View Poll Results: On the subject of Malcolm Marshall, do you consider ...

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  • ... he was EITHER the best bowler of all-time OR the second-best after SF Barnes

    25 41.67%
  • ... someone other than SF Barnes was better than him

    33 55.00%
  • I have no real interest in cricket history so I don't have much of an opinion on him

    2 3.33%
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Thread: Do you consider Malcolm Marshall...

  1. #136
    U19 Debutant Lambu's Avatar
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    Curtly Ambrose--the best ever imo.

  2. #137
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Uppercut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rant0r View Post
    yeah but shorter bowlers bowl those skidding bouncers that are hard to get out of the way of and get on you quickly
    Yeah, height doesn't particularly scare me, nor does back of a length bowling. It's difficult to explain. Short, tanked-out flying machines always put the fear of God into me moreso than body builders. Maybe it comes from playing rugby.
    Quote Originally Posted by zaremba View Post
    The Filth have comfortably the better bowling. But the Gash have the batting. Might be quite good to watch.

  3. #138
    Cricket Web Staff Member archie mac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rant0r View Post
    you could also argue that the effort of marshall to stand out in his team was greater than the effort of lillee to stand out in his, of course the commentators were in awe of his performance with little help at times, but to stand out in a team of champions is a huge effort.
    True and you could even go further the other way and argue that Hadlee being the only decent bowler in his team could pick up more wickets as the only real threat
    You know it makes sense.

  4. #139
    International 12th Man Rant0r's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by archie mac View Post
    True and you could even go further the other way and argue that Hadlee being the only decent bowler in his team could pick up more wickets as the only real threat
    did anyone carry his team as much as hadlee in the 80's ?


  5. #140
    International Regular JBH001's Avatar
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    Murali perhaps? Especially overseas?

  6. #141
    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Nah, he had Vaas.
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  7. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rant0r View Post
    did anyone carry his team as much as hadlee in the 80's ?
    Quote Originally Posted by JBH001 View Post
    Murali perhaps? Especially overseas?
    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    Nah, he had Vaas.
    Murali I'd say. Also Andy Flower. Allan Border in the mid-80s. Brian Lara and now Shiv Chandrapaul at times for the Windies.
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  8. #143
    Global Moderator nightprowler10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    Nah, he had Vaas.
    Overseas?
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  9. #144
    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightprowler10 View Post
    Overseas?
    Average of 32.5 is not that bad IMO. Zoysa and Malinga also average around 32-33 overseas. When IND, PAK and BAN removed from the equation (as they produce spin friendly pitches) Vaas still averages 33, Malinga 33.5 and Zoysa 31.5 to go with Murali's 25.9.
    Last edited by Migara; 06-12-2008 at 03:57 AM.

  10. #145
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Migara View Post
    Average of 32.5 is not that bad IMO
    when you are discusssing greatness, 32.5 is quite poor IMO

  11. #146
    International Captain Migara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bagapath View Post
    when you are discusssing greatness, 32.5 is quite poor IMO
    I thought we were discussing about support, not greatness?

  12. #147
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    cool. i misuderstood it.

  13. #148
    International Regular JBH001's Avatar
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    Hmm, Vaas has a better overseas average than I had thought. Although, iirc, he does tend to not take too many wickets (on a wickets/test basis). Also, I doubt I can include Zoysa and Malinga as they are both, imo, a little too recent to count and have not taken enough wickets or played enough tests (although I might be a little picky here). Murali's ascent to greatness (if I can call it that) began in 97/98 after the home and away series to India (where, iirc, a couple of fearful tonkings from Sidhu made him revise the length he was bowling) and Zoysa and Malinga only begin to figure from 2006 onwards. Vaas, however, was - as you rightly say - there througout.

    Also, if we are talking about support, then we should certainly count Chatfield and Cairns who were great foils for Hadlee. Although none of these, Sri Lankan or Kiwi, were or are in the same league as the WI 'support' quicks that Marshall had around him.
    Last edited by JBH001; 06-12-2008 at 03:51 PM.

  14. #149
    International Vice-Captain bagapath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBH001 View Post
    Hmm, Vaas has a better overseas average than I had thought. Although, iirc, he does tend to not take too many wickets (on a wickets/test basis). Also, I doubt I can include Zoysa and Malinga as they are both, imo, a little too recent to count and have not taken enough wickets or played enough tests (although I might be a little picky here). Murali's ascent to greatness (if I can call it that) began in 97/98 after the home and away series to India (where, iirc, a couple of fearful tonkings from Sidhu made him revise the length he was bowling) and Zoysa and Malinga only begin to figure from 2006 onwards. Vaas, however, was - as you rightly say - there througout.

    Also, if we are talking about support, then we should certainly count Chatfield and Cairns who were great foils for Hadlee. Although none of these, Sri Lankan or Kiwi, were or are in the same league as the WI 'support' quicks that Marshall had around him.
    in the days of marshall, patterson, davis and walsh were the support acts. holding and garner were spearheads in their own right. although, due to the age factor, and ofcourse superior skills, marshall had his nose ahead of them since 82-83.
    Last edited by bagapath; 06-12-2008 at 09:41 PM.

  15. #150
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Yeah, Marshall's career - in terms of who he played alongside - is an interesting one. He first played Test cricket genuinely in 1980 in England, but his first 9 Tests (4 in England in 1980; all 4 in Pakistan in 1980/81; then 1 more at home to England in 1981) all came as a fill-in, when one or more of Roberts, Holding, Garner and Croft were unavailable. He mixed the good with the bad in this time (I'd say he had 3 excellent games, 3 moderate and 3 poor) and overall they produced an average of 26.41.

    Croft left the team and in '83, Marshall finally became a first-choice, and on a couple of occasions played alongside Roberts, Holding and Garner in what is surely the best first-choice attack West Indies have ever fielded. However, Garner picked-up a bad injury meaning this lasted just 2 games. By the time he was back, and just 2 series' (both against India) after Marshall became established, Roberts then retired. For the next 3 years it was Marshall, Holding, Garner and someone else. In '84 against Australia and England, it was Baptiste. In '84/85, Walsh debuted. Then Winston Davis returned in '85, then in '86 it was Patrick Patterson debuting. In this "first leg", '83 to '86, Marshall picked-up 181 wickets in 33 matches at 19.64

    The "second leg" of Marshall's career begun in '86/87, when Holding and Garner quickly waned and were gone. In the 36 matches comprising it, he picked-up 161 wickets in 36 matches at 20.10. His support acts here were the likes of Tony Gray, Patterson, Walsh, Bishop, Ambrose and Winston Benjamin. None too shabby by any stretch of the imagination, but somehow not quite to my mind in the Holding and Garner league - with the exception of the injury-plagued Bishop and, eventually (but not straight away, and not until Marshall's career was almost over) Ambrose.
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