04-11-2005, 04:59 AM
|
#31 (permalink) |
|
Request Your Custom Title Now!
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Virat Kohli
Posts: 47,548
|
Warne has said himself he prefers to get bounce rather than excessive turn, I've read him say that a few times and it was mentioned today by one of the commentators. So like Jack said, the whole "Warne bowls better on Australian and non sub-continent wickets" doesn't fly at all.
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 05:52 AM
|
#32 (permalink) |
|
International Debutant
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: on my ass @ the PC
Posts: 2,775
|
My much debated analysis belongs in this thread.
Points in Favour of Murali 1) Warne has failed dismally against the best players of spin – India (43 wickets at 47.18). Murali has done far better against them (51 wickets at 32.94). 2) Murali has a better average, strike rate, economy rate, and takes more wickets per match than Warne; despite the fact that Warne has not had to play against the world's best team. 3) Murali has a better record against all countries, except South Africa and Pakistan. 4) Murali is far more consistent. Warne has been known to be hammered occasionally and although Murali has previously been nullified to a degree, he is very rarely hit around the park. Warne 45 7 150 1 3.33 3rd Test v Ind in Aus 1991/92 at Sydney 30 7 122 1 4.07 1st Test v Ind in Ind 1997/98 at Chennai 42 4 147 0 3.50 2nd Test v Ind in Ind 1997/98 at Kolkata 34 3 152 1 4.47 2nd Test v Ind in Ind 2000/01 at Kolkata 42 7 140 2 3.33 3rd Test v Ind in Ind 2000/01 at Chennai 30 6 108 2 3.60 3rd Test v SA in SA 2001/02 at Durban 38 7 129 3 3.39 2nd Test v SL in Aus 2004 at Cairns 32 4 115 2 3.59 1st Test v Ind in Ind 2004/2005 at Nagpur Murali 36 6 123 1 3.42 1 L 1st Test v Pak in SL 1994 at Colombo 54 3 224 2 4.15 2 L 1st Test v Aus in Aus 1995/96 at Perth 33 6 136 0 4.12 1 L 1st Test v NZ in NZ 1996/97 at Dunedin 5) Warne is part of a stronger bowling attack. If Warne was of equal ability to Murali he would take less wickets per match than Murali (because there are four good bowlers competing for wickets), but would have a lower average and strike rate (because greater pressure is put on the batsman by bowlers at the other end). For an example of this take two great fast bowlers, Marshall and Hadlee - Marshall having a better average because the high class West Indian bowlers put greater pressure on the batsmen, but Hadlee took more wickets per match because there was less competition for them. Same with Lindwall vs Bedser, Ambrose vs Akram, Laker vs Tayfield, and many, many others. Murali takes more wickets per match and has a lower average and strike rate. 6) A high proportion of Warne's test wickets are numbers 10 and 11 in the batting order; Murali does well against all batting positions. When they were both on 527 wickets, Warne had taken the wickets of batsmen 8-11 190 times, Murali had done it 162 times - a significant difference of 17%. And we all know it is far more valuable to be able to defeat players of high ability, because they can really make you suffer. Tailenders will usually get out sooner rather than later anyway, and very rarely turn a match on its head (with the bat anyway). What’s the point in Warne taking the wickets of Nehra or Walsh game after game, if he cannot trouble Tendulkar or Lara? 7) Although Warne has been less effective since his shoulder injury, even at his peak (1993-97) he was not as good as Murali has been this century. Mat O M R W Ave Best 5wi 10w SR Econ Murali 2000-2003 37 2347.3 684 4990 258 19.34 9-51 22 10 54.5 2.13 Warne 1993-97 57 2876.5 938 6457 277 23.31 8-71 11 3 62.3 2.24 8) Murali on top form is more devastating than Warne on top form. Best innings: 9/51 M