How come English can't bat?

[tooextracool]

I think one of the major reasons is the pitches and conditions until the early 90s or so were favoring bowlers more than batters. However as has already mentioned after that period we've by and large been crap compared to other nations and thats why players from outside the country have come in during the 90s and 00s and done well.

 

[Slow Love™]

LOL. Sterling work from aussie tragic in this thread.

Though it should be said that the English have a remarkable ability to be self-critical which I quite admire, that I doubt many Australians could muster even after a long period with little success (it's broader than just cricket, or sport, too).

 

[Sanz]

If that is the case then how come Shane Warne has struggled to average the figure you suggest is achievable just by putting the ball in the right place?

AMZ, Please dont get me wrong, but why do you dislike Warnie so much ? Sorry if it offended you in any way.

 

[oz_fan]

Thorpe came close and was England's best batsman in the late 90's and early 2000's. He finished with an average of close to 45 with 16 hundreds, which is very good.

 

[pietersenrocks]

Cook's average can be in 50's after his career will be over

 

[pietersenrocks]

Pietersen's average is 48.39 but we will have to wait till his career ended.

 

[PhoenixFire]

There is nothing extra special about players like Gooch and Mead.

Oh dear, how ignorant. Mead was the 4th highest scorer in FC cricket of all time, and to quote Wisden "Nobody has made more for one team than the 48,892 he piled up for Hampshire".

If scoring 55,000 runs isn't then god help me.

 

[GIMH]

The fact that none of our batsmen have averaged 50 doesn't mean Englishmen can't bat!!

LOL. Still, I reckon of our current crop, Strauss might finish in the 50s. He went below 50 in the winter, but if he keeps up his summer form this winter, his average will rocket up again. Strauss is our best batsman I reckon.

 

[aussie tragic]

so how many does India have? bar Tendulkar
how many do the West indies have bar Lara

Ever hear of the following:

India: Gavaskar (51.12 - 1987), Kambli (54.20 -1995), Dravid (59.38) and Sehwag (52.40) to go with Tendulkar (55.39)

West Indies: Davis (54.20 - 1973), Sobers (57.78 - 1974) and Richards (50.23 - 1991) to go with Lara (52.34).

So to answer your question, number of players to average 50+ since 1968 is India - 5, West Indian - 4, England - 1 (for now, but Cook to drop below 50 in Ashes)

btw, Aussies have 5 with G. Chappell (53.86 - 1984), Border (50.56 - 1994), S Waugh (51.06 - 2004), Hayden (53.08) and Ponting (58.22) and of course Gilly will get back up there soon

 

[PhoenixFire]

George Headley, averaged 60 odd in tests.

 

[aussie tragic]

George Headley, averaged 60 odd in tests.

Yeah, but he retired in 1954 (the thread was pointing out that no Englishmen had averaged 50+ since 1968). There was also Weekes (58.61 - 1958) and Walcott (56.68 - 1960)

 

[aussie tragic]

The fact that none of our batsmen have averaged 50 doesn't mean Englishmen can't bat!!

No, England just likes clogging up the middle order with the following

Fletcher (39.90)
Denness (39.69)
Broad (39.54)
Stewart (39.54)
Atherton (37.69)
Hussain (37.18)
Lamb (36.09)
Gatting (35.55)
Crawley (34.61)
Butcher (34.58)
Botham (33.54)
Randall (33.37)
Flintoff (33.08)
Tavare (32.50)
Hick (31.32)
Ramprakash (27.32)

 

[FaaipDeOiad]

If that is the case then how come Shane Warne has struggled to average the figure you suggest is achievable just by putting the ball in the right place?

 

[silentstriker]

No, England just likes clogging up the middle order with the following

Fletcher (39.90)
Denness (39.69)
Broad (39.54)
Stewart (39.54)
Atherton (37.69)
Hussain (37.18)
Lamb (36.09)
Gatting (35.55)
Crawley (34.61)
Butcher (34.58)
Botham (33.54)
Randall (33.37)
Flintoff (33.08)
Tavare (32.50)
Hick (31.32)
Ramprakash (27.32)

That's one sorry list of batting averages.

 

[PhoenixFire]

No, England just likes clogging up the middle order with the following

Fletcher (39.90)
Denness (39.69)
Broad (39.54)
Stewart (39.54)
Atherton (37.69)
Hussain (37.18)
Lamb (36.09)
Gatting (35.55)
Crawley (34.61)
Butcher (34.58)
Botham (33.54)
Randall (33.37)
Flintoff (33.08)
Tavare (32.50)
Hick (31.32)
Ramprakash (27.32)

Gatting, Crawley, Hick, Butcher and Ramprakash are all pretty decent players, just a shame they couldn't quite get it right at Test level.

 

[silentstriker]

Gatting, Crawley, Hick, Butcher and Ramprakash are all pretty decent players, just a shame they couldn't quite get it right at Test level.

Which means they aren't really 'decent' players, by Test standards.

 

[GIMH]

I'd say Atherton is a better player than his average suggests. And Hussain.

As for Both's average, and Flintoff's, well I'm sure other teams wouldn't have minded having them *clogging* up their middle orders!

 

[PhoenixFire]

Which means they aren't really 'decent' players, by Test standards.

Well Hick, Butcher, Gatting, Rampkakash and Crawley all proved that they could do it at test level, all making good scores at one time or another, it was just consistency that was the problem.

 

[aussie tragic]

As for Both's average, and Flintoff's, well I'm sure other teams wouldn't have minded having them *clogging* up their middle orders!

Other teams would have had them at # 7 like Gilchrist

 

[andmark]

Won't have them come New Year.

Wheres the confidence