Future of fast bowling in India

[Richard]

Well Patel bowled in the 140s regularly at Mohali and Mumbai - Sreesanth never seemed to me to be bowling in the 140s at either Nagpur or Mumbai. I didn't watch every speed of every ball, though - may be wrong.
Has VRV Singh been clocked in the 90s? Ever? Until he is so, he's supposed to be nothing. No human can tell the difference between 85mph and 90.
Clearly, RP Singh either was that fast or something suggested he was. Maybe he (and everyone else) was bowling faster that game than normally?

 

[Goughy]

No human can tell the difference between 85mph and 90.

Of course they can. Its just that most fans have no idea how quick either is.

85 to 90 is a big difference and any quality player can tell the difference between 2 balls 8kph different.

By your logic NOONE can tell the difference between 142 kph and 150 kph and that is obviously false.

Please, for my sanity, stop using absolutes and sweeping statements when expressing your beleifs

 

[quick4mindia]

Has Sreesanth ever been clocked at 140kph or close?
If so, I certainly missed it.

Yes he has been clocked many times above 140K

 

[sessabmud]

Yes he has been clocked many times above 140K

Well it doesn't matter you're quick, if you're giving away 6 an over and average 40+ in one dayers after 14 games. But, Greg is a fan. so we have to deal.

 

[adharcric]

Well it doesn't matter you're quick, if you're giving away 6 an over and average 40+ in one dayers after 14 games. But, Greg is a fan. so we have to deal.

You should watch some cricket before making random posts. Sreesanth's average could well have been 30 if regulation catches weren't spilled by his teammates.
Excuse me, Greg is a fan? We're all fans and the biggest thing is that non-Indians on this forum rate Sreesanth highly, which is a true indication of his potential and ability.

 

[quick4mindia]

Again coming back to the 6th ODI bet India and England. The pitch and the ground were the best so far in the series. so it was just natural for the fast bowlers to bend their back a little more than the normal. If RP bowled 88 MPH, no surprise because i have seen him crossing the 140K.
Sreesanth seems to be the best find in recent times. He has an positive attitude and can remain pretty cool even catches after catches are dropped of his bowling. The one problem i marked though was that often he starts off well with lots of swing and seam movement (away from the right handers, some times too much of it and called wides), the moment he is hit for a couple of boundaries he looses control.
you will notice this for him quite often
3-1-10/11-1
6-1-40-1
Munaf has the most uncomplicated of action (which Sreesanth and VRV lack) and can vary between 130-145K at will. He can bowl yorkers right at the toe and get the old ball swing.
VRV was the let down for the day. I just hope for the best for him. Though i haven't seen him being clocked earlier but if all the batsmen who have faced him were vouching for his pace then there must be something in him. He failed miserably in that 6th one dayer. His bowling seemed to me was out of rhythm and thats why he failed to generate pace.
Before this i have seen him bowling in the challenger and he appeared to be quite pacey

 

[quick4mindia]

Anybody got some information on Abid Nabi and his bowling style?

 

[HowsThat]

Pace wise,

VRV> Munaf>> Sreesanth

Quality wsie

Munaf >>Sreesanth>> VRV.

Munaf is a real quality find by india, i reckon he will be among the top bowlers of the world in few years.Sreesanth is also an impressive pacer, he might partner Munaf in test matches depending upon VRV's failure or success. If VR establishes himself in the test team then Sreesanth will lose his way to VRV.

All in all an exciting scenario for team India.

 

[adharcric]

On VR Singh: He's definitely pacy, because the selectors and batsmen across the nation consider him to be pacier than Munaf Patel. He was apparently pacy in the Challenger Series and perhaps the warm-up 3-dayer at Baroda. The only thing I'd seen from him before this was the warm-up 1-dayer where he was averaging 87-88 mph, so it doesn't seem outrageous that he can top 90. He didn't seem to have his rythm yesterday for some reason, but we'll find out what he's really made of soon enough.

On Abid Nabi: We don't know too much about him, but here's what we do know. He has apparently clocked 147 kph (but I'm not sure how accurate that reading was) and has been called to bowl in the nets despite not even being a Duleep Trophy regular yet in domestic cricket. That indicates that the management sees something special in him. VVS Laxman was impressed by his pace and swing in the nets and Dennis Lillee recommended him a while ago. Still, he's not seasoned and is likely quite raw and still wayward. I doubt he's ready for international cricket at the moment but he should definitely figure by the end of the year. Expect to see him in the Challenger Series or the India A team at some point. He seems to have a decent action and is tall and well-built.

 

[adharcric]

Sreesanth and VRV will compete for the opening bowler's spot. Munaf is better as a first-change bowler and his competition is less there with RP Singh as the best reserve option.

 

[quick4mindia]

Now hearing of someone touching 147 K reminds me of the dream run of Ashish Nehra in W/C 2003 where he consistently bowled bet 145-149 Ks.
He is now not even in the consideration due to his fragility. He is not even in the good books of Chappel.
But in my opinion he was always a better bowler than all his contemporaries (Read Zaheer, Balaji)
To me Srinath is the best india has ever produced so far but he could never get a partner who could continue the pressure at the other end.
Kapil was an unbreakable Bull but Srinath was better in quality.

