Why no Border in allstar team?

[PhoenixFire]

Border > Martyn in ODIs

 

[Richard]

You are joking, aren't you?

 

[murray]

Murray, if you disagree with someone, it would make sense to provide a reasoning why. So that your reasoning can be discussed and people will then add more facts/analysis to your opinion and argue both sides, which is the point of the forum.

Everyone here comes on here to discuss cricketing issues, and discussing the issues enhances everyone's understanding and appreciation of the game. It would be pointless just to post two word agreements and disagreements....it leads nowhere and while there are other less informed forums where that might be the norm, here most people are able and willing to defend their points.

Of course. I'll provide many reasons why AB was fanstasic, they will providemany reasons why they hate him. Eventually we will com e to some reason for it. let us leav eit aT THAT AND LET ME GO HOME.

 

[murray]

Border > Martyn in ODIs

Agreed.

 

[silentstriker]

Border > Martyn in ODIs

No, he is not. Border averages a full TEN points less and has fewer centuries (despite playing more matches). And Martyn has a higher S/R to boot. Its not a case where the stats are close and the decision could go either way on other factors.

 

[PhoenixFire]

You are joking, aren't you?

Well, for sake of team balance, yes.

 

[silentstriker]

Well, for sake of team balance, yes.

You are joking for the sake of team balance?

 

[silentstriker]

Of course. I'll provide many reasons why AB was fanstasic, they will providemany reasons why they hate him. Eventually we will com e to some reason for it. let us leav eit aT THAT AND LET ME GO HOME.

You can go home anytime you want to. If you want to be taken seriously on these forums though, instead of just perpetually ignored, you might want to start giving reasons.

 

[Richard]

Of course. I'll provide many reasons why AB was fanstasic, they will providemany reasons why they hate him. Eventually we will com e to some reason for it. let us leav eit aT THAT AND LET ME GO HOME.

Strange use of CAPS if I ever saw one...

Really, I repeat what I said earlier - one wonders what the point in posting at all is if you're just going to "leave it".

 

[Swervy]

well, without reading in full the to-ings and fro-ings of this thread, whilst I dont think Border really is in say the top 7 ODI batsmen for Australia, I think Richard doesnt really understand how good Border actually was in ODIs, and murray is correct in saying Border in the context of the times was a very good ODI batsmen

 

[Richard]

What, because the likes of Greg Ritchie, Wayne Phillips, etc. were around who happened to be even worse?

 

[Swervy]

What, because the likes of Greg Ritchie, Wayne Phillips, etc. were around who happened to be even worse?

no...more to do with the fact that he was a very good odi player..simple as.

An example which sticks out:

http://uk.cricinfo.com/db/ARCHIVE/1980S/1981-82/OD_TOURNEYS/WSC/WI_AUS_WSC_ODI15_19JAN1982.html

Doesnt look like much by Border, but he played that innings perfectly. Rain was threatening. Border played the run rate game as well as you could hope to see it, he marshalled the strike, and won the game for Australia, against what is possibly the greatest bowling attack that a ODI has ever seen.

Looking at the score card wont really do that justice, but that was the type of player Border was in ODIs (and this isnt really an isolated case)

 

[Lillian Thomson]

I've come to the conclusion that andmark is a true forum genius, he starts a new inappropriate thread instead of continuing the All Star discussion in the thread already dedicated to the subject and manages to start the silliest argument ever. He's almost daft enough to made a moderator.

 

[PhoenixFire]

Andmark > James tbh, get him in charge.

 

[Richard]

I've come to the conclusion that andmark is a true forum genius, he starts a new inappropriate thread instead of continuing the All Star discussion in the thread already dedicated to the subject and manages to start the silliest argument ever.

You've clearly missed about 346 arguments in the history of the forum, then...

 

[Richard]

no...more to do with the fact that he was a very good odi player..simple as.

An example which sticks out

Doesnt look like much by Border, but he played that innings perfectly. Rain was threatening. Border played the run rate game as well as you could hope to see it, he marshalled the strike, and won the game for Australia, against what is possibly the greatest bowling attack that a ODI has ever seen.

Looking at the score card wont really do that justice, but that was the type of player Border was in ODIs (and this isnt really an isolated case)

If it's such an un-isolated case, why is his average not higher?

There has never been a good batsman with an average of 30 in ODI cricket.

You don't have to make loads of massive scores to be a good ODI player, obviously, Michael Bevan demonstrates that perfectly, but if you come in lower down you need to get lots of not-outs. Border didn't. Nor did he, when he went up the order, score lots of big scores.

 

[Lillian Thomson]

You've clearly missed about 346 arguments in the history of the forum, then...

I don't agree, but I'm not telling you why, so there.

 

[Swervy]

If it's such an un-isolated case, why is his average not higher?

There has never been a good batsman with an average of 30 in ODI cricket.

You don't have to make loads of massive scores to be a good ODI player, obviously, Michael Bevan demonstrates that perfectly, but if you come in lower down you need to get lots of not-outs. Border didn't. Nor did he, when he went up the order, score lots of big scores.

please realise, and I know you have, that the game was different back then. Trust me, Border was a premier one day batsman back then

 

[Richard]

Why were there people who averaged 10 runs more than him, then?

Stephen Waugh "was a premier one-day batsman" in his day, too, and people advance that argument for the exact same reason as far as I'm concerned that people do for Border in his day.

That being that the notion of a brilliant Test batsman being poor in another form is just something some people's minds cannot accept.

 

[Richard]

I don't agree, but I'm not telling you why, so there.

And then.