The Slate is wiped clean , who would you like to see in Englands ODI squad

[Richard]

Wasn't that 189* last season?

Was referring to the 496 game this season.

 

[Richard]

No

We've been doing nothing but trying silly things for the last 4 years (well, it's actually more, but it's been even worse since summer 2003). Solanki as an opener. Vaughan as an opener. Geraint Jones as an opener. Prior as an opener. Bell as an opener. And that's only at the top of the order. All that's happened is we've wasted 7 or so games finding-out someone's not good enough when a bit of decent judgement could have spotted that beforehand (I was against every single instance of the aforementioned, although I was also against the one specialist opener selected in the time - Strauss - taking the place). Of course, later on in the time period, Trescothick's absence didn't help matters, especially when it was almost always thought to be only for a few games. If Trescothick had been available throughout the 2006 and early 2007 things might have been that bit simpler.

 

[Spitfires_Fan]

Wasn't that 189* last season?

Was referring to the 496 game this season.

Ahh, sorry mate, misread your post, sheer laziness on my part!

 

[Bob Bamber]

The issue with Benning , is that he can (and quite often does) get out quite cheaply to ,granted, decent delieveries , but nothing that doesn't appear regularly on the national stage.

I think the people (me included) who were looking for someone who can take on the powerplays are going to be a bit dissapointed. I agree that Cook won't bat as his test match speed (not that anyone should) but he hasn't got big hitting in his locker. But even so he is a very good player , who in a few years could be an excellant test player. I would have like to have seen a Maddy / Benning (especially for the 20/20's) and I think that was a mistake by the selectors. Particularly as there is two Twenty20 matches and just three One Day matches.

The seam attack looks pretty ordinary. I don't see how Plunkett warrented selection (unless it was his FP trophy exploits). He has alot of potential and perhaps could be justfied. But to pick Plunkett , Anderson And Broad is a bit of a risk. Young players have can have more bad days that good. But I suppose there are three seamers , so they can rally round when someone who is having a bad game.

 

[GIMH]

We've been doing nothing but trying silly things for the last 4 years (well, it's actually more, but it's been even worse since summer 2003). Solanki as an opener. Vaughan as an opener. Geraint Jones as an opener. Prior as an opener. Bell as an opener. And that's only at the top of the order. All that's happened is we've wasted 7 or so games finding-out someone's not good enough when a bit of decent judgement could have spotted that beforehand (I was against every single instance of the aforementioned, although I was also against the one specialist opener selected in the time - Strauss - taking the place). Of course, later on in the time period, Trescothick's absence didn't help matters, especially when it was almost always thought to be only for a few games. If Trescothick had been available throughout the 2006 and early 2007 things might have been that bit simpler.

right, I get your point. The thing is, though, I do think tryng things out is the right way to go. But try the right things out...

 

[Richard]

Well... obviously you've got to try something as you're playing games. What I was thinking is that you seemed to be suggesting trying something off the wall[/b], something different or unexpected. I just don't think that works in England, really. Opening batsmen are usually opening batsmen. Not neccessarily good at both forms of the game, but most good OD openers are people who also open in the longer game. And there haven't been that many: Amiss and Gooch in the older days, Knight and Trescothick and, at a stretch, Atherton in the modern era. All specialist opening batsmen who just happened to be good at ODIs.

And, for that matter, most of our best ODI bowlers (the likes of Ealham and Mullally being exceptions) have also been good Test bowlers but that just says that that was the way the cookie crumbled. No way do I ever want to see Hoggard in the ODI team again just because he's a good Test bowler.

I'm 100% against the "your best Test players are your best ODI players" nonsense; I am, however, fully in favour of picking mostly specialists in ODIs and not going for either bits-and-pieces players or the manufacturing of people into something they're not. It might have worked in some countries (Gilchrist opening the batting, for one wild for-instance) but it pretty well never has here.

 

[Richard]

The issue with Benning , is that he can (and quite often does) get out quite cheaply to ,granted, decent delieveries , but nothing that doesn't appear regularly on the national stage.

I think the people (me included) who were looking for someone who can take on the powerplays are going to be a bit dissapointed. I agree that Cook won't bat as his test match speed (not that anyone should) but he hasn't got big hitting in his locker. But even so he is a very good player , who in a few years could be an excellant test player. I would have like to have seen a Maddy / Benning (especially for the 20/20's) and I think that was a mistake by the selectors. Particularly as there is two Twenty20 matches and just three One Day matches.