Muralitharan v Zimbabwe at Kandy, 2nd Test, 2001/02 [1583] 9/65 M Muralitharan v England at The Oval, Only Test, 1998 [1423] 8/71 SK Warne v England at Brisbane, 1st Test, 1994/95 8/87 M Muralitharan v India at Colombo (SSC), 3rd Test, 2001 [1559] Best Series: Murali Sri Lanka in Pakistan, 1999/00 [Series] 3 213.1 516 26 6/71 19.84 2.42 49.1 1 1 South Africa in Sri Lanka, 2000 [Series] 3 227.4 480 26 7/84 18.46 2.10 52.5 3 1 Zimbabwe in Sri Lanka, 2001/02 [Series] 3 203.1 294 30 9/51 9.80 1.44 40.6 2 1 England in Sri Lanka, 2003/04 [Series] 3 231.4 320 26 7/46 12.30 1.38 53.4 1 1 Australia in Sri Lanka, 2003/04 [Series] 3 209.1 649 28 6/59 23.17 3.10 44.8 4 1 Warne The Ashes (Aus/Eng) in England, 1993 [Series] 6 439.5 877 34 5/82 25.79 1.99 77.6 1 0 The Ashes (Aus/Eng) in Australia, 1994/95 [Series] 5 256.1 549 27 8/71 20.33 2.14 56.9 2 1 The Ashes (Aus/Eng) in England, 2001 [Series] 5 195.2 580 31 7/165 18.70 2.96 37.8 3 1 Australia v Pakistan Test Series in Sri Lanka/U.A.E., 2002/03 [Series] 3 124 342 27 7/94 12.66 2.75 27.5 2 1 Australia in Sri Lanka, 2003/04 [Series] 3 168 521 26 5/43 20.03 3.10 38.7 4 2 The Ashes (Aus/Eng) in England, 2005 [Series] 5 252.5 797 40 6/46 12/246 19.92 3.15 37.9 3 2 9) You could take a look at their respective records in the English county championship (note Murali was by far the star bowler in every season he played, while several Hampshire bowlers took wickets more cheaply than Warne in all his seasons): Mat B M R W Ave Best 5wi 10w SR Econ Murali 25 7695 391 2735 185 14.78 7-39 21 6 41.5 2.13 Warne 36 8423 323 3858 162 23.81 6-34 9 0 51.9 2.74 10) One reason why Warne is rated so highly is Gatting’s reaction to the so called “ball of the century.” The shock that that ball sent through the cricketing world was immense because it was thought no one else could bowl that delivery. Actually, Warne was not the only one to bowl such a delivery in recent years, Abdul Qadir had bowled the same delivery a few years earlier, it just wasn’t highlighted at the time because it wasn't on such a big stage. Murali bowled similar balls which were every bit as good to both Sadgapan Ramesh and Mark Butcher a few years ago. Warne constantly gets so many accolades/awards that he doesn't deserve, purely through a God like reputation galvanised by ill educated media hype. In truth, his career has been highly inconsistent, he has constantly failed against the best, benefited from the opportunity to nail tails after McGrath and co have dismissed the better batsmen, and his overall career figures fall short of the truely great category. Points in Favour of Warne 1) Has much greater competition for wickets, and yet still has more victims than any other Test bowler in history. 2) Has not had the opportunity to destroy Zimbabwe and Bangladesh. Murali has taken over a fifth of his wickets against these teams while Warne has played a combined total of 2 matches against them. 3) Has a better average and strike rate outside Sri Lanka than Murali. 4) Recognised by the (biased) Anglo-Australian media as the best spinner of all times. 5) At his peak he had more variation than Murali. 6) He has a better record away from home than Murali. 7) Does not get the opportunity to play half his matches on dustbowls. Conclusion: Murali > Warne
__________________
THE ULTIMATE CRICKET WEB ARCADE EGGS CHAMPION RIP Fardin Qayyumi (AKA "cricket player"; "Bob"), 1990-2006 RIP Craig Walsh (AKA "Craig"), 1985-2012 |
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 06:37 AM
|
#33 (permalink) | |
|
Hall of Fame Member
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Columbus, IN
Posts: 15,215
|
Why don't we just sticky this for all time, so that everyone can see it and arguments about this issue from other threads can be redirected easily.
