Jason Gillespie

[hourn]

This isn't the best time to post this after the guy got 4 wickets today, but i only just found this forum today, but i've been thinking along these lines and told my argument to many people for a while now.

But anyway, Jason Gillespie, although he looks great, he has a great run up and a whippy action and bowls a good line and length, but he just doesn't pick up enough wickets.

There is no argument against it, he has hardly picked up a wicket since the Ashes tour, and even on that tour, he finished off poorly. Admittedly he seems to be unluckiest of the Australian bowlers and seems to have the most catches dropped of him, but after such a long period with so little wickets, this Ashes series is the time were he is going to have put some good performance or he may find himself on the outer of the Australian XI.

For a guy whos been compared to being "as dangerous as McGrath" he has hradly taken a wicket.

In fact, you'll find since (and including) the fourth test of the 2001 Ashes series he has taken only 29 wickets in 11 tests at an average of fractionally under 40.

For a guy to be opening the bowling and in that sought of form, is just not good for the team. And his four wickets today was his first 4for since early in the Ashes tour.

Thoughts??

 

[Eclipse]

No hes just been going through an unlucky patch mainly due to him never being abel to find consistent rythem because he constantly gets injured just as he srtings a few matches together.

Statisticly he beats the bat more offten than any other bowler world wide and at a pace of 140kph+ there is no doubt he is still one of the worlds most talented Fast bowlers.

Just a matter of him not getting injured and as you said he seems to be horribly unlucky with droped catches etc.

He has however been performing very well in ODI cricket latley avrageing 18 in ODI cricket so far this year.

 

[hourn]

I know he has had shocking injuries, and has been unlucky with dropped catches etc,. but the thing is, its starting to happen over a prolonged period now, and if he continues in this manner, then he will be under a lot of pressure to retain his spot, especially if Brett Lee and Paul Rofe keep their FC form up.

 

[Top_Cat]

I know he has had shocking injuries, and has been unlucky with dropped catches etc,. but the thing is, its starting to happen over a prolonged period now, and if he continues in this manner, then he will be under a lot of pressure to retain his spot, especially if Brett Lee and Paul Rofe keep their FC form up.

There is NO WAY that Australia will drop Jason Gillespie for any reason other than injury. Why? Because anyone with eyes in their head can see he's a quality bowler. The very same people who agree with this are the very same who said the same about Glenn McGrath before he became a world beater and they all said that because they could see just how good he was. With a prolonged run in the team, we'll see improved performances from Jason soon, trust me.

Having said that, I believe and maintain to this day that Jason's length is the main reason he's not picking up bags of wickets. He bowls around 20cm too short, as Glenn McGrath did early in his career. The immediate consequences of this is that the ball moves far too much for any batsmen to hit it, especially considering Jason gets an exceptional amount of movement off the seam. This goes far to explaining why he beats the bat so often yet hasn't taken many bags of wickets of late.

Not to trample on your original point but statistics be damned (this coming from a professional statistician ); you don't drop a guy like Jason Gillespie from your team because he hasn't taken a bag of 5 for a while. He'll turn the corner soon enough and the guys who actually play with him know this, hence why he's the second-choice fast bowler in the Aussie side.

Anyway, It's rare that Jason doesn't contribute with two or three wickets in most innings or at least the KEY wicket. An example on happed one Test ago; in the second innings, who were the stars? Warne and McGrath. Who took the wicket of England's first-innings top-scorer (Tresco) for bugger-all? Jason did. Quite a few times in his career he's not taken a bag of wickets but taken the key wicket in a given innings. That shows he has the ability but just needs the luck couple with the experience to bowl the right length.

 

[Rik]

Gillespie has a very strange action...his arm doesn't rotate fully and seems to come over at an angle, it looks like an injury just waiting to happen. Also I think Lee will get back into the squad and they will find he hasn't changed a bit and will struggle like he has lately. Just going back and taking wickets won't change the problems that are there. Also just a thought, Jeff Thompson averaged 27 with the ball in Test Cricket...and what does Lee average? Answers on a post-card...:rolleyes:

 

[Top_Cat]

Gillespie has a very strange action...his arm doesn't rotate fully and seems to come over at an angle, it looks like an injury just waiting to happen.

Yes but unlike his previous bowling action (s), his back is actually straight at the point of delivery. His arm doesn't need to follow-through in the same way as a Silverwood or Tudor because his pace and power come from his hips, back and wrist action. His back used to be the problem when he'd twist the bottom of it in his slightly front-on/side-on combination action.

His arm movement is a function of the fact that because he's using less of his back, he doesn't NEED to swing all the way through. His current action should result in less injuries. His thin calves are more of a problem these days than anything to do with his action.

 

[Rik]

Originally posted by Top_Cat

Gillespie has a very strange action...his arm doesn't rotate fully and seems to come over at an angle, it looks like an injury just waiting to happen.

Yes but unlike his previous bowling action (s), his back is actually straight at the point of delivery. His arm doesn't need to follow-through in the same way as a Silverwood or Tudor because his pace and power come from his hips, back and wrist action. His back used to be the problem when he'd twist the bottom of it in his slightly front-on/side-on combination action.

His arm movement is a function of the fact that because he's using less of his back, he doesn't NEED to swing all the way through. His current action should result in less injuries. His thin calves are more of a problem these days than anything to do with his action.

Now I've allways wondered why I never hurt my calves...built like Logs

 

[Anil]

Gillespie is the best support bowler in Australia and definitely the best support bowler in the world right now.