Not that I'm especially bothered about the Twenty20s, but yes, quite patently some players should be in the Twenty20 picture who aren't in the ODI. I'd hate to see Maddy anywhere near ODIs again, though. He's been playing for yonks now and still doesn't seem to have managed to decide whether he's an opener or a middle-order player in the OD game (I prefer middle-order myself).

 

[Bob Bamber]

Not that I'm especially bothered about the Twenty20s, but yes, quite patently some players should be in the Twenty20 picture who aren't in the ODI. I'd hate to see Maddy anywhere near ODIs again, though. He's been playing for yonks now and still doesn't seem to have managed to decide whether he's an opener or a middle-order player in the OD game (I prefer middle-order myself).

But hes scored the most 20/20 runs in the (albiet short) History of the game. He got a nice 11 ball 24 tonight. (on more of a note , Jonathan Trott 44 from 37 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/shared/fds/hi/statistics/cricket/scorecards/2007/6/13751/html/scorecard.stm ). We need to try some of these 20/20 specialists. As everyone who has played 20/20 has said , its completely different to 40 or 50 over cricket. And the England boys simply haven't played enough. Tonight for instance , they didn't play. And they should really be playing quite a few group games. 20/20 doesn't take that much out of professional atheletes. Really you could do with a specialist Twenty20 captain (almost treat it as three different sides if you like). Because it is that much different.

 

[Richard]

I know, I quite agree. There's almost certainly going to be far too much blurring of the two game-forms, as there is with Tests and ODIs right now.

My comments were about Maddy in 40-50-over cricket, because that's the game-form I care about.

 

[superwills]

keep kirtley mahmood hoggard bresnan and tremlett away from the odi team. Ali cook out too -scores too slowly. mustard 200% in for prior. tresco in if fit. maybe benning but he needs more cc matches 1st. mascarenhas must be in. vaughan and strauss away! monty in but keep eye on graham swann and rashid although i have not seen him bowl in od cricket. Im still out on luke wright...
MY ENGLAND ODI XI:
1. Tresco
2.Mustard
3.Bell
4.Pietersen
5.Collingwood
6.Flintoff
7.Mascarenhas
8.Swann
9.Broad
10.Sidebottom
11.Anderson

12. Bopara(unlucky)

 

[Richard]

Very much remain to be convinced by Broad and certainly by Sidebottom. Don't see much likelihood of Mustard doing much, he's most likely to be the next Geraint\Prior (although someone, somewhere has to break the chain eventually).

Also, I just can't see Flintoff ever regaining the required fitness for cricket, TBH. It's borderline heartbreaking - the guy's not even 30 years old, and it's been well over a year since he was last fit, with no sign of the problems abating. Not in a million years am I going to say "forget him", but I think "brace yourselves" is an unavoidable reality.

Swann deserves his selection and let's see how he goes.

Bell has gone better of late than I'd ever dreamed he would, frankly. Let's see how long this continues for.

Trescothick is out for the foreseeable future, and until he says he definitely wants to come back, don't pine for him, it won't do anyone any good. Yes, there's no obviously good openers and Cook certainly hasn't covered himself in glory to date, and this makes it difficult to avoid "if only Tresco was still here" thoughts. But what I really, really want to avoid, on the evidence of the last 6 years, is yet another will-he-won't-he scenario. Pick a player for a good 10 or 15 matches in a row, and if he doesn't go well get rid of him until such a time as he demonstrates serious improvement in domestic cricket. I'm sick of the Strauss and Vaughan (to pick only the most obvious examples) types who're here, there and everywhere but never definitely in nor definitely out.

I hope Cook can become ODI-class. I don't know whether he currently is though. And it's a shame to have to waste the precious matches we have on Mustard\Prior\Wright\whoever-else-takes-the-fancy-next (there's always someone) but sadly, unless the players are good enough, there's nothing selectors can do.

However, when one goes from nothing all-rounder to international opening batsman in the space of less than half a season as Wright has, you've got serious, serious problems.

 

[jammay123]

wright is gonna be murdered in sl. does anyone no if murali will be fit? because i believe that we have a chance if he does not play.

