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Thread: England Test XI of the past 10 years

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    International 12th Man Shaggy Alfresco's Avatar
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    England Test XI of the past 10 years

    I was bored just now, so to keep myself occupied I made a best England Test XI of the past 10 years, in the hope it would stimulate a cerebral and entertaining debate. Thoughts?

    Atherton
    Vaughan
    Hussain (c)
    Thorpe
    Pietersen
    Stewart (wk)
    Flintoff
    Hoggard
    Caddick
    Gough
    Panesar

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    gio
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    Atherton is an interesting one, average wise, not as good as Trescothick. But his nattling qualitys were very strong. Hussain is also questionable, an excellent captain at the time, but his record was poor in comparison to most of the current English batsman...

    It's a very interesting debate though, as you have a very successful England side and an absolutely dire side in the same period...

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Anyone seriously arguing Trescothick > Atherton is mad IMO. Atherton and Gooch are England's only real class openers since Boycott IMO, though Cook obviously should be before long. Shame Gooch doesn't quite qualify for this any more.

    Think Shahid has got it roughly spot-on, TBH, would go Stewart a bit higher myself... maybe summat like...

    Atherton
    Cook
    Hussain (c)
    Vaughan
    Stewart (w)
    Pietersen
    Thorpe
    Flintoff
    Caddick
    Gough
    Hoggard
    Substitute MSP in for Caddick on a spin-receptive surface. Maybe bring Bell at seven in for Hussain and move everyone else up one. Thorpe and Pietersen, of course, are crazily low but that's what happens when you pick so many good batsmen. And I'm very much in favour of seven batsmen four bowlers.
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    International 12th Man Shaggy Alfresco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    It's a very interesting debate though, as you have a very successful England side and an absolutely dire side in the same period...
    Personally I feel that England, especially under Hussain, were underrated. I think you can see that from my selections.


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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Saying England were "absolutely d i r e" 1997-1999" is just wrong IMO. There were many fine cricketers to play in that period.
    Last edited by Richard; 24-06-2007 at 03:52 PM.

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    gio
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Saying England were "absolutely dire" 1997-1999" is just wrong IMO. There were many fine cricketers to play in that period.
    Being the worst test side in the world isn't dire? News to me.

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    gio
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Anyone seriously arguing Trescothick > Atherton is mad IMO. Atherton and Gooch are England's only real class openers since Boycott IMO, though Cook obviously should be before long. Shame Gooch doesn't quite qualify for this any more.
    Interesting. I personally would prefer Atherton, but I can certainly see the argument for Trescothick. At the time Atherton would have been preferable due to the bowling attacks around at that time, but the current England side might be better with Tres in it than Atherton.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Nah, see - I reckon Atherton'd average 50-plus had his last Test been his first. And probably at a healthier strike-rate than he managed in his day, too.

    That's, of course, given freedom from his back problems. Even with them, though, I still think he'd do better than Trescothick has.

    And if he had the amount of luck Trescothick has done - heaven knows what he might manage.

    More significantly, I reckon if Trescothick had played at the time Atherton did, with decent bowling and catching, he'd have averaged about 25 and played 10 or 15 Tests at best.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    Being the worst test side in the world isn't dire? News to me.
    There were any multitude of reasons for that, not all of which concerned the calibre of cricketers available to the best team of the time.

    And this is all that's being discussed here. Not output performance, but calibre of individual player.

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    gio
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    ly, I reckon if Trescothick had played at the time Atherton did, with decent bowling and catching, he'd have averaged about 25 and played 10 or 15 Tests at best.
    Agreed.

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    gio
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    There were any multitude of reasons for that, not all of which concerned the calibre of cricketers available to the best team of the time.

    And this is all that's being discussed here. Not output performance, but calibre of individual player.
    I made no reference to the calibre of player. I only said it's interesting as your comparing players who were part of varying degrees of sucess in their respective eras.
    Last edited by gio; 24-06-2007 at 04:09 PM.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gio View Post
    I made no reference to the calibre of player. I only said it's interesting as your comparing players who were part of varying degrees of sucess in their respective eras.
    Well... I suppose it is. It just says that you can have poor players in successful teams and vice-versa, really.

    And, perhaps more significantly, someone can be successful in one era - more successful than someone else in a previous one - with less skill.

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    gio
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    Quote Originally Posted by Richard View Post
    Well... I suppose it is. It just says that you can have poor players in successful teams and vice-versa, really.

    And, perhaps more significantly, someone can be successful in one era - more successful than someone else in a previous one - with less skill.
    Absolutely. I think the teams mentioned here would probably be the best available... No place for Tuffers? His Oval performance in the Ashes '97 enough for consideration?

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    MSP > Tufnell IMO.

    And certainly less of a destabilising influence. Quite the opposite, in fact.

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