NZ talent not being used?

[Flem274*]

It's not so much the batting at McClean park (I'm well aware that it's not always a complete batting paradise), but rather the state of the pitch in the matches where he scored hundreds. The conditions were hardly testing for batsmen.

http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/newzealand/engine/match/305055.html

http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/newzealanddomestic/engine/match/305057.html

The match were he scored two 90's was impressive, but the pitch was hardly a minefield, and Greg Todd managed the same thing (only better) in a match against Wellington on a tough pitch. And it should also be said that Flynn scored a hundred in the same match.

http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/newzealand/engine/match/305051.html

And as for that 23, while it's hardly anything to gloat about, he also batted longer than anyone else, and against a rampant Andre Adams too, showing his ability to stick things out in tough conditions. Flynn also has the advantage of being a Lefty, and that added variation in the top order is always handy. Yes, they probably both deserved a trip, but given the necessity of including Hopkins and a couple of back up bowlers, the selectors were always going to be squeezed for space, and I reckon they made a pretty good decision.

Yeah it is a fair enough descision, both had strong cases and I'm quite happy for a change I'm not a selector. On one hand Flynn has more experience but he could also be qeue (go away Kiwi and Rich you spelling nazis) jumping in a way in terms of runs scored.

What will interest me is where Hay bats for NZ A (I'm assuming he will go, if he doesn't that will be a big surprise). Mark Greatbatch won't shut up about how Hay could be an opener, personally I'm against the opening idea, definitely this early in his career anyway. I seem to remember our other possible opening converts were called Lou Vincent, Mathew Sinclair and Peter Fulton. Can't recall the idea working either..

If I may I'd like to ask peoples opinions on the contracts due to be announced? This thread seems as good as any to discuss them in. Its 20 players right? In that case my picks:

Batsmen (9)

How
Taylor
Fulton
Styris
Hay
Flynn
Ryder
Nicol
Redmond (not covinced of him though)

Bowlers (9)

Vettori
Franklin
Mills
Martin
Southee
Patel
Mason
Gillespie
Burtt

Wicketkeeper (1)
McCullum

Allrounder (1)

Oram

 

[Marius]

Johann Myburgh has apparently signed for the Dolphins for next season, so looks like he's heading back to SA.

 

[Retox]

Johann Myburgh has apparently signed for the Dolphins for next season, so looks like he's heading back to SA.

Mother ****er

HEY JAMES MARSHALL

 

[Athlai]

Yeah it is a fair enough descision, both had strong cases and I'm quite happy for a change I'm not a selector. On one hand Flynn has more experience but he could also be qeue (go away Kiwi and Rich you spelling nazis) jumping in a way in terms of runs scored.

What will interest me is where Hay bats for NZ A (I'm assuming he will go, if he doesn't that will be a big surprise). Mark Greatbatch won't shut up about how Hay could be an opener, personally I'm against the opening idea, definitely this early in his career anyway. I seem to remember our other possible opening converts were called Lou Vincent, Mathew Sinclair and Peter Fulton. Can't recall the idea working either..

If I may I'd like to ask peoples opinions on the contracts due to be announced? This thread seems as good as any to discuss them in. Its 20 players right? In that case my picks:

Batsmen (9)

How
Taylor
Fulton
Styris
Hay
Flynn
Ryder
Nicol
Redmond (not covinced of him though)

Bowlers (9)

Vettori
Franklin
Mills
Martin
Southee
Patel
Mason
Gillespie
Burtt

Wicketkeeper (1)
McCullum

Allrounder (1)

Oram

queue*

Phlegm the problem with your argument about Hay opening is that it was his natural position at the youth level, he was only put into the middle order later in his career, to protect him till he established himself. Now he's made a name there so can he change back? Give him a year in the domestic scene and we'll see.

Oh and with the selection of Flynn, heck if Hadlee's last selection was Southee then we can give the kid a game can't we?

 

[Bahnz]

Johann Myburgh has apparently signed for the Dolphins for next season, so looks like he's heading back to SA.