 

[adharcric]

Nehra certainly had loads of potential. The thing is, fitness is monitored much better today with regimens, support staffs and what not, so the likelihood of bowlers losing their pace due to poor fitness (Nehra's case) isn't as likely.

I'd say Zaheer is a finished case, he's had so many chances and has wasted them with poor fitness and attitude. Nehra is 27 and if his fitness is back, he could figure slightly. Balaji is almost 25 so age-wise he's fine, but his lack of pace will be more of an issue now than it was when there were no Sreesanth/Munaf/VRV types clocking 140.

 

[thierry henry]

Is 140 fast now? James Franklin bowled a number of balls over 140kph in the recent ODI series against the Windies and NZers complain he is too slow.

 

[adharcric]

Is 140 fast now? James Franklin bowled a number of balls over 140kph in the recent ODI series against the Windies and NZers complain he is too slow.

Depends on the accuracy. Frankly, I haven't seen enough of Franklin but there is no way 140 can be called slow. It's not exactly "express" by international standards but it's definitely fast enough to trouble batsman by sheer pace. Munaf and Sreesanth didn't just sling cannons all over the place at 140, they took wickets with those deliveries. That's why it matters.

 

[quick4mindia]

Is 140 fast now? James Franklin bowled a number of balls over 140kph in the recent ODI series against the Windies and NZers complain he is too slow.

140K is fast enough. It is not the freakist fast. just crosses the boundary line bet fast medium and fast.
145 K consistently is considered real fast. and normally those who clock 145 also bowl in in 150s.
Example: LEE
Shoaib
Bond
Jermain Lawson
and few of the new west indies fast bowlers are quick (I think Tino best and one or two more) but they lack the accuracy. Fast bowler without accuracy is any batsmen's delight

 

[RolledOver]

. Fast bowler without accuracy is any batsmen's delight

A la Mohd Sami

 

[sessabmud]

You should watch some cricket before making random posts. Sreesanth's average could well have been 30 if regulation catches weren't spilled by his teammates.
Excuse me, Greg is a fan? We're all fans and the biggest thing is that non-Indians on this forum rate Sreesanth highly, which is a true indication of his potential and ability.

Um, yes, I do watch cricket. Many of his wickets have been against tailenders.

if you can't fight the stats, then you resort to "potential" and "talent".

And 6 runs per over tells the whole story. Let me guess, you're from his state.

 

[sessabmud]

Nehra certainly had loads of potential. The thing is, fitness is monitored much better today with regimens, support staffs and what not, so the likelihood of bowlers losing their pace due to poor fitness (Nehra's case) isn't as likely.

I'd say Zaheer is a finished case, he's had so many chances and has wasted them with poor fitness and attitude. Nehra is 27 and if his fitness is back, he could figure slightly. Balaji is almost 25 so age-wise he's fine, but his lack of pace will be more of an issue now than it was when there were no Sreesanth/Munaf/VRV types clocking 140.

Zaheer Khan was the highest wicket taker in Pakistan. SO no he didn't "WASTE" his chance. DOn't make generic statements without backing up your case. 140 means nothing, Pathan bowls at 120s and still is effective. Nehra still has potential to be a great ODI bowler, in helpful conditions, especially. But, Greg Chappell doesn't like either Nehra or Khan and has also called them "cancer" -- so they're done till 2007

 

[quick4mindia]

140 means nothing, Pathan bowls at 120s and still is effective. Chappell doesn't like either Nehra or Khan and has also called them "cancer" -- so they're done till 2007

Well said. 140 is nothing if bowled at half of the pitch and 3 yards outside leg or off. similarly 120 is nothing if not added with swing or seam.
the slow bowlers have only one problem that is if the conditions are not favorable their bowling loses all its sting. while a fast bowler with reasonable accuracy is always handy whatever may be the conditions.

And did chappel use such strong word against Nehra and Zaheer?? I doubt (though would appreciate if you provide some link to that. Had heard that he questioned committment of Zaheer but he hadn't said nethin against Nehra. May be I am wrong

 

[adharcric]

Zaheer Khan was the highest wicket taker in Pakistan. SO no he didn't "WASTE" his chance. DOn't make generic statements without backing up your case. 140 means nothing, Pathan bowls at 120s and still is effective. Nehra still has potential to be a great ODI bowler, in helpful conditions, especially. But, Greg Chappell doesn't like either Nehra or Khan and has also called them "cancer" -- so they're done till 2007

Yeah he was the leading wicket-taker in tests, but he got 3 or 4 of those against the tail at the end of that mammoth innings from Pakistan. I'll admit he bowled a few good spells in the 2nd test, but considering how much talent he had, he shouldn't be where he is right now. His fitness is shabby. In ODIs, he was absolute rubbish against Pakistan.

As for Nehra, I didn't say pace means everything. I was just explaining why the trend of Indian bowlers losing their pace is less likely now than in the past. Don't tell me about Pathan doing well without pace, I've been spreading that message across this forum for a while now. Nehra still does have a chance and hopefully he returns in better shape and with improved fielding.