Battle of the Test captains

[Slifer]

Cronje

 

[C_C]

Cronje- matchfixing notwithstanding, we cannot deny that he was quite a good captain tactically and man-management wise.
Lets not fall for the cliched trap of 'black and white' where the bad guy is all bad and the good guys are all good. Relativity is important.

 

[Slow Love™]

Cronje- matchfixing notwithstanding, we cannot deny that he was quite a good captain tactically and man-management wise.
Lets not fall for the cliched trap of 'black and white' where the bad guy is all bad and the good guys are all good. Relativity is important.

Not wanting to sidetrack the thread too much, but it's not falling for the cliched trap of "black and white, where the bad guy is all bad etc" so much as drawing a line through Cronje's conduct directly related to cricket (which sets it apart from say, appreciating the films of Roman Polanski in spite of the sins of his personal life). It's not like people in this thread are demanding that all Cronje's stats be struck from the record, either.

But I would say that the fact that he brought the game into such disrepute (and exploited those less experienced than himself to deliberately sully the game) purely for the sake of his own financial gratification, is a very big deal, and not some kind of casual footnote to his career of minor importance. So I think the reaction is valid.

 

[Jono]

Surely you would have to completely disregard it??? I can't for the life of me see how Cronje could collect a single vote unless you did. And I'm not sure I see the sense in that, personally, as in my book trashing the game like that man did is way, way worse than the inept but earnest mistakes other captains might make in general.

Maybe this could have been more of a contest if Perm had strictly said to disregard Cronje's disgraceful mockery of our great game, but seeing as it's obviously on the table, I vote Benaud in a heartbeat.

Sorry that's what I mean, just worded poorly. I meant "I'm guessing everyone will take his match-fixing into account, and its probably correct that they do, but I'll disregard it and look at their record and management skills from watching Cronje and reading about Benaud."

That being said, if Cronje is an automatic loss to Benaud (one of the best ever) because of his match-fixing, that would probably be a factor anyway to every other captain if it was part of the criteria. Hence there wasn't any point including Cronje in the 32 anyway.

Three question marks suggest some mighty displeasure

 

[Slow Love™]

Sorry that's what I mean, just worded poorly. I meant "I'm guessing everyone will take his match-fixing into account, and its probably correct that they do, but I'll disregard it and look at their record and management skills from watching Cronje and reading about Benaud."

Three question marks suggest some mighty displeasure

I had four originally, but then edited it back, as that might have been a tad excessive. Three seemed to get across my level of outrage just right.

 

[Perm]

Richie Benaud takes this one out 13-16 in a very close battle.

Round 1, Battle 5

Ali Bacher

Test: 4 Matches, 4 Wins, 0 Losses. Winning Percentage: 100%

vs

Stephen Fleming

Test: 78 Matches, 27 Wins, 26 Losses. Winning Percentage: 34%
ODI: 191 Matches, 84 Wins, 94 Losses. Winning Percentage: 43%

Voting will last 24 hours.

 

[Mister Wright]

Stephen Fleming easily.

 

[thedarkmullet]

Fleming, easy.

 

[NZTailender]

Fleming.




Wonder how many ill vote for Bacher because of his 100% record...

 

[oz_fan]

Fleming

 

[Dasa]

Well Bacher did a lot for South African cricket, but not really much as captain. Winning 4 Tests out of 4 is no mean feat, but he was in charge of probably the best South African side ever. Fleming for me.

 

[nightprowler10]

Fleming.

 

[C_C]

Fleming.




Wonder how many ill vote for Bacher because of his 100% record...

I do hope our resident 'win % is the benchmark for captaincy excellence' come around to answering this.

 

[Jono]

Fleming.

 

[BhupinderSingh]

Stephen Fleming

 

[grecian]

Fleming

Benaud winning, best result since Citys 0-0 draw at the Theatre of crass commercialism

 

[NZTailender]

I do hope our resident 'win % is the benchmark for captaincy excellence' come around to answering this.

Haha yeah.

 

[Anil]

fleming

 

[Fusion]

Fleming

 

[silentstriker]

I do hope our resident 'win % is the benchmark for captaincy excellence' come around to answering this.

This is toughy only because 4 matches aren't enough to give a real indication. However, 100% is still a very compelling number....

If the opposing captain had 40 tests as captain and had like an 80%-90% win rate, then it would be real close.

But as it is, its not close: Bacher