who should be kicked out of England ODI team?

[Richard]

Are you really saying that Grayson > Bresnan? I mean Bresnan was crap then, but he bowled really well against Lancs on Friday. A good ODI player of the future IMO.

I'm far from sure about that. Yes, Bresnan has indeed bowled well this season, in one-day and Championship cricket (and maybe Twenty20 too, I don't care) but this season is the first time he's ever done anything of note. And he played ODIs before he'd done that. I can't say I'm really expecting him to go well in ODIs in future, but if he can continue then repeat this season, he'll have earned another go.

That said, Grayson was awful too. Neither remotely good at batting or bowling.

 

[Richard]

Haha, after the 1st ODI this team was being heralded as very good and in need of respect.

What happened?

British implusiveness. I said it in the tour thread - it's exactly the same every time England win the opening ODI of a series. A crap team gets heralded as brilliant.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

In essence, though, bits-and-pieces players are not the main problem. Yes, the likes of Matthew Fleming, Dougie Brown, Neil Smith and Adam Hollioake himself were never going to be ODI-class cricketers (or Vince Wells, selected shortly afterwards), but nor were specialists selected around the same time like Graham Lloyd, Chris Silverwood and Alastair Brown. Picking bad specialists has been every bit as much of a problem as picking useless bits-and-pieces cricketers.

That's precisely what I meant in the quoted post. They decided to copy the Australian model of a different captain and specialist ODI players. What they failed to grasp was most of the players Australia were picking were genuine International quality cricketers and also Australia could have played their full Test team in ODI's and would still have won anyway.

 

[steds]

As things currently stand, Luke Wright and Ravi Bopara are just wasting batting places and oxygen.




That's a quality sig Lillian Thomson's got, btw.

 

[Burgey]

Is Tremlett now considered an ODI specialist in England?

 

[Goughy]

But Goughy sir, thats just basically looking at plain stats. Following Shah's career one would see over the past year at least he has found a role @ 6 that he is doing a decent job in after years of being juggled around the side.

In the last year he has only 3 scores of over 50 in 21 games.

In games in 2008 he averages under 20.

I cant see what you are trying to prove. He is a player that has underperformed to such an extent that his position is only acceptable to those with the highest tolerance for mediocrity.

Shah has been an ODI failure. There is no other conclusion to draw.

 

[aussie]

In the last year he has only 3 scores of over 50 in 21 games.

In games in 2008 he averages under 20.

I cant see what you are trying to prove. He is a player that has underperformed to such an extent that his position is only acceptable to those with the highest tolerance for mediocrity.

Shah has been an ODI failure. There is not other conclusion to draw.

What, he's played 2 innings where he's bashed it at the end? 1 in which he should've been out long before the bash was on.

Shah is poor and always has been poor. Yes, he's done a bit better this time around, wherever he's batted, than he did in his previous two stints in the side, but he's still been damn poor.

Ha, oh the stats I don't know where to start with you too, but if this is the impression you two have gottom of Shah since his recall last year then i must we have been watching two different Owaish Shah's then.

Good god what do you want from him to be Bevanesque & be super consistent?. He hasn't been fantastic but he has found a role @ # 6 & is doing a fair job at it ATM. You two make it sound since he came back last year that he has looked totally out of his depth.

This is the problem with some English supporters when it comes to our ODI team selection, we are not AUSTRALIA OR SOUTH AFRICA so stop unfairly matching our players up againts them & continiously ridiculing then after every slight hiccup since the current group of players in the ODI set-up is without doubt the best in the land ATM.

So instead of foolishing attacking them gentlemen i.e Bell is too easy to set a field to, Anderson's too expensive, Shah is piss poor has the worst average crap, even though they aren't as consistent as we would like they have shown enough bloody times they can do it at the highest level so just back them, damn yo cut those fellas some slack.

This foolish mentally among English supporters can ever be traced to the Football team ATM. We have obvious talented young players like Noble, Young, Walcott, Johnson around yes they aren't of the quality of the Fabregas's, Ronaldos, Robbens, Benzemas, Nasris etc but we don't have a clairfontaine our players don't inherit great technical ability from a young age some do it later on look at Gareth Barry 7 years @ Villa playing with the best in world & potentially could become our passing machine. Until Burton is up & run we expect to produce such players & the football world to no longer view ENG as a long ball team. (Sorry had to get this out).

Simply put English fans need to appreciate what we have & slop being so damn picky yo...

 

[aussie]

Luke Wright - hopeless.
Philip Mustard - hopeless.

Nah. They should be in the still to convince category.

 

[Goughy]

Its not stats, its called performance.

There is a certain performance level that isnt acceptable in the long run.

The point is that certain players have not performed at the highest level often. Its why England are a poor OD team.

