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***Official*** South Africa in England

Should Freddy be included in team for the second Test?


  • Total voters
    44

tooextracool

International Coach
Just what I was thinking.

He has an impressive record to date in his career, and has a bit of pace about him too it seems:



Source - http://content-aus.cricinfo.com/engvrsa/content/current/player/270253.html

All depends what sometimes means though obviously, but he does has a very impressive record this season.

Comes off the back of taking 5-72 against Surrey in his last first class game and 2-39 against Worcestershire in his last List A game too.

He's been picked now and there's nothing that can be done. Time to get behind him for me as Pup Clarke said.
He may actually be a decent bowler, but I really hope that his selection was made based on the selectors actually watching him bowl and not on his figures entirely. What worries me is not his own bowling ability but the selection of 5 bowlers with Ambrose at 6.
 

zaremba

Cricketer Of The Year
There's only so much knowledge you can get from the small number of games he's played.
Fair point. But...

I highly doubt they'll have attended more than 3 or 4 games he's played.
Where do you get that idea from?

Apart from watching games, the selectors will regularly speak to senior players and management around the counties to find out who's impressed them.

Face it, the selectors will have seen much more of him than anyone on this board will have done.

Yes it's a selection from left-field but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
 

aussie tragic

International Captain
Interesting cricinfo article on the "Australian" Darren Pattinson

http://content-www.cricinfo.com/countycricket2008/content/story/347304.html

Basically David Hussey, his Victorian team mate, recommended that he play county cricket....who would have that that would lead him to play test cricket before David Hussey :laugh:

oh yeah, I like his quote at the end

"I have played a few seasons in club cricket up in Yorkshire, but not county cricket before. I do not really know what to expect, so the first few games I am going to get into it, get stuck in, and see what happens."
 

zaremba

Cricketer Of The Year
I saw Pattinson bowl a few times for Victoria last season and there's certainly nothing special about him. He's a far cry from Test standard really has nothing on Tremlett.
Well if you've seen him you've an advantage over most of the people who seem to be writing him off!

However he only played 2 first class games for Vic last season, one at Sydney and one at Melbourne. His figures at the MCG were pretty good (2-40 and 1-17). Maybe the match(es) you saw weren't a fair reflection of his ability? Or maybe he's improved in what has been an impressive English season so far?
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Fair point. But... Where do you get that idea from?
Because at the start of the season when he played 2 or 3 games no-one would have watched him because he was just some Australian grade player who no-one had heard of. He's only played, what, 7 games tops (?) this season, and they can't have watched more than the last 3 or 4 of them. And that's if they've watched every game, which not that many do.
Apart from watching games, the selectors will regularly speak to senior players and management around the counties to find out who's impressed them.

Face it, the selectors will have seen much more of him than anyone on this board will have done.
Oh, certainly. But I don't think anyone can have seen enough of him to really know anything of great significance. Therefore, to trust that you know enough to pick him for a Test is, well, mad TBH.
Yes it's a selection from left-field but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
Left-field = bad in cricket, as a rule, for mine. Cricket is by nature a game based in conservativism.

There might be exceptions but I struggle to think of any right now.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
88mph bouncer is hooked esily for four, all signs are pointing to another slowish track.
Bowling short at Headingley = bad idea, as a rule.

Can't think of a single wicket (at least, of a top-order batsman) that's fallen to a short delivery in the 11 Tests I've watched at this ground.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Where do you get that idea from?

Apart from watching games, the selectors will regularly speak to senior players and management around the counties to find out who's impressed them.

Face it, the selectors will have seen much more of him than anyone on this board will have done.

Yes it's a selection from left-field but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing.
For one thing, hes only played 6 games this season. Unless the selectors were expecting a 29 year old so and so with barely any FC cricket experience in Australia to come in and set the world alight in his first few games in CC, its highly unlikely that they have seen him in any more than a couple of games. Given sthe credentials and capabilities of our selectors, I think I would have little hesitation is saying that I very much doubt they have ever watched him bowl.
 

zaremba

Cricketer Of The Year
Because at the start of the season when he played 2 or 3 games no-one would have watched him because he was just some Australian grade player who no-one had heard of. He's only played, what, 7 games tops (?) this season, and they can't have watched more than the last 3 or 4 of them. And that's if they've watched every game, which not that many do.
Unless the selectors were expecting a 29 year old so and so with barely any FC cricket experience in Australia to come in and set the world alight in his first few games in CC, its highly unlikely that they have seen him in any more than a couple of games. Given sthe credentials and capabilities of our selectors, I think I would have little hesitation is saying that I very much doubt they have ever watched him bowl.
Oh come on.

So you think that the selectors wouldn't go to watch a match between Notts and whoever they're playing unless they were going with the specific intention of watching Pattinson?!

For instance, take the first match of the season which your logic suggests that no selector would have attended because they'd not heard of Pattinson. Do you think it's just possible that a selector went to the game, to run their eye over Denly, Key, Tredwell, Swann, Shreck, Maclaren and Patel? If so do you think that they failed to spot the fact that Pattinson took 8 wickets in the match?

Left-field = bad in cricket, as a rule, for mine. Cricket is by nature a game based in conservativism.

There might be exceptions but I struggle to think of any right now.
There have been plenty. Too many to boringly recite. I may however do so if the rain comes in the Test match.
 
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Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Oh come on.

So you think that the selectors wouldn't go to watch a match between Notts and whoever they're playing unless they were going with the specific intention of watching Pattinson?!

For instance, take the first match of the season which your logic suggests that no selector would have attended because they'd not heard of Pattinson. Do you think it's just possible that a selector went to the first Championship match of the season, to run their eye over Denly, Key, Tredwell, Swann, Shreck, Maclaren and Patel? If so do you think that they failed to spot the fact that Pattinson took 8 wickets in the match?
Of course it's possible (though I dread to think that they were thinking of picking Tredwell and Shreck for England, and I thought McLaren was still a SAfrican). Frankly, I'd just like to know how many times they've watched him though. Not something we can know, unless their presence at Ground X was logged, though, so we'll just have to suffice with that even if they've seen every game, it's really not enough.
There have been plenty. Too many to boringly recite. I may however do so if the rain comes in the Test match.
Please do it somewhere, I'd love to hear them.

But remember - successful |= good piece of selection.
 

tooextracool

International Coach
Why on earth did they not just give Tremlett the gig?:huh:
Id much rather Pattinson than Tremlett on this ground tbh. You can already identify that bang it in bowlers are going to have to rethink their bowling strategy a litlle bit and in Flintoff and Broad in the side, the last thing England need is another bowler in a similar mold. It makes perfect sense to pick a swing bowler in these conditions, Im just a little stunned that it wasnt Hoggard or Simon Jones.
 

Jono

Virat Kohli (c)
Haha, what the hell kind of selection have England gone with?

For the fun of it I hope Pattinson runs through South Africa.
 

_Ed_

Request Your Custom Title Now!
But remember - successful |= good piece of selection.
I'm struggling to understand this logic. Surely if the selectors pick a player who contributes strongly to the team's cause it can't be anything other than a good piece of selection.
 

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