kiwi odi team revamp

[whitedazzler]

now being a diehard kiwi supporter the batting performances of the champions trophy well was disappointing to say the least so it makes me wonder wetha or not nz can put a lineup on the pitch that could compete with the likes of australia & co.

heres my idea based on performances

1 S Fleming (cap)
2 B McCullum (wk)
3 N Astle
4 S Styris
5 R Taylor
6 D Vettori
7 C Harris
8 J Oram
9 A Adams
10 K Mills
11 S Bond

key points

I put mccullum at the top of the order because i believe he does have the ability to emulate the likes of gilchrist and dhoni and batting at 7, 8 or even 9 he doesn't get the chance (well he does but its when we are 50/5 kinda thing lol),

ross taylor needs to be in the team he will fail a bit theres no doubt but its when he fires it'll give nz such a massive advantage

vettori at 6 might seem a lil crazy but the boy has got a unorthadox yet solid technique he seems to have no problems against the aussie attack and holds the record for the fastest test century by a nzer

harris needs to b there just 4 his expeirence and his ability to take nz through the final 15 aswell as his bowlin ability to slow up the runs he mayb ageing but he's still got it in him

andre adams has the x factor his ability to smash the bowlers at the end of an innings is amazing and his bowling (whilst not accurate at times) does have the ability to make the cruical breakthroughs and mayb he can learn to bowl at the death again

Overall it gives new zealand the 4 pace bowlers (bond, mills, adams and oram), and 3 slower bowlers (styris, vettori and harris) aswell as what i believe to b a solid batting lineup goin all the way down to mills.

any thoughts much appreciated

 

[oz_fan]

Looks like a good team with a lot of good bowling options. Not sure about the batting though. Having Taylor at 5 and Vettori at 6 seems unstable and if NZ lose some early wickets they will be in a lot of trouble. I think there may be one too many bowling options so swap maybe Harris (unlikely that NZ will ever recall him to the team) for another batsman (maybe Fulton).

 

[thedarkmullet]

I think Vettori at 6 may be a bit risky but I wouldn't say its all that unstable. IMO he's a solid batsman who can play responsibly when the situation calls for it. I wouldn't like to back him when he needs to up the run-rate for extended periods though. He'd be invaluble in the middle overs, making use of his unorthadox style to work the ball around a bit....although as things stand thats what he ends up doing anyway.

I don't think Harris has any more life left at international level.

 

[Matt52]

Ryder and Taylor need to come into the side I think to give a bit more talent. We always talk about being captained well and enforcing game plans and such but I think we focus on all of that stuff because our team is simply not as talented a sthe other teams. Ryder and Taylor can help close the talent gap, and then I think our fighting spirit, good captaincy, and game plans etc will be more effective as well because we would have more talent to implement those things.

Fleming and Vincent are both middle order players in my opinion and Marshall has had his day,.

For the world cup I think we have to just put our most talented lineup on the park and hope they are not found out through lackof experience. I think at least that way, we have a chance of winning, If we continue with Marshall, Fulton, and Vincent as an opener, then we will never be good enough and so have no chance, even with a more experienced team

Ryder
Astle
Taylor
Fleming
Vincent
Oram
McCullum
Vettori
Mills ( not actually a fan, but just based on recent performances)
Bond
Gillespie (Bond needs a quick bowling partner)

I think this is our most talented line up. Fits nicely into an order as well. With Ryder and Astle both one day openers, Taylor bats at 3, and Fleming and Vincent, the natural middle order players in their correct positions.

 

[Macka]

McCullum shouldn't be opening until we see some consistency from him. His domestic one-day record is poor considering his talent, too.

No point in wasting Taylor at 5, where Styris has a very good record (average over 40 if I remember correctly). Like I mentioned in another thread:

Fleming
Vincent
Taylor
Astle
Styris
......

 

[tooextracool]

harris needs to b there just 4 his expeirence and his ability to take nz through the final 15 aswell as his bowlin ability to slow up the runs he mayb ageing but he's still got it in him

Harris is still available to play international cricket?!
Wow why on earth hasnt he been given a shot over some of the recent players who are nowhere near as good. I do hope to see him in the side for the world cup.
I agree with most of your points though, id like to see Mccullum bat at the top of the order as well, and Vettori get a boost. Especially when the lower order has been scoring more runs than the top order.

