Best & Worst Declarations

BoyBrumby · 05-12-2007, 05:08 AM

You know, I don't recall declarations ever having been discussed in any depth on CW in the 3 years+ I've been a resident. Seems remiss of us so this is my attempt to redress the balance.

Can you think of a good declaration that forced a positive result (for the team who declared) where one might not have been possible otherwise or alternately can you think of an absurdly generous closure that had the opposite outcome?

This would get my vote for the latter: http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/19...19MAR1968.html

Which captains have handled them well and who's been too cautious?

All opinions welcome

('cept Richard's, obv...

).

Son Of Coco · 05-12-2007, 05:11 AM

The Declaration of Independence was quite poorly handled in my opinion.

Lillian Thomson · 05-12-2007, 05:29 AM

Kim Hughes at Headingley in 1981.

Richard · 05-12-2007, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

All opinions welcome

('cept Richard's, obv...

).

The Sobers one obviously surely has to be at or near the top, but another one I'd like to mention was Shaun Pollock's in Bridgetown in 2001 - CBA to link to the card as I'm in a rush, but he seemed to think there was absolutely no chance of getting a result, yet after he finally declared - 20 or 30 overs after he could have, with a massive first-innings lead - WI collapsed and almost lost even in the little time there was left (saved partly by some unsportsmanlike behaviour). Had he declared earlier and the same thing happened, it'd have been a certain victory.

One I hope is NEVER called a bad declaration is Gilchrist at Headingley in 2001.

iamdavid · 05-12-2007, 06:08 AM

Thought Flemings declaring behind and Waugh's subsequent declaration in this match were great.

BoyBrumby · 05-12-2007, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard

One I hope is NEVER called a bad declaration is Gilchrist at Headingley in 2001.

Yeah, quite agree. With the benefit of hindsight it looks a wee bit generous, but at the time it just looked like Oz closing in for the kill. 315 (IIRC, at work & CBA to check) on a 5th day pitch was a very stiff ask and it took the innings of his life from Butch to get us there. I suspect that had the series been in the balance Gilly would have batted on longer.

One decision that I've thought of that was possibly the right one for the match situtation, but extremely bad man-management, was Atherton's decision to pull the plug with Hick on 98*. It was one of our tours to Oz, 94/5 (? again from memory) The big fella always seemed more of a carrot than a stick sort of a player, so for his captain to do that to him was rather short-sighted.

Barney Rubble · 05-12-2007, 08:18 AM

How do you guys fit all this stuff in your brains? I seriously can only vaguely name several recent declarations by England captains, let alone analyse in detail those that happened years and years ago, and not all of them in particularly famous matches anyway.

Hats off to you all for having far better memories than me. Unless being in France is just destroying my ability to talk about cricket...I choose to blame that. If in doubt, blame the French.

silentstriker · 05-12-2007, 08:20 AM

One bad one was by Dravid in Pakistan 2003/4 when he left Sachin on 194*.

BoyBrumby · 05-12-2007, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barney Rubble

How do you guys fit all this stuff in your brains?

It's a form of sickness, tbh.

Have a mind that hoovers up random, unrelated factoids. Can also name the score of every FA Cup final since 1970. Sad, but true..

Barney Rubble · 05-12-2007, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

It's a form of sickness, tbh.

Have a mind that hoovers up random, unrelated factoids. Can also name the score of every FA Cup final since 1970. Sad, but true..

Haha, that's impressive. I thought I had a good mind for stats. Well, I do have a good mind for random info, but lately I've been forgetting a lot of it. Haven't watched cricket in so long I probably forget the rules these days, same goes for footy with the exception of the odd France match here and there.

Roll on the 19th Dec - back to England for two weeks.

Richard · 05-12-2007, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BoyBrumby

One decision that I've thought of that was possibly the right one for the match situtation, but extremely bad man-management, was Atherton's decision to pull the plug with Hick on 98*. It was one of our tours to Oz, 94/5 (? again from memory) The big fella always seemed more of a carrot than a stick sort of a player, so for his captain to do that to him was rather short-sighted.

Yeah, he himself said it was not a decision he'd have taken again, and reckons that had he let Hick get the century it'd have improved the mood in the camp and maybe helped win the game which they ended-up just failing to.

Hick did not speak to him for the rest of the tour. And yeah, it was 1994\95, Atherton's only Ashes tour as captain.

shortpitched713 · 05-12-2007, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard

Yeah, he himself said it was not a decision he'd have taken again, and reckons that had he let Hick get the century it'd have improved the mood in the camp and maybe helped win the game which they ended-up just failing to.

