ICC-Asia Split - Would you really care?

[Langeveldt]

If it was the Asian bloc + Australia, I would be extremely happy with the situation. Here are the countries I care about playing:

Australia
England
Pakistan
Sri Lanka

Wouldn't happen, you'd then get the Ashes, and all the best teams in the same block..

Still, at least we'd see the the emergance of a very succesful SA side

 

[silentstriker]

Another positive thing would be that the cricket load on countries and players would lessen. I am warming up to the idea.

 

[Langeveldt]

Another positive thing would be that the cricket load on countries and players would lessen. I am warming up to the idea.

And they could play as little or as often as they wanted, without being dictated to by Asian tournaments/Ashes commitments/whatever

 

[silentstriker]

Wouldn't happen, you'd then get the Ashes, and all the best teams in the same block..

Still, at least we'd see the the emergance of a very succesful SA side

Well England and Australia don't have to be in the Asian bloc to play them. THere is nothing to stop the two countries from scheduling bilateral matches (and they would, considering the money they would make).

 

[silentstriker]

And they could play as little or as often as they wanted, without being dictated to by Asian tournaments/Ashes commitments/whatever

Yea, I hate the random tournaments like the champions trophy, etc. As far as I'm concerned, the only tournament like that, that is spoonsored by the ICC should be the WC.

 

[Langeveldt]

Yea, I hate the random tournaments like the champions trophy, etc. As far as I'm concerned, the only tournament like that, that is spoonsored by the ICC should be the WC.

exactly

 

[Sanz]

Interesting opinions, cheers, I know me and Neil found it a very attractive alternative to the status quo, which really is a sad state of affairs..

What is sad, you and Neil finding it as an attractive alternative or the current status quo ?

In any case, it is the most stupid idea, here we are talking about globalization of games and you suggesting a split meaning ICC cant even handle 10 test nations.

 

[Dasa]

As far as I can see, so far the reasons given for a split have been things like 'we only care about the Ashes', 'there'll be less ODIs', 'players don't like the subcontinent' etc. Any good reasons? Remember, there are over a billion cricket fans in the subcontinent that you have to think about. You abandon them, you abandon cricket's biggest fan base and biggest money generator.

 

[SJS]

Of course it would be bad for the game and , of course, its not going to happen.

 

[pasag]

Cricket would never recover if there was a split.

 

[Langeveldt]

Well if we (England/SA) played less international cricket as the result of a split, I'd be strongly in favour of it

 

[Goughy]

As far as I can see, so far the reasons given for a split have been things like 'we only care about the Ashes', 'there'll be less ODIs', 'players don't like the subcontinent' etc. Any good reasons? Remember, there are over a billion cricket fans in the subcontinent that you have to think about. You abandon them, you abandon cricket's biggest fan base and biggest money generator.

All those things you mention are decent but not full reasons. The most important reason has been illustrated this last week.

Its the difference in the reason cricket is played and how nations judge their players. If people want to make things an issue of national and cultural respect and pride, that fine but they should not be playing games against teams that are far less prone to that type of drama and view onfield proceedings in a completely different manner.

This is the crux, different groups view on-field behaviour in complelely different ways. I dont see how 11 guys dressed in white can have any bearing on a nation but others do. I find what they say massively over-dramatic and frankly scary and they obviously feel strongly about the way they feel.

Its not about right or wrong but about how how 2 completely different mentalities can live together and after the last week Im not sure they can.

I thought Pakistans behaviour was disgracful but others were completely behind it. Neither side will change its mind and its a matter of opinion rather than absolute rights or wrongs. Due to that, maybe its best that each goes there own way

 

[Slow Love™]

I think the point to consider is that each and every cricket fan wants to see cricket of the highest order, which is at present international cricket. Cricket boards might engage in politics, but at the end of the day the fan on the street would still prefer to see exchanges at the highest level rather than groupism over petty issues.

I could not agree more. I've occasionally flirted with the idea of a two-tier system (with movement within the tiers) to lessen the hectic itinerary, but having a situation where the competition is literally split over irreconcilable differences between geographical regions would be both a disaster and extremely depressing, and IMO a far worse fate than the occasional power tussles we are currently subjected to.

In any case, it is the most stupid idea, here we are talking about globalization of games and you suggesting a split meaning ICC cant even handle 10 test nations.

Yes.

Any good reasons?

No.

 

[Sanz]

Welcome Back SLow Love, I guess it took an event of this magnitude to bring you back on the forum.

Hey atleast we can thank 'The Asian Bloc' for this.

 

[silentstriker]

All those things you mention are decent but not full reasons. The most important reason has been illustrated this last week.

Its the difference in the reason cricket is played and how nations judge their players. If people want to make things an issue of national and cultural respect and pride, that fine but they should not be playing games against teams that are far less prone to that type of drama and view onfield proceedings in a completely different manner.

Agreed. I guess its a matter of perspective.

