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Thread: Australia do not have a good enough captain to lead the next generation

  1. #1
    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Australia do not have a good enough captain to lead the next generation

    I'm sorry people, you can be a fan of Ponting's batting, but his captaincy is crap! The results are (not) there for everyone to see. Losing to Bangladesh, Ashes loss, and now losing defending 430+.

    Fair enough every captain has a bad day every now and then, but Ponting's captaincy lacks imagination, he has no idea what to do when things are on the line. His excuse of bowling Lewis at the death being "he's our death bowler," just doesn't cut it. Look at the scoreboard Ricky! Bowl someone else! It is just ridiculous. I can also remember in a ODI when Laxman needed a single off the last ball of the innings at the 'Gabba to get his century and India were 298 and Ponting brought his field in to prevent the single and Laxman just cracked it for four. Imagine if we had of lost that game by one run, who cares if Laxman gets his century, put your men out and defend the innings total!

    I just can't see Australia ushering in a new era of players with Ponting as captain, this may be why the selectors continue to recall players like Martyn and Kasprowcz. Kasprowicz may have deserved his recall, but Martyn didn't.
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    State Captain chooka_nick's Avatar
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    Kyle man, we do have Cameron White (who's incredibly intelligent and shrewd), but I agree about Punter's captaincy; it's not up to standard, despite his God-like batting.
    It'll be a few years before White comes though tho, so who in the mean time? Gilly's a good skip, so's Warnie, but if they all go any time soon we may in fact be left with a Martyn or a Langer...
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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chooka_nick
    Kyle man, we do have Cameron White (who's incredibly intelligent and shrewd), but I agree about Punter's captaincy; it's not up to standard, despite his God-like batting.
    It'll be a few years before White comes though tho, so who in the mean time? Gilly's a good skip, so's Warnie, but if they all go any time soon we may in fact be left with a Martyn or a Langer...
    IMO Langer is the best captain in the test side. The way he used power plays against South Australia to win one of their ING games was amazing. That day he just seemed to read things before they happened, Ponting reads things after they have happened.

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    State Captain chooka_nick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    IMO Langer is the best captain in the test side. The way he used power plays against South Australia to win one of their ING games was amazing. That day he just seemed to read things before they happened, Ponting reads things after they have happened.
    Agreed Ponting reads them in the paper the day after... Langer for my vote then (not that it matters). Vice-captain?


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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chooka_nick
    Agreed Ponting reads them in the paper the day after... Langer for my vote then (not that it matters). Vice-captain?
    Warne and Langer would be my ideal Captain/Vice Captain - but that aint gonna happen. More for the fact that Langer could actually get more smug being captain than anything else.

    White will have to warrant his place in the side before he is made captain in the future.

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    Global Moderator vic_orthdox's Avatar
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    I think White is definently captaincy material. Whether his actual cricket is deserving of that slot is questionable.

    The onus needs to go on the states to provide a few youngsters with more responsibility, instead of giving it to the guys who have finished in their prime and were part of the previous 10 years of Australian cricket.

    WRT White again, this year - and his career statistics will probably end up being similar - he averaged mid 30s with both bat and ball. Now, all things aside (lets say he has a couple of really good years in Pura Cup cricket and does a little better than that, and earns a spot in the Aus side) would those sort of figures if produced while playing for Australia be enough to keep you in the side consistently?

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    State 12th Man Autobahn's Avatar
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    Langer is too old now to be captain, at nearly 36 it won't be that long until he retires from international cricket no point in giving langer the captaincy in the short term.

    I've heard about White being quite a clever captain but there's questions over wether he could make the team in the first place, the aussies have always picked the best 11 first and then picked the captain from that selection and as a batsmen or a bowler he just won't be able make the team i feel.

    The long term option i think could be easily Michael Clarke but that's still a couple of years down the line really unless the selectors want to take a gamble.