 

[haroon510]

i definitly wana seee marcus Trescothick back in england side...
he is a classy and aggrassive player..

 

[Richard]

We all hope to see him back as soon as possible, but until such a thing actually happens, I don't see any point pining for it, because until it does we won't know whether it is actually going to or not.

 

[Prince EWS]

Very much remain to be convinced by Broad and certainly by Sidebottom. Don't see much likelihood of Mustard doing much, he's most likely to be the next Geraint\Prior (although someone, somewhere has to break the chain eventually).

Also, I just can't see Flintoff ever regaining the required fitness for cricket, TBH. It's borderline heartbreaking - the guy's not even 30 years old, and it's been well over a year since he was last fit, with no sign of the problems abating. Not in a million years am I going to say "forget him", but I think "brace yourselves" is an unavoidable reality.

Swann deserves his selection and let's see how he goes.

Bell has gone better of late than I'd ever dreamed he would, frankly. Let's see how long this continues for.

Trescothick is out for the foreseeable future, and until he says he definitely wants to come back, don't pine for him, it won't do anyone any good. Yes, there's no obviously good openers and Cook certainly hasn't covered himself in glory to date, and this makes it difficult to avoid "if only Tresco was still here" thoughts. But what I really, really want to avoid, on the evidence of the last 6 years, is yet another will-he-won't-he scenario. Pick a player for a good 10 or 15 matches in a row, and if he doesn't go well get rid of him until such a time as he demonstrates serious improvement in domestic cricket. I'm sick of the Strauss and Vaughan (to pick only the most obvious examples) types who're here, there and everywhere but never definitely in nor definitely out.

I hope Cook can become ODI-class. I don't know whether he currently is though. And it's a shame to have to waste the precious matches we have on Mustard\Prior\Wright\whoever-else-takes-the-fancy-next (there's always someone) but sadly, unless the players are good enough, there's nothing selectors can do.

However, when one goes from nothing all-rounder to international opening batsman in the space of less than half a season as Wright has, you've got serious, serious problems.

Similiarly, when someone with Trott's record gets picked in the ODI squad but doesn't play a game because ot Twenty20 failures, then slips down the pecking order behind someone who has gone from a nothing allrounder to a opening batsman in one season, you have even more problems.

 

[Perm]

Similiarly, when someone with Trott's record gets picked in the ODI squad but doesn't play a game because ot Twenty20 failures, then slips down the pecking order behind someone who has gone from a nothing allrounder to a opening batsman in one season, you have even more problems.

Sure do. Trott may not be ready for ODI cricket, but how on earth Luke Wright moved above him in the pecking-order is beyond me.

 

[Richard]

Similiarly, when someone with Trott's record gets picked in the ODI squad but doesn't play a game because ot Twenty20 failures, then slips down the pecking order behind someone who has gone from a nothing allrounder to a opening batsman in one season, you have even more problems.

At least they were picked for totally different roles, but it's ridiculous nonetheless, though I didn't follow Trott's OD fortunes in 2007, and if he wasn't performing, I'm glad he wasn't picked for ODIs, as there's little worse than a good player in bad form making his ODI debut.

 

[iamdavid]

keep kirtley mahmood hoggard bresnan and tremlett away from the odi team. Ali cook out too -scores too slowly. mustard 200% in for prior. tresco in if fit. maybe benning but he needs more cc matches 1st. mascarenhas must be in. vaughan and strauss away! monty in but keep eye on graham swann and rashid although i have not seen him bowl in od cricket. Im still out on luke wright...
MY ENGLAND ODI XI:
1. Tresco
2.Mustard
3.Bell
4.Pietersen
5.Collingwood
6.Flintoff
7.Mascarenhas
8.Swann
9.Broad
10.Sidebottom
11.Anderson

12. Bopara(unlucky)

Hopefully you just forgot about Owais Shah rather than leaving him out on merit, seems ready to take his game to the next level to me. Very dependable and adaptable player, given his recent form continues then England will atleast have a very solid middle order to build around with Pieterson, Collingwood and Shah.

 

[sunilreddy]

Trescothick
Cook
Bell
Pieterson
Collingwood(C)
Bopara
Wright
Mascheranus
Anderson
Tremlett
Panesar
Benning
Mustard(wk)
Broad
Swann