__________________
We miss you, Fardin. :(. RIP. Quote:
Member of CW Red and AAAS - Appreciating only the best. Check out this awesome e-fed: PWE Efed |
|
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 12:56 PM
|
#36 (permalink) | |
|
Hall of Fame Member
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Riding public transport back and forth
Posts: 16,914
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 01:07 PM
|
#37 (permalink) | |
|
Hall of Fame Member
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Derby, England
Posts: 17,631
|
Quote:
Who actually READ AMZ's little post? Seriously, it IS very good, and contains much food for thought.
__________________
Nigel Clough's Black and White Army, beating Forest away with 10 men |
|
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 03:59 PM
|
#39 (permalink) |
|
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kolkata, India
Posts: 20,794
|
Murali vs Warne comparisons with the help of stats guru:
Code:
6 ball overs) Mat O R W BBI BBM Ave Econ SR 5 10
Warne
Murali
overall 129 6023.3 15746 629 8/71 12/128 25.03 2.61 57.4 32 10
96 5370.1 12632 568 9/51 16/220 22.23 2.35 56.7 47 14
v Australia 0 - - - - - - - - - -
11 569.3 1728 55 6/59 11/212 31.41 3.03 62.1 5 1
v Bangladesh 0 - - - - - - - - - -
4 143.1 344 34 6/18 10/98 10.11 2.40 25.2 5 2
v England 31 1551.3 3837 172 8/71 12/246 22.30 2.47 54.1 10 4
10 768.3 1431 69 9/65 16/220 20.73 1.86 66.8 4 2
v ICC World XI 1 31 71 6 3/23 6/71 11.83 2.29 31.0 0 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
v India 14 654.1 2029 43 6/125 6/113 47.18 3.10 91.2 1 0
12 637 1680 51 8/87 11/196 32.94 2.63 74.9 3 1
v New Zealand 20 961.4 2511 103 6/31 9/67 24.37 2.61 56.0 3 0
10 536 1232 52 5/30 9/227 23.69 2.29 61.8 4 0
v Pakistan 15 675.1 1816 90 7/23 11/77 20.17 2.68 45.0 6 2
12 623.5 1622 68 6/71 10/148 23.85 2.60 55.0 4 1
v South Africa 18 1021.4 2257 101 7/56 12/128 22.34 2.20 60.6 6 2
13 821.4 1914 82 7/84 13/171 23.34 2.32 60.1 8 2
v Sri Lanka 13 527.5 1507 59 5/43 10/155 25.54 2.85 53.6 5 2
0 - - - - - - - - - -
v West Indies 16 547.2 1581 49 7/52 8/117 32.26 2.88 67.0 1 0
10 483.4 1214 70 8/46 11/170 17.34 2.50 41.4 8 3
v Zimbabwe 1 53.1 137 6 3/68 6/137 22.83 2.57 53.1 0 0
14 786.5 1467 87 9/51 13/115 16.86 1.86 54.2 6 2
in Australia 58 2690.3 6894 266 8/71 12/128 25.91 2.56 60.6 12 4
3 146 505 8 3/55 5/157 63.12 3.45 109.5 0 0
in England 22 1125.1 2831 129 7/165 12/246 21.94 2.51 52.3 8 3
3 239.5 517 24 9/65 16/220 21.54 2.15 59.9 3 1
in India 9 459.1 1466 34 6/125 6/125 43.11 3.19 81.0 1 0
5 264.2 731 15 5/162 5/162 48.73 2.76 105.7 1 0
in New Zealand 9 419.5 1044 49 5/39 7/86 21.30 2.48 51.4 1 0
4 167 382 13 5/64 6/105 29.38 2.28 77.0 1 0
