Indian ODI team discussion thread

[viktor]

Sachin
Sehwag
Ganguly
Dravid
Yuvraj
Sriram/Badani/Venugopala Rao/Vidyut
JP Yadav
Dinesh Kaarthick
Pathan
R P Singh
Harbajan Singh

Comments please!!!!

too top heavy in the batting ....pretty weak in the bowling

 

[Legglancer]

Ganguly is the best among the current lot of captains

Arjuna Ranatunga

August 11, 2005


Somehow I also feel drawn into the captaincy debate currently on in India. Should it be Sourav Ganguly or Rahul Dravid? One is proven, the other has promise. One is charismatic, the other low-profile, but all substance. Who is the one we are looking towards to lead India into the next World Cup?

We in Sri Lanka too are handling the captaincy issue in our own way. I, as head of the cricket committee, strongly feel we should make up our mind and appoint a captain for the next two years. A captain needs to be in control of things to manage men and matters and put strategies and methods in place. India should also look to have a leader for a longer period. Half measures will not work.

I start with my impressions about Ganguly. I have known him for long and feel he is the best of the current lot in world cricket. He is imaginative and backs talented youngsters. I used to do the same when I was at the helm: I remember Chaminda Vaas needed a dose of confidence every now and then when he started.

I am also not convinced about the two theories doing the rounds in India: that a captain's life on the shelf is only for four or five years and that Ganguly is not good enough to hold his position in the team as a batsman. Again, I will go to my example to stress the point. I captained Sri Lanka for nearly 10 years and am absolutely convinced my best came in the final five or six years. The first 3-4 years were spent in learning and were possibly defensive. So Ganguly's longevity should not be held against him. It is not his fault if he has been successful. You don't shoot a horse in the leg when he is still serviceable.

Another issue is about his batting. I don't think Ganguly is finished as a batsman. He might not be as high-scoring as he was a few years ago but only the other day he completed his 10,000 runs in one-day cricket and is the youngest of the four others to do so. He can hold his position in the team and he still has a healthy average.

Let us now look at the issue from Rahul Dravid's perspective. He has lately emerged as India's best batsman in both forms of cricket: I don't think there is any room for argument on this score. His dedication and commitment to his team is exemplary. He is rock-solid and can inspire the men around him.

Dravid is also pretty selfless. He was the strongest pillar on whom Ganguly rose to great heights as captain. We in Sri Lanka do it all the time. Even as Marvan Atapattu is emerging as a capable leader, you would see a Sanath Jayasuriya helping him with field settings in the first 15 overs. A Muralitharan is always talking to the bowlers and giving them ideas. Sharing the burden is a sign of a happy, trusting team.

Dravid has not done badly as captain in the tournament. He reacted to situations quickly and offers promise. His supporters of course would like him to be at the helm as he is 33 and it is now-or-never for him. In two years' time, it might be too late for him. I have not seen enough of him as captain to pass a judgment. But it is difficult not to like him. He needs time to adjust.

If I could offer advice, I would ask Indian media and a few motivated officials to stop fishing in troubled waters. Your agendas can wait in matters of national importance. Cricket brings happiness to multitudes: our masses identify strongly with cricket heroes and their performance. Let the best men and leaders be there on the field. Your personal choices should have no role. I know how Indian media could fall into that north-west or east-south [zonal bias] trap.

Selectors too should be men of integrity and be able to look themselves in the mirror in the morning. I have always been against this zonal representation among selectors. Let the best four selectors, even if they are from one state, choose the team of India. In Sri Lanka, the government has interfered in matters of cricket. With the new cricket hierarchy, you would see better results. It is good to get rid of the baggage of a previous cricket officialdom.

Those who matter in Indian cricket must decide whether they want a short- or long-term plan. If it is long-term investment, they need to look at things dispassionately. They need not gloss over the tardy fielding or the place of a few seniors in the one-day context. If India is looking for a place in at least the semi-finals of the next World Cup, they need to bring out the surgeon's scalpel now.

 

[Sanz]

It's time to move on. Ganguly doesn't deserve his spot as a player( for a while now) and he is no Mike Brearly, so no place for him in the team. I think it is time the selectors continues their faith in Dravid.