What you are saying is exactly why England has a history of producing average teams. Mediocraty is accepted as success and one innings every blue moon is considered as showing capability.

The problem is that other nations dont have such a lax attitude. An element of consistency and high productivity is desired rather than the occasional spark.

 

[Richard]

Nah. They should be in the still to convince category.

Both convinced me long ago that they're very, very poor batsmen. Long before they played international cricket.

 

[Goughy]

Both convinced me long ago that they're very, very poor batsmen. Long before they played international cricket.

Some players regress, some imporve and some stay the same.

Id agree that neither are convincing right now. Both need to do the business in CC to deserve their places and show they have made the progression required.

 

[Richard]

Ha, oh the stats I don't know where to start with you too, but if this is the impression you two have gottom of Shah since his recall last year then i must we have been watching two different Owaish Shah's then.

Good god what do you want from him to be Bevanesque & be super consistent?. He hasn't been fantastic but he has found a role @ # 6 & is doing a fair job at it ATM. You two make it sound since he came back last year that he has looked totally out of his depth.

This is the problem with some English supporters when it comes to our ODI team selection, we are not AUSTRALIA OR SOUTH AFRICA so stop unfairly matching our players up againts them & continiously ridiculing then after every slight hiccup since the current group of players in the ODI set-up is without doubt the best in the land ATM.

So instead of foolishing attacking them gentlemen i.e Bell is too easy to set a field to, Anderson's too expensive, Shah is piss poor has the worst average crap, even though they aren't as consistent as we would like they have shown enough bloody times they can do it at the highest level so just back them, damn yo cut those fellas some slack.

This foolish mentally among English supporters can ever be traced to the Football team ATM. We have obvious talented young players like Noble, Young, Walcott, Johnson around yes they aren't of the quality of the Fabregas's, Ronaldos, Robbens, Benzemas, Nasris etc but we don't have a clairfontaine our players don't inherit great technical ability from a young age some do it later on look at Gareth Barry 7 years @ Villa playing with the best in world & potentially could become our passing machine. Until Burton is up & run we expect to produce such players & the football world to no longer view ENG as a long ball team. (Sorry had to get this out).

Simply put English fans need to appreciate what we have & slop being so damn picky yo...

If we had no-one better, it'd be all good to do such a thing. But we do. Good one-day cricketers are being ignored for these wastes of space, and have been being ignored for years.

FFS, Mark Ealham could easily have played in the 2003 and 2007 World Cups, but he was ignored in favour of Matthew Hoggard, James Kirtley, Jeremy Snape, Alex Tudor, Ian Blackwell, Gareth Batty, James Anderson, Stephen Harmison, Richard Johnson, Kabir Ali, Alex Wharf, Sajid Mahmood, Simon Jones, Jonathan Lewis, Chris Tremlett, Liam Plunkett, Tim Bresnan, Stuart Broad and Michael Yardy (yes, he was picked as a bowler). None of whom are even in the same league as him as one-day bowlers, and some of whom are about 7 or 8 leagues below.

 

[Flem274*]

This thread makes me feel much better about NZ. Hopefully this means I haven't jinxed us and we'll have our very own thread like this for te 450820th time.

Bell and Anderson have the potential to be very good. Shah (when at six), Bopara (atm) andWright on the other hand, are no good at all and apart from Bopara I doubt they'll amount to much.

 

[Lambu]

Bell,Shah,Wright,Bopara must go.Swann, i hear is a lower order bat so he is safe.Oh and Ambrose is doesn't have many shots.Wicket keeping has been a major problem in recent times for England.They all start off brightly but soon get found out.

 

[The Masterplan]

Luke Wright must go... get Ian Blackwell or Peter Trego in there...!

 

[NassersKnock]

Where to start?

It would make more sense bandwidth wise to make a list of who you'd retain.

 

[zaremba]

Matthew Prior - hopeless, especially inexplicable when picked as a specialist batsman.

He didn't deliver in ODI cricket but he has a touch of class about his batting - he's the leading runscorer in county cricket this season and has played exceptionally well - and when not keeping is a fielder of very high class.

As a Sussex fan I'd be more than happy for him to give up the gloves and concentrate on his batting (we have 2 outstanding young wicketkeeper batsmen in Hodd and Brown waiting in the wings).

 

[SJS]

Wright
Cook
KP
Bell
Collingwood
Ambrose
Mascarenhas
Swann
Broad
Sidebottom
Anderson

IMO.

I presume thats a list of players that should be kicked out of the England ODI team. If so.....well said

 

[Flem274*]

I presume thats a list of players that should be kicked out of the England ODI team. If so.....well said

 

[Arjun]

I find nothing seriously wrong with this team, when there are no better replacements outside. This team has already lost Trescothick, Vaughan, Harmison and Jones among their more recent players, and filling in for all of them will be tough.