in Pakistan 3 181.4 504 18 6/136 9/240 28.00 2.77 60.5 2 0
7 409.5 1053 49 6/71 10/148 21.48 2.56 50.1 2 1
in South Africa 9 485.5 1060 46 6/161 8/231 23.04 2.18 63.3 1 0
6 353.1 911 35 6/39 11/161 26.02 2.57 60.5 3 1
in Sri Lanka 9 317.2 982 48 7/94 11/188 20.45 3.09 39.6 6 3
57 3278.5 7361 373 9/51 13/115 19.73 2.24 52.7 33 11
in U.A.E. 2 69 154 16 5/74 8/24 9.62 2.23 25.8 1 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
in West Indies 7 221.5 674 17 4/70 6/142 39.64 3.03 78.2 0 0
4 174.4 456 25 5/34 8/106 18.24 2.61 41.9 3 0
in Zimbabwe 1 53.1 137 6 3/68 6/137 22.83 2.57 53.1 0 0
7 336.3 716 26 6/45 8/82 27.53 2.12 77.6 1 0
in Africa 10 539 1197 52 6/161 8/231 23.01 2.22 62.1 1 0
13 689.4 1627 61 6/39 11/161 26.67 2.35 67.8 4 1
in Americas 7 221.5 674 17 4/70 6/142 39.64 3.03 78.2 0 0
4 174.4 456 25 5/34 8/106 18.24 2.61 41.9 3 0
in Asia 23 1027.1 3106 116 7/94 11/188 26.77 3.02 53.1 10 3
69 3953 9145 437 9/51 13/115 20.92 2.31 54.2 36 12
in Europe 22 1125.1 2831 129 7/165 12/246 21.94 2.51 52.3 8 3
3 239.5 517 24 9/65 16/220 21.54 2.15 59.9 3 1
in Oceania 67 3110.2 7938 315 8/71 12/128 25.20 2.55 59.2 13 4
7 313 887 21 5/64 6/105 42.23 2.83 89.4 1 0
home 58 2690.3 6894 266 8/71 12/128 25.91 2.56 60.6 12 4
57 3278.5 7361 373 9/51 13/115 19.73 2.24 52.7 33 11
away 68 3209 8510 336 7/165 12/246 25.32 2.65 57.3 18 5
39 2091.2 5271 195 9/65 16/220 27.03 2.52 64.3 14 3
neutral 3 124 342 27 7/94 11/188 12.66 2.75 27.5 2 1
0 - - - - - - - - - -
1992 5 153.3 503 12 7/52 8/117 41.91 3.27 76.7 1 0
3 125.2 381 11 4/134 7/156 34.63 3.03 68.3 0 0
1993 16 842.2 1697 72 6/31 9/67 23.56 2.01 70.1 2 0
7 298.1 712 29 5/101 6/152 24.55 2.38 61.6 2 0
1994 10 629 1274 70 8/71 12/128 18.20 2.02 53.9 6 2
6 277.2 753 16 5/162 5/162 47.06 2.71 104.0 1 0
1995 12 508.3 1254 52 7/23 11/77 24.11 2.46 58.6 1 1
7 315.4 899 25 5/64 7/151 35.96 2.84 75.7 2 0
1996 4 215.1 571 15 4/95 7/160 38.06 2.65 86.0 0 0
2 105.3 195 14 5/33 7/61 13.92 1.84 45.2 1 0
1997 15 681.5 1661 68 6/48 9/111 24.42 2.43 60.1 2 0
9 501 1266 40 6/98 8/106 31.65 2.52 75.1 3 0
1998 5 268.1 796 24 6/34 11/109 33.16 2.96 67.0 2 1
8 550.2 1256 68 9/65 16/220 18.47 2.28 48.5 7 2
1999 13 464.1 1253 38 5/52 8/155 32.97 2.69 73.2 2 0
6 307 678 24 5/71 7/128 28.25 2.20 76.7 1 0
2000 4 154.2 496 15 4/68 7/160 33.06 3.21 61.7 0 0
10 623.2 1463 75 7/84 13/171 19.50 2.34 49.8 7 3
2001 13 583.3 1809 58 7/165 11/229 31.18 3.10 60.3 4 1
12 781.2 1699 80 8/87 11/170 21.23 2.17 58.6 7 4
2002 10 479 1310 67 7/94 11/188 19.55 2.73 42.8 3 1
8 472.4 979 55 9/51 13/115 17.80 2.07 51.5 5 2
2004 12 578.4 1685 70 6/125 10/155 24.07 2.91 49.6 5 2
6 359.3 1035 47 6/45 11/212 22.02 2.87 45.8 5 1