 

[Top_Cat]

Gillespie is the best support bowler in Australia and definitely the best support bowler in the world right now

And that's a very good point, actually. Glenn McGrath really came of age when he was forced to take over the role of main strike fast bowler early in his career. Who's to say that Jason won't do the same when he's given a mandate to bowl how he wants to?

As I said, it seems apparent to me that he holds back quite a bit. When he takes over leadership of the attack, who knows what he could do?

 

[Rik]

Originally posted by Top_Cat
When he takes over leadership of the attack, who knows what he could do?

Get Injured Again?

 

[marc71178]

Get Injured Again?

Last time I checked, he wasn't English...

 

[Top_Cat]

Get Injured Again?

Now wouldn't that be ironic?

"Glenn McGrath has officially retired from all cricket today leaving the door open for Jason Gillespie to take over leadership of the Australian attack. Unfortunately Jason Gillespie could not be reached for comment because he unfortunately snapped in half whilst trying to bowl a REALLY quick one in a Pura Cup match.............He was last seen being taken to hospital, the doctors commenting "Geez, he's a big bloke! Get me some Scotch-Tape and super-glue STAT!"

 

[Rik]

Originally posted by Top_Cat

Get Injured Again?

Now wouldn't that be ironic?

"Glenn McGrath has officially retired from all cricket today leaving the door open for Jason Gillespie to take over leadership of the Australian attack. Unfortunately Jason Gillespie could not be reached for comment because he unfortunately snapped in half whilst trying to bowl a REALLY quick one in a Pura Cup match.............He was last seen being taken to hospital, the doctors commenting "Geez, he's a big bloke! Get me some Scotch-Tape and super-glue STAT!"

Wow, proof you guys really do have a sense of humour

 

[age_master]

dizzy has a great bowling SR, he has better than McGrath against some teams - like england

 

[anzac]

maybe if Dizzy did pitch the ball up a bit more he wouldn't stray onto middle as often as he does & get picked off onto the on side......

my biggest criticism of him is he is too straight stump to stump & should bowl more often outside off, and maybe use the crease a bit more(?????)

Just a thought........people often talk about effective bowling partnerships & McGrath & Warne used to be great foils for each other when bowling together - how about a radical change to have Lee & Dizzy open the bowling, with McGrath & Warne to pair up again - or shorten Glenn's opening spell to bring Lee in while the ball is still 'new'??????

I don't think Dizzy or Lee work as well with Warne as they do not have McGrath's control of line & length. Nor do I feel that Lee is being used to the best as 1st change seamer.

Maybe with a good lead Australia could experiment a bit to see if it works and to keep the batsmen guessing????

 

[Gotchya]

Wow, proof you guys really do have a sense of humour

Wouldn't you love it if it were translated onto the cricket field

 

[Gotchya]

Just a thought........people often talk about effective bowling partnerships & McGrath & Warne used to be great foils for each other when bowling together - how about a radical change to have Lee & Dizzy open the bowling,

Of those two one was always attacking while the other contained the batting. If gillespie and Lee were to team together, that would be two attacking bowlers....in tandem. Not that is a bad thing, but i wonder how Australia would respond if those two got hammered.

All in all though this looks a good enough bet. No problem in experimenting either. Imagine if Lee and Gillespie started working well together regularly, with Mcgrath and Warne to follow...that would be murder.

 

[Top_Cat]

As someone who's led MANY attacks with the new ball, the very WORST thing you can suggest to a new-ball bowler is that they may be losing pace and should be relegated to first-change. Anyone who would even dare suggest that to me when I was playing, well I would have flattened them, quite frankly. Not to mention, they would have several deliveries whistling past their ears in the nets just to show them how quick I was. I would imagine McGrath to be no different in attitude and much better in execution so I wouldn't even attempt to say something like that to him!

Glenn McGrath's hubris would be severely dented by such a suggestion and anyway, he's still the leader of the attack and still quick enough. Plus he can still turn on the pace when he needs to.

I think that Gillespie and McGrath are a pretty effective pairing as it is. Leave Gillespie and Lee as the opening bowlers for when McGrath decides to call it a day.

Oh and Rik: :frog::frog::frog::frog:

EDIT: Damn, my old unicode didn't work. I feel so mid-90's.............

[Edited on 24/11/2002 by Top_Cat]

 

[hourn]

Points all taken, and i do agree and i know he is bowling well, but at the end of the day, it is wickets which are what great bowlers are compared by, and at the end of the day, he's just not getting many lately.

I wouldn't consider dropping him either, but i think he'd wanna start to consistently take more wickets before talk and pressure starts getting put on him from outside people.

btw, the idea to not open with McGrath is just not a good one. The guy takes wickets with new ball constantly and if Gillespie and Lee/Bichel opened up and couldn't nab one, it leaves Australia in a real prediciment.

 

[anzac]

by no means was I suggesting that McGrath be dropped even if he is not taking bags of wickets - I still rate him as one of if not THE most effective seam bowler in the game today - not just for taking wickets but especially for dominating opposition top orders!!!

my ideal opening attack for Australia would be to have McGrath open with Lee - I really think that bowl 1st change is part of Lee's problem....

the only reason why I suggested Lee / Gillespie opening was to partner McGrath with Warne. Recently it has seemed to me that Warne has spent a lot of time bowling in tandem with Lee & it has not worked for either of them. The other suggestion was for McGrath to open with Dizzy but in a shorter spell - bring Lee in while the ball is still 'new', and McGrath back into the attack to partner Warne...