Hick did not speak to him for the rest of the tour. And yeah, it was 1994\95, Atherton's only Ashes tour as captain.

Wow, pretty selfish on his part, I would think. Its his duty and responsibility as a professional cricketer to accept the decisions his captain makes to help England win, and personally I don't care if he was on 399*, he should be willing to leave whenever it would benefit his country. Such behavior would be a bit of a black mark on the legacy of any cricketer, one would think.

roseboy64 · 05-12-2007, 10:50 AM

Nah. I'd side with Hick except I'd not go as far as to alienate for the rest of the tour.

Richard · 05-12-2007, 11:04 AM

TBH it was only another couple of weeks - he left the tour with a prolapsed disc not long after said incident. Had he lasted the course, it's very possible the two would have made-up before the end.

I don't blame Hick at all TBH. You can say "it's a team game" all you want - it's a team game played by individuals, and individual achievements do mean a hell of a lot, whether some people like it or not. A century is a buoyancy-aid to a team, and denying a batsman a century is bound to have some effect.

Bouncer · 05-12-2007, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silentstriker

One bad one was by Dravid in Pakistan 2003/4 when he left Sachin on 194*.

Didnt he win the game???? So how was that bad declaration?

05-12-2007, 05:08 AM	#1 (permalink)
BoyBrumby Englishman Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Doing the stance Posts: 42,645	Best & Worst Declarations You know, I don't recall declarations ever having been discussed in any depth on CW in the 3 years+ I've been a resident. Seems remiss of us so this is my attempt to redress the balance. Can you think of a good declaration that forced a positive result (for the team who declared) where one might not have been possible otherwise or alternately can you think of an absurdly generous closure that had the opposite outcome? This would get my vote for the latter: http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/19...19MAR1968.html Which captains have handled them well and who's been too cautious? All opinions welcome ('cept Richard's, obv... ). __________________ *- As featured in The Independent.* "This is not the time for namby-pamby promising youngsters who might just do something; not the time for building for the future. Pragmatism rules and they don't come more pragmatic than Rogers." - Victor Marks makes the case for stiff-legged and stiff-armed 35 year old left-handers in Ashes squads

05-12-2007, 05:11 AM	#2 (permalink)
Son Of Coco Hall of Fame Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 16,059	The Declaration of Independence was quite poorly handled in my opinion. __________________ "What is this what is this who is this guy shouting what is this going on in here?" - CP. (re: psxpro) R.I.P Craigos, you were a champion bloke. One of the best *R.I.P Fardin 'Bob' Qayyumi* Member of the Church of the Holy Glenn McGrath

05-12-2007, 10:50 AM	#13 (permalink)
roseboy64 Cricket Web Content Updater Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Jamaica Posts: 18,549	Nah. I'd side with Hick except I'd not go as far as to alienate for the rest of the tour. __________________ Sir Alexander Chapman Ferguson = Greatest Ever Manager "One from ten leaves zero." - Eric Williams, former T&T PM Member of Cricket Web Green Member of Northside Power R.I.P Fardin Qayyumi

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05-12-2007, 05:29 AM	#3 (permalink)
Lillian Thomson International Captain Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: england Posts: 5,638	Kim Hughes at Headingley in 1981.

05-12-2007, 06:08 AM	#5 (permalink)
iamdavid International Debutant Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Australia Posts: 2,111	Thought Flemings declaring behind and Waugh's subsequent declaration in this match were great.

05-12-2007, 08:18 AM	#7 (permalink)
Barney Rubble International Coach Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: All over the shop Posts: 10,191	How do you guys fit all this stuff in your brains? I seriously can only vaguely name several recent declarations by England captains, let alone analyse in detail those that happened years and years ago, and not all of them in particularly famous matches anyway. Hats off to you all for having far better memories than me. Unless being in France is just destroying my ability to talk about cricket...I choose to blame that. If in doubt, blame the French.

05-12-2007, 11:04 AM	#14 (permalink)
Richard Cricket Web Staff Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: 2005 Posts: 80,407	TBH it was only another couple of weeks - he left the tour with a prolapsed disc not long after said incident. Had he lasted the course, it's very possible the two would have made-up before the end. I don't blame Hick at all TBH. You can say "it's a team game" all you want - it's a team game played by individuals, and individual achievements do mean a hell of a lot, whether some people like it or not. A century is a buoyancy-aid to a team, and denying a batsman a century is bound to have some effect.

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