2005 10 465.2 1437 68 6/46 12/246 21.13 3.08 41.0 4 2
5 182.5 467 36 8/46 10/83 12.97 2.55 30.4 3 1
2003 0 - - - - - - - - - -
7 470.1 849 48 7/46 11/93 17.68 1.80 58.7 3 1
season 1991/92 2 68 228 1 1/150 1/150 228.00 3.35 408.0 0 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
season 1992 2 38.1 158 3 3/11 3/118 52.66 4.13 76.3 0 0
2 73.1 225 4 2/109 3/141 56.25 3.07 109.7 0 0
season 1992/93 7 267.2 569 27 7/52 8/117 21.07 2.12 59.4 1 0
2 113.1 329 12 4/118 7/156 27.41 2.90 56.5 0 0
season 1993 6 439.5 877 34 5/82 8/137 25.79 1.99 77.6 1 0
5 221.2 492 20 5/101 6/152 24.60 2.22 66.4 2 0
season 1993/94 9 517.3 948 51 7/56 12/128 18.58 1.83 60.8 3 1
4 159.1 467 16 5/162 5/162 29.18 2.93 59.6 1 0
season 1994 0 - - - - - - - - - -
1 47 165 1 1/123 1/165 165.00 3.51 282.0 0 0
season 1994/95 12 575.5 1459 60 8/71 11/110 24.31 2.53 57.5 4 1
4 173 309 10 5/64 5/64 30.90 1.78 103.8 1 0
season 1995/96 6 279.4 631 31 7/23 11/77 20.35 2.25 54.1 1 1
5 229.4 758 18 5/68 7/151 42.11 3.30 76.5 1 0
season 1996 0 - - - - - - - - - -
2 105.3 195 14 5/33 7/61 13.92 1.84 45.2 1 0
season 1996/97 8 350.1 876 33 4/43 7/160 26.54 2.50 63.6 0 0
3 134 339 12 6/98 6/98 28.25 2.52 67.0 1 0
season 1997 6 237.1 577 24 6/48 9/111 24.04 2.43 59.2 1 0
4 246 616 25 5/34 8/106 24.64 2.50 59.0 2 0
season 1997/98 9 524.5 1433 49 6/34 11/109 29.24 2.73 64.2 3 1
6 402.3 973 36 7/94 12/117 27.02 2.41 67.0 3 1
season 1998 0 - - - - - - - - - -
4 268.5 594 35 9/65 16/220 16.97 2.20 46.0 4 1
season 1998/99 4 122.5 378 4 1/43 2/110 94.50 3.07 184.2 0 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
season 1999 3 56.1 115 8 5/52 5/70 14.37 2.04 42.1 1 0
3 141.1 349 15 5/71 7/128 23.26 2.47 56.4 1 0
season 1999/00 10 439.3 1256 41 5/110 8/155 30.63 2.85 64.3 1 0
6 379 845 35 6/71 10/148 24.14 2.22 64.9 1 1
season 2000 0 - - - - - - - - - -
6 341.4 786 38 7/84 13/171 20.68 2.30 53.9 4 1
season 2000/01 3 152.1 505 10 4/47 5/107 50.50 3.31 91.3 0 0
5 347.3 681 26 6/39 11/161 26.19 1.95 80.1 2 1
season 2001 5 195.2 580 31 7/165 11/229 18.70 2.96 37.8 3 1
3 177.3 444 23 8/87 11/196 19.30 2.50 46.3 2 1
season 2001/02 9 459.5 1345 43 6/161 8/170 31.27 2.92 64.1 2 0
8 525 1068 72 9/51 13/115 14.83 2.03 43.7 7 4
season 2002 0 - - - - - - - - - -
3 170.4 395 18 5/39 10/98 21.94 2.31 56.8 3 1
season 2002/03 6 255.1 689 41 7/94 11/188 16.80 2.70 37.3 2 1
2 101.5 251 7 3/83 4/168 35.85 2.46 87.2 0 0
season 2003 0 - - - - - - - - - -
4 238.3 529 22 5/49 8/139 24.04 2.21 65.0 2 0
season 2003/04 3 168 521 26 5/43 10/155 20.03 3.10 38.7 4 2
6 440.5 969 54 7/46 11/93 17.94 2.19 48.9 5 2
season 2004 2 100.5 280 10 4/70 7/199 28.00 2.77 60.5 0 0
3 150.2 386 19 6/45 8/82 20.31 2.56 47.4 1 0