Not according to this

http://www.blackcaps.co.nz/content/statecricket/news/11644/myburgh-commits.aspx

Where did you hear that from?

 

[Flem274*]

Johann Myburgh has apparently signed for the Dolphins for next season, so looks like he's heading back to SA.

Not if we seize his passport he isn't...

 

[Athlai]

Johann Myburgh has apparently signed for the Dolphins for next season, so looks like he's heading back to SA.

Best of luck to him.

 

[Marius]

Not according to this

http://www.blackcaps.co.nz/content/statecricket/news/11644/myburgh-commits.aspx

Where did you hear that from?

http://www.thetimes.co.za/PrintEdition/Sport/Article.aspx?id=736425

To be honest, I don't think you can believe much that comes out of professional sportsmen's mouths these days.

 

[Bahnz]

Yeah it is a fair enough descision, both had strong cases and I'm quite happy for a change I'm not a selector. On one hand Flynn has more experience but he could also be qeue (go away Kiwi and Rich you spelling nazis) jumping in a way in terms of runs scored.

What will interest me is where Hay bats for NZ A (I'm assuming he will go, if he doesn't that will be a big surprise). Mark Greatbatch won't shut up about how Hay could be an opener, personally I'm against the opening idea, definitely this early in his career anyway. I seem to remember our other possible opening converts were called Lou Vincent, Mathew Sinclair and Peter Fulton. Can't recall the idea working either..

If I may I'd like to ask peoples opinions on the contracts due to be announced? This thread seems as good as any to discuss them in. Its 20 players right? In that case my picks:

Batsmen (9)

How
Taylor
Fulton
Styris
Hay
Flynn
Ryder
Nicol
Redmond (not covinced of him though)

Bowlers (9)

Vettori
Franklin
Mills
Martin
Southee
Patel
Mason
Gillespie
Burtt

Wicketkeeper (1)
McCullum

Allrounder (1)

Oram

While I'd imagine that Hay would prefer to bat in the middle order, given the current glut of players we have in those positions (Taylor, Oram, Ryder when he's fit and possibly Flynn if he comes off), he may have to give opening (or at least batting at number 3) a try if he wants to get into the blackcaps.

As for the contracts, there's no way that Nicol will be anywhere near a contract. He isn't even close to being selected for the national side given his form this season. Same goes for Burtt. You'll probably see Marshall and O'Brien in their places, low down on the list. Elliot might be another, especially if the selectors are considering him for a shot in the ODI squad, which I suspect they will before long.

 

[Flem274*]

queue*

Phlegm the problem with your argument about Hay opening is that it was his natural position at the youth level, he was only put into the middle order later in his career, to protect him till he established himself. Now he's made a name there so can he change back? Give him a year in the domestic scene and we'll see.

Oh and with the selection of Flynn, heck if Hadlee's last selection was Southee then we can give the kid a game can't we?

That sounds..mad. Why not let him loose from the start?

Spose its not entirely out of the question then, though from what I've heard he likes backward of square wich kinda sounds like Vettori and I have a suspicion the slips and gully would be stacked to such a batsman.

Hadlee has also promoted the likes of Ian Butler etc to the top early and they failed. Hadlee as a selector is very hit and miss.

 

[Athlai]

That sounds..mad. Why not let him loose from the start?

Spose its not entirely out of the question then, though from what I've heard he likes backward of square wich kinda sounds like Vettori and I have a suspicion the slips and gully would be stacked to such a batsman.

Hadlee has also promoted the likes of Ian Butler etc to the top early and they failed. Hadlee as a selector is very hit and miss.

Well there was of course Hays apparent break from cricket which could explain his change in position, and in his confidence in his ability.

Reckon selection is gun lately TBH.

 

[Flem274*]

While I'd imagine that Hay would prefer to bat in the middle order, given the current glut of players we have in those positions (Taylor, Oram, Ryder when he's fit and possibly Flynn if he comes off), he may have to give opening (or at least batting at number 3) a try if he wants to get into the blackcaps.

