how Sehwag goes as he gets more matches and experience into himself... Where Sehwag (and Hayden, for that matter) differ from blokes like Tresco (Gayle, I feel, has talent similar to these two, so his issue, for me, is different), is that they are ridiculously good when the conditions are favourable to them.. They do things that not even a Lara or a Tendulkar or a Ponting can do most of the times... They score so fast (Sehwag quite quicker than Hayden) that they invariably create winning opportunities on flat tracks.. That is sometimes as difficult to achieve as achieving a draw on a difficult track... Hayden for me is about 25% better than Sehwag in swinging and seaming conditions (I put them equal in spinning tracks) but that is made up by the fact that Sehwag is almost that much ahead in terms of destructiveness on the good batting tracks, where you need all the time you can gain to force a result... And he constructs bigger knocks than Hayden does too.... All these things need to be factored in...


And the thing about flat tracks is... it is STILL cricket. I can understand someone like Jayawardene who almost invariably struggles in difficult conditions and cashes in on easy paced tracks but with someone like Sehwag.... when he struggles, most of the time the others struggle too and for those occassions when he gets found out while others do well, there is the fact that he does so so much more than most other players on the flat tracks which gives his side a HUGE chance to get a result if they are good enough....


I have said before that Haydos and Sehwag are criminally underrated here... Nothing has changed..

Yeah but Hayden has been one of the major reasons for Australia's dominance. His success as an Opening Batsman has helped everyone single middle-order batsman that has played for Australia over the past decade.

Hell, even Ricky Ponting has benefitted from playing along side Hayden. Ponting averaged in the low 40's before Hayden got a permanant spot in the Australian team.

To say that Hayden would've struggled in a lesser team, is just incorrect because if anything he would've made them stronger.

[Top_Cat]

Originally Posted by wfdu_ben91

Hell, even Ricky Ponting has benefitted from playing along side Hayden. Ponting averaged in the low 40's before Hayden got a permanant spot in the Australian team.

Bit of a long bow to draw there.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by Precambrian

Ikki

Ah ok, it can get a bit confusing if someone posts between you reading and replying.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by vic_orthdox

Alright, enough is enough.

If you wish to keep on posting around here, Ben, you'll rid yourself of the following ideas:

a) our forum members here are illiterate

Fair point you've made though Jack...I just found that line funny for some reason.

[Son Of Coco]

Originally Posted by Sanz

This thread started off so well, but, like most comparison threads, it has followed the same route to become crap. I must say, its not just Warne Vs. Murali threads but almost all comparison threads end up same way.

Can we put a ban on comparison threads for a while in order to encourage members to be more creative with thread topics ?

And on 'Battle' threads before we get to 'The Battle of the Sandshoes'.

[SJS]

Since South Africa were taken back in the fold by the cricketing world, Australia have toured that country 5 times to play 15 Test matches (including the ongoing one). 18 batsmen (not counting bowlers, keepers not particularly known for their batting and players who have played only in South Africa during this period and not elsewhere) have represented Australia during this period. Here is how they have fared on tour to South Africa and in all other Test cricket since March 1994 when Australia first toured after the long boycott.

Batsman    	ROW	IN SAF

Ponting, R T	56.4	57.0
Waugh, S R	56.2	50.3
Hussey, M E K	58.9	38.9
Hayden, M L	52.6	34.7
Martyn, D R	49.6	41.2
Clarke, M J	49.4	23.5
Gilchrist, A C	46.3	65.4
Langer, J L	47.4	30.4
Katich, S M	43.4	41.2
Waugh, M E	42.4	43.6
Slater, M J	41.6	50.2
Symonds, A	42.5	25.3
Taylor, M A	41.2	19.7
Haddin, B J	38.7	36.8
Boon, D C	30.6	55.4
Blewett, G S	32.6	54.2
Elliott, M T G	33.0	36.4
Bevan, M G	31.0	18.0

ALL Batsmen	47.1	41.6

ROW : Rest of the World
All Batsmen is the combined average for these players only.

Its interesting to see that on what are clearly the most bowler friendly conditions (maybe not so much for spinners) the Aussies have pretty much held their own and the drop in averages is not dramatic. No wonder Australia with such batting performance havent lost a single series. After drawing the very first they have won four in a row (including the current one. Of the 13 Tests that had a result they have won ten.

Others havent done so well. India has one of the worst performances amongst the major Test playing countries in South Africa.

India first toured SAF in November 1992. They have made 4 tours for 13 Tests. By coincidence the same number, 18, batsmen have played for India in South Africa. These 18 have a combined batting average during the same period of 46.5 while batting in the rest of the world. Just a fraction lower than the Aussies. Yet India have lost all the four series. The reason is to be found, first and foremost in the failure of their batsmen in alien conditions. Have a look.

Player	ROW	In SAF

Shastri	108.5	11.8
Sachin	58.7	39.8
Dravid	54.3	33.6
Sehwag	53.2	26.4
Amre	51.2	33.8
Azhar	45.5	23.3
Laxman	44.6	41.1
Ganguly	42.7	36.1
Dhoni	37.2	26.0
Das	36.9	18.0
Jaffer	34.5	30.8
Raman	34.0	7.2
M'rekar	32.3	23.2
Kapil 	30.1	40.4
Prbhkar	29.0	18.7
Karthik	27.1	101.0
Jadeja	26.5	24.8
Rathore	10.8	16.5

TOTAL	46.5	30.1 

The problem is like an epidemic. Its like yellow fever in Africa which the Indian batsmen are not immune to