season 2004/05 11 491.2 1453 56 6/125 8/112 25.94 2.95 52.6 2 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
season 2005 5 252.5 797 40 6/46 12/246 19.92 3.15 37.9 3 2
2 75.3 175 17 8/46 10/83 10.29 2.31 26.6 2 1
season 2005/06 1 31 71 6 3/23 6/71 11.83 2.29 31.0 0 0
3 107.2 292 19 6/18 9/60 15.36 2.72 33.8 1 0
toss won 64 2850 7467 306 8/71 11/77 24.40 2.62 55.8 21 7
50 2714.5 6050 303 9/65 16/220 19.96 2.22 53.7 27 7
toss lost 65 3173.3 8279 323 7/56 12/128 25.63 2.60 58.9 11 3
46 2655.2 6582 265 9/51 13/115 24.83 2.47 60.1 20 7
toss won & batted 51 2286.3 6034 244 8/71 11/77 24.72 2.63 56.2 17 6
31 1653 3577 178 7/46 13/171 20.09 2.16 55.7 16 4
toss won & fielded 13 563.3 1433 62 6/46 10/162 23.11 2.54 54.5 4 1
19 1061.5 2473 125 9/65 16/220 19.78 2.32 50.9 11 3
toss lost & sent in 24 1029.2 2678 86 6/64 9/80 31.13 2.60 71.8 1 0
14 692.3 1626 77 8/46 10/83 21.11 2.34 53.9 6 2
toss lost & fielded 41 2144.1 5601 237 7/56 12/128 23.63 2.61 54.2 10 3
32 1962.5 4956 188 9/51 13/115 26.36 2.52 62.6 14 5
matches batting 1st 75 3315.5 8712 330 8/71 11/77 26.40 2.62 60.2 18 6
45 2345.3 5203 255 8/46 13/171 20.40 2.21 55.1 22 6
matches fielding 1st 54 2707.4 7034 299 7/56 12/128 23.52 2.59 54.3 14 4
51 3024.4 7429 313 9/51 16/220 23.73 2.45 57.9 25 8
1st team innings 129 3230.2 8686 322 7/23 12/128 26.97 2.68 60.1 16 10
96 3353.1 7913 323 9/51 16/220 24.49 2.35 62.2 26 14
2nd team innings 120 2793.1 7060 307 8/71 12/128 22.99 2.52 54.5 16 10
72 2017 4719 245 9/65 16/220 19.26 2.33 49.3 21 14
1st match innings 54 1298.2 3556 142 7/56 12/128 25.04 2.73 54.8 5 4
51 1755.4 4402 166 9/51 16/220 26.51 2.50 63.4 12 8
2nd match innings 75 1932 5130 180 7/23 11/77 28.50 2.65 64.4 11 6
43 1597.3 3511 157 7/46 13/171 22.36 2.19 61.0 14 6
3rd match innings 66 1761.1 4349 190 6/31 12/128 22.88 2.46 55.6 10 6
48 1497.5 3484 180 9/65 16/220 19.35 2.32 49.9 16 10
4th match innings 54 1032 2711 117 8/71 11/110 23.17 2.62 52.9 6 4
24 519.1 1235 65 8/46 11/93 19.00 2.37 47.9 5 4
no follow-on 115 5310.1 13976 542 8/71 12/128 25.78 2.63 58.7 28 8
82 4593.1 10822 491 9/51 16/220 22.04 2.35 56.1 41 12
enforcing a follow-on 13 670.2 1637 79 7/23 11/77 20.72 2.44 50.9 4 2
7 432.1 813 59 7/84 13/171 13.77 1.88 43.9 5 2
in team following on 1 43 133 8 4/31 8/133 16.62 3.09 32.2 0 0
7 344.5 997 18 5/162 5/162 55.38 2.89 114.9 1 0
matches won 77 3670.5 9387 437 8/71 11/77 21.48 2.55 50.4 22 7
36 2098.1 4456 288 9/51 16/220 15.47 2.12 43.7 26 11
matches drawn 26 1248.4 3289 90 6/122 12/246 36.54 2.63 83.2 5 1
29 1547.5 3403 127 7/46 11/93 26.79 2.19 73.1 10 2
matches lost 26 1104 3070 102 7/56 12/128 30.09 2.78 64.9 5 2
31 1724.1 4773 153 6/59 11/212 31.19 2.76 67.6 11 1
won by an innings 23 1026.2 2505 146 7/23 11/77 17.15 2.44 42.1 7 3