As for the contracts, there's no way that Nicol will be anywhere near a contract. He isn't even close to being selected for the national side given his form this season. Same goes for Burtt. You'll probably see Marshall and O'Brien in their places, low down on the list. Elliot might be another, especially if the selectors are considering him for a shot in the ODI squad, which I suspect they will before long.

Marshall+O'Brien=

Nicol wasn't bad this season in the one dayers IIRC, and Elliot is a bit of a bits and pieces player, would rather a specialist something.

Leighton Burtt has been pretty good this season though I admit I forgot Bradley Scott who would be ahead of him.

 

[Bahnz]

Hadlee has also promoted the likes of Ian Butler etc to the top early and they failed. Hadlee as a selector is very hit and miss.

It must be said though that Butler was looking better and better until his back crapped out in 2004, and getting acclimatised to international conditions whilst he was still young probably had a fair bit to do with that.

 

[Bahnz]

Marshall+O'Brien=

Nicol wasn't bad this season in the one dayers IIRC, and Elliot is a bit of a bits and pieces player, would rather a specialist something.

Leighton Burtt has been pretty good this season though I admit I forgot Bradley Scott who would be ahead of him.

I think that being a bits and pieces player will help him. They can be useful in ODI's (think Harry), and we still haven't worked out who's going to bat at number 6, a position that Elliot would be well suited.

 

[Flem274*]

Well there was of course Hays apparent break from cricket which could explain his change in position, and in his confidence in his ability.

Reckon selection is gun lately TBH.

Yeah for now...I still don't trust them. Remember the selection of Paul Hitchcock? (which admittedly I endorsed in a moment of random madness)

I'd much rather see Hay open in domestic cricket first, which I'm sure will be the case. He's done it in List A I think.

On a related topic, if Marshall screws up will he be gone for good due to the amount of middle order batsmen that have put their hands up?

 

[Flem274*]

I think that being a bits and pieces player will help him. They can be useful in ODI's (think Harry), and we still haven't worked out who's going to bat at number 6, a position that Elliot would be well suited.

Chris Harris was a genuine ODI allrounder. Decent batsman and whilst he was a different bowler he was pretty darn effective. Bits and pieces players I define as allrounders who aren't very good/good enough at either discipline but can be handy now and again.

A batsman may get moved down there due to the lack of space in the top order or alternatively the selectors may try and develop Franklins allround skills at seven.

Oram to bat at 6.

 

[Athlai]

Marshall is a captain, one of the best fielders in the country and a solid enough middle order batsman. Reckon he should always be in line for a reserve spot if he fails miserably. If Fulton, Taylor, Ryder, (possibly Flynn, and Hay) are injured he should certainly be waiting for the phone call.

Just seems like the kind of personality that will stick his head in, may not ever excel but he'll do his job.

 

[Flem274*]

It must be said though that Butler was looking better and better until his back crapped out in 2004, and getting acclimatised to international conditions whilst he was still young probably had a fair bit to do with that.

I'll give you Butler. I saw a list somewhere (think it may have been a book written by Ian Smith) of players Hadlee had thrown in early. Many of them have disappeared as proven failures.

In saying that, as a selector (or as a player FWIW) Hadlee>>>Bracewell

 

[Athlai]

Elliot was dire I reckon, we tried to replace Oram with an allrounder and discovered that we have none of his calibre. Sure we have batsman who can bowl a bit, and bowlers who can bat a bit, but genuine allrounders are a very rare thing and for our selectors to go searching for one when our only genuine one injures himself was a foolish mistake IMO.

 

[Flem274*]

Marshall is a captain, one of the best fielders in the country and a solid enough middle order batsman. Reckon he should always be in line for a reserve spot if he fails miserably. If Fulton, Taylor, Ryder, (possibly Flynn, and Hay) are injured he should certainly be waiting for the phone call.

Just seems like the kind of personality that will stick his head in, may not ever excel but he'll do his job.

Don't let Heath read that.

TBH if he looks completely out of his depth the selectors might discard him for a long time until he shows them huge improvement, like he did this season.

We'll just have to see how he goes, won't ever hold down a first XI position in a few years though I suspect.