 

[tooextracool]

McCullum shouldn't be opening until we see some consistency from him. His domestic one-day record is poor considering his talent, too.

No point in wasting Taylor at 5, where Styris has a very good record (average over 40 if I remember correctly). Like I mentioned in another thread:

Fleming
Vincent
Taylor
Astle
Styris
......

How has papps being doing in List A cricket recently? Certainly has to be one of the unluckiest players to be averaging more than 50 in ODIs and yet not being able to get a game.

 

[Macka]

How has papps being doing in List A cricket recently? Certainly has to be one of the unluckiest players to be averaging more than 50 in ODIs and yet not being able to get a game.

He's been doing well in the one-day domestic game; I don't think his form in the 4-day game has been that good. Just remember that average of 50 is mostly from a successful time against RSA a few years ago.

The problem with Papps in the ODI games seems to be his lack of shots. He also hits the fielders a lot and scores a bit too slowly. He's more a gritty player... I think he's a better option for Tests.

 

[James]

I'd like to see the following team personally:

Astle, Ryder, Fleming, Vincent, Taylor, Styris, Oram, McCullum, Vettori, Mills, Bond

Vettori, Mills, Bond, Oram = 40 overs
Astle, Taylor, Styris = 10 overs

Bats deep and enough bowling options.

I'd have Patel as 12th man and rotate him in for Vincent depending on pitch conditions. He's a much better option than any our backup seamers IMO.

 

[albo97056]

Id have patel in the side over adams franklin or any of the seamers (barring mills and bond) on almost any surface. There seems to be this whole thing about having only one frontline spinner in a team. Whats wrong with 2 quality spinners in those middle overs? If patel was in the side for the aus game ahead of franklin it would have been VERY close


Harris must be 40 odd by now isnt he? and putting him at no7 would be a bit much.
Vettori has a batting average of 15 ish so i wouldnt want him in any higher than 8, 7 at a push.

 

[thierry henry]

Harris is 37

 

[Retox]

Vettori has a batting average of 15 ish so i wouldnt want him in any higher than 8, 7 at a push.

But he bats at what 7-8 of course he isn't gonna average 30-40.

You could put Bradman at 10 and see how many runs he scored.

 

[Bahnz]

I reckon Ryder is still too inexperienced. He needs a good season in domestic one day cricket (and probably to lose a couple of kg's), before he's brought into the one day team.
I like this team

Fleming, Astle, Taylor, Vincent, Styris, Oram, McCullum, Vettori, Mills, Bond, Gillespie/Patel

 

[albo97056]

But he bats at what 7-8 of course he isn't gonna average 30-40.

You could put Bradman at 10 and see how many runs he scored.

Yes but his test record isnt a great deal better, where he gets a bit more of a chance. Plus look at other no7 players, hussey averages 80! Just because u r in at 7/8 doesnt mean you cant average 25-30, infact youd be dissapointed if ur no7/8 wasnt averaging well over 20.

 

[tooextracool]

He's been doing well in the one-day domestic game; I don't think his form in the 4-day game has been that good. Just remember that average of 50 is mostly from a successful time against RSA a few years ago.

The problem with Papps in the ODI games seems to be his lack of shots. He also hits the fielders a lot and scores a bit too slowly. He's more a gritty player... I think he's a better option for Tests.

seems to have a pretty good List A record for somone who isnt supposed to be that good in ODIs. Certainly much better than his fc record

 

[Matt52]

I reckon Ryder is still too inexperienced. He needs a good season in domestic one day cricket (and probably to lose a couple of kg's), before he's brought into the one day team.
I like this team

Fleming, Astle, Taylor, Vincent, Styris, Oram, McCullum, Vettori, Mills, Bond, Gillespie/Patel

I am not so sure . I think that if you are good enough then you are old enough. Ryder is the same age as Taylor, so if Taylor is experienced enough them Ryder is experienced enough, and Ryder dominated that A series in Australia recently. I think he should definitely be in the team.

Top Order.

Ryder
Astle
Taylor
Fleming
Vincent