14 760 1499 117 9/51 13/115 12.81 1.97 38.9 11 5
won defending target 33 1531.5 3961 174 8/71 11/110 22.76 2.58 52.8 10 4
8 391 887 62 8/46 10/83 14.30 2.26 37.8 7 3
won chasing target 21 1112.4 2921 117 6/33 8/70 24.96 2.62 57.0 5 0
14 947.1 2070 109 9/65 16/220 18.99 2.18 52.1 8 3
lost by an innings 2 54 198 0 - - - 3.66 - 0 0
11 522.4 1478 36 5/101 5/101 41.05 2.82 87.1 3 0
lost defending targ. 10 539.2 1383 57 7/56 12/128 24.26 2.56 56.7 3 2
10 657.2 1913 70 6/59 11/212 27.32 2.91 56.3 5 1
lost chasing target 14 510.4 1489 45 5/52 8/133 33.08 2.91 68.0 2 0
10 544.1 1382 47 5/34 8/106 29.40 2.53 69.4 3 0
5 day matches 128 5992.3 15675 623 8/71 12/128 25.16 2.61 57.7 32 10
95 5316.1 12475 563 9/51 16/220 22.15 2.34 56.6 47 14
6 day matches 1 31 71 6 3/23 6/71 11.83 2.29 31.0 0 0
1 54 157 5 3/55 5/157 31.40 2.90 64.8 0 0
1st/Only Tests 38 1797.2 4675 212 8/71 11/77 22.05 2.60 50.8 10 4
41 2323.1 5504 267 9/65 16/220 20.61 2.36 52.2 28 8
2nd Tests 36 1712.1 4300 195 7/52 12/128 22.05 2.51 52.6 13 4
35 1960.3 4596 195 9/51 13/115 23.56 2.34 60.3 12 4
3rd Tests 36 1704.5 4586 143 6/33 9/111 32.06 2.69 71.5 5 0
18 982.2 2294 88 8/87 11/196 26.06 2.33 66.9 5 1
4th Tests 9 339.5 914 28 4/31 8/133 32.64 2.68 72.8 0 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
5th Tests 8 366.2 1034 42 7/165 12/246 24.61 2.82 52.3 4 2
0 - - - - - - - - - -
6th Tests 2 103 237 9 3/78 5/148 26.33 2.30 68.6 0 0
0 - - - - - - - - - -
in series lost 21 918.1 2774 96 7/52 12/246 28.89 3.02 57.3 7 2
37 1924.5 5088 173 6/39 11/161 29.41 2.64 66.7 15 2
in series drawn 15 733.1 1597 58 7/56 12/128 27.53 2.17 75.8 2 1
13 814.2 1793 64 7/84 13/171 28.01 2.20 76.3 5 1
in series won 93 4372.1 11375 475 8/71 11/77 23.94 2.60 55.2 23 7
46 2631 5751 331 9/51 16/220 17.37 2.18 47.6 27 11
Last edited by Pratters; 04-11-2005 at 04:02 PM. |
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 04:00 PM
|
#40 (permalink) |
|
Banned
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Kolkata, India
Posts: 20,794
|
Some initial observations:
Both are crap in India  Murali is devastating in tests Sri Lanka win with an average of 17. Countries versus whom both bowlers have a better average than their career average: Zimbabwe and England Last edited by Pratters; 04-11-2005 at 04:04 PM. |
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 06:48 PM
|
#42 (permalink) |
|
U19 Cricketer
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: SYDNEY
Posts: 478
|
I don't think Warne can fairly described as crap against India. The super test showed that their batsman are no less fallible against him than the rest. He dismissed Dravid with a beaut classic leg break and felled Sehway to.