This is the crux, different groups view on-field behaviour in complelely different ways. I dont see how 11 guys dressed in white can have any bearing on a nation but others do. I find what they say massively over-dramatic and frankly scary and they obviously feel strongly about the way they feel.

Goughy, you have to understand the mentality. There are no other sports there. There are no sportspeople on the grand stage to support and cheer. There are rarely any wins at the olympics, or any international sporting events. In global diplomacy, the people there feel like they are too often ignored.

Its not that the cricket players have a lot of bearing on the nation, the cricket players are the nation, for all practical purposes. So when a cricketer does something, people take it personally. I mean, REALLY personally. Thats why cricket gets tied of so often with the jingoistic sentiment around the subcontinent. Cricket is the only way the subcontinent represents itself to the rest of the world. Its about national identity, not simply if some bowler was liberal with his nails.

Its not just the sport, its that cricket is really the only venue where a lot of nations feel they can compete with - and possibly surpass - the first world. The mentality will probably change as the countries modernize and westernize - but thats why people take the 'cheaters' tag so seriously.

 

[Sanz]

Its not that the cricket players have a lot of bearing on the nation, the cricket players are the nation, for all practical purposes. So when a cricketer does something, people take it personally. I mean, REALLY personally. Thats why cricket gets tied of so often with the jingoistic sentiment around the subcontinent. Cricket is the only way the subcontinent represents itself to the rest of the world. Its about national identity, not simply if some bowler was liberal with his nails.

Its not just the sport, its that cricket is really the only venue where a lot of nations feel they can compete with - and possibly surpass - the first world. The mentality will probably change as the countries modernize and westernize - but thats why people take the 'cheaters' tag so seriously.

And that's the most stupid explanation and excuse I have read for the sheer jinoistic stupidity displayed by some fans. Cricket isn't our national identity, it is just a popular sport probably the most popular in the subcontinent.

 

[Goughy]

Goughy, you have to understand the mentality. There are no other sports there. There are no sportspeople on the grand stage to support and cheer. There are rarely any wins at the olympics, or any international sporting events. In global diplomacy, the people there feel like they are too often ignored.

Its not that the cricket players have a lot of bearing on the nation, the cricket players are the nation, for all practical purposes. So when a cricketer does something, people take it personally. I mean, REALLY personally. Thats why cricket gets tied of so often with the jingoistic sentiment around the subcontinent. Cricket is the only way the subcontinent represents itself to the rest of the world. Its about national identity, not simply if some bowler was liberal with his nails.

Its not just the sport, its that cricket is really the only venue where a lot of nations feel they can compete with - and possibly surpass - the first world. The mentality will probably change as the countries modernize and westernize - but thats why people take the 'cheaters' tag so seriously.

I have no doubt that many people feel that way, however many others around the world dont and if a split would mean not having to deal with this type of drama then it is attractive.

As it stands, Im not convinced the 2 ways of viewing the sport are compatable. As I said, its not a matter of right or wrong but about 2 mentalities that cannot function together well.

 

[cricketboy29]

Yeah, I think it very definitely is part of our cultural identity, when I meet new Indians. Inevitably the second question after 'Are you Indian?' is 'Do you play Cricket?'. As well as that . The points that silentstriker brings up are pretty valid I must say, barring the International diplomacy one. We don't have any proficency in any other sport. Unless you want to count Rathore's silver medal at the Olympics. No consistency in anything except Cricket. Sania Mirza, here one day gone the next day. I dont even hear about her anymore. Paes and Bhupathi had a good run of about a year, when they reached all 4 grand slam finals and now they're gone.

Like it or not, Cricket is one place where Indians choose to display their nationalistic fervour, and subconsciously it may be a game of one-upmanship with other countries, but I don't think the players themselves are that affected by it.

 

[Slow Love™]

Welcome Back SLow Love, I guess it took an event of this magnitude to bring you back on the forum.

Cheers, Sanz. Good to see you too, mate.

I actually couldn't get here much in Jan and Feb because of connectivity issues, and I eventually got annoyed and stopped trying (it all seems fixed now and I see that James has mentioned something about changing providers). I was following the game on cricinfo the other day, and when the meltdown happened, I decided to come by and see what everybody was saying (or ranting, as the case may be).

 

[Fusion]

I have no doubt that many people feel that way, however many others around the world dont and if a split would mean not having to deal with this type of drama then it is attractive.

As it stands, Im not convinced the 2 ways of viewing the sport are compatable. As I said, its not a matter of right or wrong but about 2 mentalities that cannot function together well.

I find this talk of "we don't need them" and "we don't think alike" very disturbing (from either side). In the recent past of U.S History, there was a big movement to segregate whites from blacks ("separate but equal"). Some of the same arguments of "our culture/values/way of life is different" were used. You don't run away from problems, you try to resolve them. If you think you can live happily ever after by simply blocking yourself off from the other side, you'd be sadly mistaken. A split like this would be disastrous. And it won't happen, no matter what the wishes of some.