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Thread: Why doesnt Hoggard play ODIs?

  1. #1
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    Why doesnt Hoggard play ODIs?

    He is England's best bowler, does he not want to or do they leave him out?

    Also wtf happened to Simon Jones? He was arguably their best bowler in 2005 now hes not heard of.

  2. #2
    Virat Kohli (c) Jono's Avatar
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    If I recall this was asked back in 2004 just before his return to ODIs, and he got pounded.

    He predominantly bowls a full length, and when the ball isn't swinging he is often cannon fodder.

    That being said he has added variety to his test bowling since his last few ODIs, so maybe he could come back with cutters, changes of pace etc. like Pathan and Bracken bowl when the ball stops swinging.

    Its unlikely they'll bother though. May as well continue their investment in youth.
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  3. #3
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Hoggard is a crap ODI bowler, he's been picked on 3 or 4 different occasions and nothing's ever changed, despite people saying this same thing before every single recall. Simon Jones is injured and is highly unlikely ever to regain the required fitness.
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    International Debutant iamdavid's Avatar
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    Same sort of reason Stuart Clark isnt a great ODI exponent, although he's more likely to do well in one dayers than Hoggard.

    Predictable, no great pace or variations of pace, flat and very hittable trajectory, and when the ball isnt moving he has nothing to fall back ie cutting the ball off the wicket.

    Atleast Clark has his height and can roll his fingers over the seam a little, whereas Hoggard really has no defence when batsman try get after him, unless the ball swings sideways.


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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    And even when it does, there've been times when he struggles to control it, and with the ODI wide rule, that causes almost as many problems as when the ball doesn't swing.

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    International Coach wpdavid's Avatar
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    The thing about Hoggard is that he did play a fair number of them and did well enough in the early part of his career. The turning point was a game against SL at Leeds in 2002 when Jayasuria went absolutely ballistic and Hoggie's 4 overs went for over 50 runs. Although he played in the next game (presumably there weren't any viable alternatives in the squad) we didn't see much of him thereafter. A couple of games at the end of the 2002/03 ashes, when he'd had an absolute mare in the tests anyway, and a handful of games in SA and India when England's whole side were doing their usual impression of a village XI in an overseas oneday sries.

    I couldn't argue with the reasons stated above why he's struggled on those few occasions when he's played in the last 5 years, but you'd have to figure that he'd have worked the 50 over game out if he'd played regularly. And you'd also have to figure that he'd have ended up a whole lot better than some of the dross we've seen opening the bowling in these games.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    That's a common myth about him it seems. His first ODI series was excellent, sure, but in his next 10 games, after the Zimbabwe series, before said reduced-overs SL Headingley game, he was very poor indeed.

    The truth is Hoggard was never, ever any good at ODIs, apart from that first series where Zimbabwe were pretty awful really anyway. There's a reason he's never played regularly - he's been absolutely belted whenever he has, including the rare time when he was picked for a few games consecutively. It doesn't matter if the rest of the side were doing crap anyway - mostly the reason they were doing so was the same as the reason he was, they simply weren't good enough and shouldn't have been picked. If he was good enough, like Trescothick, Pietersen and Flintoff, he'd still have done well despite the paucity of his team-mates.
    Last edited by Richard; 13-02-2008 at 08:16 AM.

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    Hall of Fame Member steds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bond21 View Post
    He is England's best bowler, does he not want to or do they leave him out?
    Gets creamed every time he plays.

    Quote Originally Posted by bond21 View Post
    Also wtf happened to Simon Jones? He was arguably their best bowler in 2005 now hes not heard of.
    Cripple.

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    International Debutant slowfinger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Hoggard is a crap ODI bowler, he's been picked on 3 or 4 different occasions and nothing's ever changed, despite people saying this same thing before every single recall. Simon Jones is injured and is highly unlikely ever to regain the required fitness.
    Totally right there mate, I can't even see why he plays at all

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    BARNES OUT dontcloseyoureyes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steds View Post
    Cripple.
    "Holy crip he's a crapple."

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  11. #11
    Cricketer Of The Year Somerset's Avatar
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    To be fair, he can't be any worse than James Franklin in ODIs (who was good enough to go to the 2007 World Cup)...remember also that until recently Chris Martin was apparently not up to ODI standard until given a decent chance.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    And I'd still say Martin and Franklin aren't, personally... just New Zealand prefer to keep picking proven failures rather than keep selecting another different rubbish domestic bowler... oh, hang on, they've just picked O'Brien...

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    NZ dont exactly have an army of superb bowlers lined up and ready to go.

    Martin and Mills take the new ball, tell me which other country would give them the new ball, if they were even in the team to begin with.

    Other than Bangladesh, Ireland, Kenya and all the minnows I cant think of a team who would pick them, let alone open the bowling with them.

  14. #14
    Spanish_Vicente sledger's Avatar
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    tbh Chris Martin probably could worm his way into the west indies team, whether or not he would take the new ball is another matter, but he probably would be reasonable enough by their standards to get in the side.

  15. #15
    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Kyle Mills has bowled impressively most of the time for the last 2 years. He'd walk into plenty of ODI teams currently.

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