His lack of success on tours to India have IMO been in no small part explained by his shoulder and finger injuries. On the last tour (yer the excuses are comin thick and fast but are IMO valid) by poor form. In regards to the latter, he suffered from a technical fault ie. bowling around himself that caused him to lose drift and loop that has made him so effective in the past. The relative lack of success at home v NZ and then Pakistan, where he was outbowled by Danish Kaneria confirmed for me it was a technical thing. His then subsequent return to form in Eng followed a crucial coaching session with Troy Cooley on the eve of the first test when Cooley helped him overcome the problem. As we know, he hasn't hasn't looked back since. As i type this he bowls Edwards with a beaut WRONGIN. Great to see him back to his best here.. Correction: It was Terry Jenner he consulted in England. As i was saying I don't doubt Warnes ability to have success in India, if he's free of injuries and in good form. Last edited by parttimer; 04-11-2005 at 07:01 PM. |
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 07:52 PM
|
#43 (permalink) |
|
Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 21,197
|
At present, Warne. Both at their peak, injury-free, etc., far too close to call. Too different to compare in my eyes.
One thing I agree with Jack is that Murali has been a lesser bowler since he started making the doosra almost his stock ball. Conversely, Warne has been a far better/smarter bowler since he has been less able to land the flipper. Because of that, he's had to bowl with more subtle variation, etc. because if there was one area Warne was lacking early in his career, it was variation. He basically had the leggie, flipper and toppie and concentrated in bowling them very, very well. Now he has several variations on the ball which does absolutely nothing.  And it gets him wickets! ********* Yes I KNOW they don't do absolutely nothing but vary in flight/drift, etc. If you thought I didn't based on what I posted, get to a docter and get a facetiousness chip installed.
__________________
Check out my bands! The Colourphonics http://www.youtube.com/user/TheColourphonics http://twitter.com/colourphonics Candice and The Arcade Villains http://triplejunearthed.com.au/Candi...ArcadeVillains |
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 08:42 PM
|
#44 (permalink) | |
|
Hall of Fame Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: USA
Posts: 16,228
|
Quote:
Is it possible that Warne hits the poor form when he plays against India and not other way round. After all it cant be just a co-incidence that Warne has played India a quite a few times and every time he was either injured or out-of-form.  Anyways, I am in no way suggesting that Warnie is any less of a great bowler because of his poor performance against India, the fact is that he has done pretty well against Dravid the best Indian batsmen in last 5 years and has had his moments against Sachin. |
|
|
|
|
|
04-11-2005, 08:51 PM
|
#45 (permalink) | |
|
U19 Cricketer
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: SYDNEY
Posts: 478
|
Quote:
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests) | |
| Thread Tools | |
| Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads
|
||||
| Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
| Sim a match | Pratters | Cricket Chat | 342 | 31-12-2006 03:03 PM |
| WI of the 80's or Australia Current? | age_master | Cricket Chat | 220 | 09-05-2005 06:02 PM |
| Genuine legends who still play... | Hit4Six | Cricket Chat | 92 | 19-09-2004 06:04 PM |
| Murali not the first to decline invitation | kasra | Cricket Chat | 131 | 24-06-2004 04:40 AM |
| 16 Reasons Why Murali Is Better Than Warne | a massive zebra | Cricket Chat | 67 | 27-02-2004 06:17 AM |
Linear Mode