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend andyc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Autobahn
    The long term option i think could be easily Michael Clarke but that's still a couple of years down the line really unless the selectors want to take a gamble.
    Yeah, I was thinking Clarke too. It'd be a bit early to give it to him after Ponting retires (guess that depends when he retires, mind you), but Smith's done alright with SA and he's pretty young.
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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vic_orthdox
    I think White is definently captaincy material. Whether his actual cricket is deserving of that slot is questionable.

    The onus needs to go on the states to provide a few youngsters with more responsibility, instead of giving it to the guys who have finished in their prime and were part of the previous 10 years of Australian cricket.

    WRT White again, this year - and his career statistics will probably end up being similar - he averaged mid 30s with both bat and ball. Now, all things aside (lets say he has a couple of really good years in Pura Cup cricket and does a little better than that, and earns a spot in the Aus side) would those sort of figures if produced while playing for Australia be enough to keep you in the side consistently?
    Considering we've just coming out of a period of absolute dominance where averaging mid-30 was not good enough we may have to adjust our thoughts on what is good enough. If White is winning games with his captaincy and never in a big slump then I think yes we could. However if he is doing that as an allrounder the specialist players will have to step up to the mark.

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    Cricket Web: All-Time Legend Mister Wright's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyc
    Yeah, I was thinking Clarke too. It'd be a bit early to give it to him after Ponting retires (guess that depends when he retires, mind you), but Smith's done alright with SA and he's pretty young.
    Clarke has to be a consistent figure in the side. So therefore whoever takes over from Ponting will have to have been a regular consistent player.

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    Hall of Fame Member chaminda_00's Avatar
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    Clarke, White or Mosies im sure one of them will do a decent job as captain in the future. I can see an Australia side in the future similar to the current RSA side with Mosies, White and Watson all providing all round roles in the side and adding depth to batting and bowling in this way. Similar to how Kallis, Pollock and Boje/Hall do to RSA.
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    International Coach howardj's Avatar
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    I don't think Ponting will have any trouble gaining the respect of the new guys who come into the team. His batting alone ensures that he's a respected figure in the side. I do agree that his captaincy out on the field is below par, though. I don't think this, of itself, will detrimentally affect the actual development of the players coming through.

    However, his (to this point) sub-standard captaincy may slightly affect our winning percentage. My main concern with the next generation is that the whole system is being clogged up by a number of 29-35 year old guys who have no chance of playing for Australia. There should be a quota system (three/four players under 23 in FC every side).

    The best Test cricketers in the last 15 years (and probably before that too) have debuted for Australia before age 25. Anyway, back on topic....Ponting will be the skipper for the next five years, by which time Michael Clarke will take over.

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    Global Moderator vic_orthdox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by howardj
    There should be a quota system (three/four players under 23 in FC every side).
    I think they've done everything but that at state level. There is a quota system for 2nd XI cricket now. I think you can only have like 5 players older than 25.

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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by andyc
    Yeah, I was thinking Clarke too. It'd be a bit early to give it to him after Ponting retires (guess that depends when he retires, mind you), but Smith's done alright with SA and he's pretty young.
    Has Clarke captained every reprisentative side he's played for (before Australia)?
    Smith made a big thing when given the job of the fact he didn't have much experience of not being captain, and that's why he's been able to do it at such a young age. Most people wouldn't.
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    Cricket Web Staff Member Richard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mister Wright
    I'm sorry people, you can be a fan of Ponting's batting, but his captaincy is crap! The results are (not) there for everyone to see. Losing to Bangladesh, Ashes loss, and now losing defending 430+.
    Losing to Somerset was almost as bad as losing to Bangladesh.
    Ponting will inevitably suffer in comparison to the brilliance of Border and Taylor and the untested nature of Stephen Waugh. I don't think he's an especially poor captain - not particularly good, no, but most captains have bad days aplenty. Not everyone is Border, Taylor, Fleming, Hussain or Cronje. In fact, most aren't.
    I'd regard Ponting's captaincy as pretty much level with the like of Smith, Atapattu, Inzy, Vaughan and Dravid. No-one can dispute he's better than Chanderpaul!

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