Precambrian
Banned
4.62 RPO would get him in any team as the spinner even at those averages. Please don;t forget Murali was up against Indians and Pakistanis during this period, who are known to play finger spin fairly well.
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Murali breaks record for most ODI wickets, what a champion!
- Thread starter Precambrian
- Start date
Athlai
Not Terrible
Yes you are right in the last year Vettori hs easily been the worst Test spinner in the world. (excluding Ban/Zim) I mean 34 wickets @ 32.97 in the spinning paradises of NZ/Eng/Aus. Harby has 58 @ 28.60 and the ball never spins in India.
Pfft Monty is far better 40 @ 35.32, not a single gifted wicket either.
Why the next best bowler who isn't from the subcontinent is Jeetan ****ing Patel with 14 wickets at 31.28. Un-fecking believable.
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Precambrian
Banned
Jeetan Patel not from the subcontinent? ITSTL.
Athlai
Not Terrible
Haha same to be said about Monty.
But Jeets born in the good ol' United States (ignore that) of New Zealand.
Uppercut
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I'm not sure how you managed to equate "not as good as Murali" with "worst test spinner in the world".
Athlai
Not Terrible
Better than current Murali at Tests basically meaning best Test spinner in the world. Vettori is surely not far off this mark.
Players to displace him:
Murali, Mendis, Shakib, Harby all maybes
Your answer 'Ouch, DWTA strongly'
Ridiculous.
Mr Mxyzptlk
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I didn't say Vettori is as good or better than Murali though. I just indicated that the gap is not as large as it once was, or as some may believe. Having seen Murali and Vettori bowl in the past year, there's not as much in it as I've to expect.
This is not "any spinner" though. This is Muralitharan and that represents a sharp decline.
Before the period in question he averaged 26podd against India and Pakistan. Economy rate of 4.06. And his averages were virtually the same against each opposition, if you think that one or the other may be skewing the figures. Nuff said I think.
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Hardly ridiculous. I'd say the same if someone were to suggest that any other spinner is "almost as good a test bowler as Murali". Being second best doesn't necessarily mean being close to Murali.
Mr Mxyzptlk
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And being Murali doesn't necessarily mean you're significantly better than the chasing pack.
Athlai
Not Terrible
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Of course not, no. If an in-form Kumble or Mushtaq, for instance, was still around, they'd be close to or as good as the current Murali. But as it is i still think the Murali of today isn't really comparable with anyone else in tests.
JBH001
International Regular
Agreed. Although I have been saying this for a little while now. I have been watching Murali for years, and what is more noticeable now is that he putting less into the ball at the point of delivery which means less zip, which means less turn, and crucially for Murali, less dip. All of this means that it becomes easier to play him. This is not to say that he is incapable of great spells of bowling, he still is - but, I think, these will become more few and far between. Also, I think he has become a more defensive - less up for the fight with opposing batsmen than he used to be, especially if they come at him. IMO its probably a combination of physical and mental fatigue. It will be interesting to see how he goes in the return test series in India. But I hope he hangs up his boots by the end of this year.
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JBH001
International Regular
Vettori is, I think, the best ODI spinner around at the moment - although he still does not take many wickets. I dont know about tests though - I reckon Murali is still the better bowler in that format of the game (if, perhaps, not by much). And frankly, its all too easy to point to the fact that Vettori plays a lot of his cricket in non-spin friendly NZ conditions when his overall overseas average is 32 and his home average is 34. Hardly a drastic difference. He is better than Harbhajan though - in both formats of the game. That guy is over-rated. Nothing against Vettori, but some kiwi posters, imo, think him a better bowler than he is, and get too worked up and defensive when he is questioned. Vettori is a fine bowler, and is now at the top of his game, but he was and always will be below the top tier of world class spinners.
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JBH001
International Regular
Yeah, totally agree with that. Vettori the better ODI bowler, and Murali the better test bowler, but not by much. Nor would I be surprised to see Vettori surpass Murali this year in test cricket either to become the best spinner in both formats of the game. He seems very aware of his strengths, these days, and consistently bowls to them.