 

[Arjun]

I have got 6 specialist batsmen, and an allrounder at no. 7, more than a decent wicketkeeper batsman at no. 8 and 3 bowlers.
JP Yadav is my fourth bowler, as i go by the domestic statistics. He definitely is a decent bat.
The other 10 overs would be shared by Sehwag,Sachin and Sriram/Badani/Venugopala Rao/Vidyut and of course Vidyut is the best bowling option of the 4.

The best thing i have done is i have not included Kaif, who for me , is someone who has no credentials to be part of this Indian batting line up.

1. Ganguly is a ODI misfit, and so is Badani.
2. Sriram may not get a match.
3. Vidyut is the obvious choice.
4. Enough of Irfan- let some other newcomer get a chance or get back Nehra.

Otherwise, not too bad.

 

[Arjun]

Dhoni is no good as a batsman in ODIs. Forget his bad keeping, he cannot even merit any arguments for his batting. He cannot play quickish spin and doesn't have shots around the ground. He scores in the V and that is not good enough in any form of the game these days. He struggles when he has a few overs to go and is asked to play himself in.

Does it take just one bad series to lose faith in genuine talent?

Who cares if Dhoni plays within the V, doesn't bat straight or just plain slogs? He's an attacking batsman and that's his main strength. And one the Indian team needs badly. With far too many Tendulkar wannabes, they don't have any strike power- which makes it eay for other bowling sides to get on top of the Indians. Look at successful batting sides in ODI's- all have far more strike power than the Indians. With the likes of Dhoni in the side, they're coming closer. He's got a second skill, so he can afford to take so many risks. That's the advantage with a wicketkeeper-batsman, but none of the other contenders have it.

 

[GladiatrsInBlue]

My team,

Sehwag,
Sachin
Dhoni
Dravid
Ganguly
Laxman
Yadav
Pathan
Harb
Nehra
Khan

 

[Sanz]

Does it take just one bad series to lose faith in genuine talent?

Who cares if Dhoni plays within the V, doesn't bat straight or just plain slogs? He's an attacking batsman and that's his main strength. And one the Indian team needs badly. With far too many Tendulkar wannabes, they don't have any strike power- which makes it eay for other bowling sides to get on top of the Indians. Look at successful batting sides in ODI's- all have far more strike power than the Indians. With the likes of Dhoni in the side, they're coming closer. He's got a second skill, so he can afford to take so many risks. That's the advantage with a wicketkeeper-batsman, but none of the other contenders have it.

Can Dhoni Keep ?? I hear his catch dropping skills are real asset to this Indian team and he is considered the best in the world.

 

[arjwiz]

Here's my team

Sachin
Sehwag
Saurav
Dravid *
Yuvraj
Kaif
D. Kaarthick +
Pathan
Harbhajan
Zaheer/Balaji
Nehra

I think the combination is perfect. Sachin, Sehwag, Saurav and Yuvraj can easily bowl ten decent overs amongst themselves. Yuvraj, Sachin and Sehwag have often bowled out their spell! Kaarthick or Dhoni..it's a tough choice, but I'd rather have the test keeper in the OD squad as well.

The batting is pretty competent, no place for Mongia or Laxman.

 

[ramkumar_gr]

Does it take just one bad series to lose faith in genuine talent?

Who cares if Dhoni plays within the V, doesn't bat straight or just plain slogs? He's an attacking batsman and that's his main strength. And one the Indian team needs badly. With far too many Tendulkar wannabes, they don't have any strike power- which makes it eay for other bowling sides to get on top of the Indians. Look at successful batting sides in ODI's- all have far more strike power than the Indians. With the likes of Dhoni in the side, they're coming closer. He's got a second skill, so he can afford to take so many risks. That's the advantage with a wicketkeeper-batsman, but none of the other contenders have it.

I believe if you had watched Dhoni play ball by ball, you would not be saying this.
It will be very tough for him to survive against decent bowling. He simply is a one-match wonder. Very much a hit or miss player, and cannot be considered as an all-rounder.

It will be good for Dhoni's fans if we dont discuss his keeping skills. he definitely is not a natural keeper, i would say even worse than Dravid.

It is time we bring in Dinesh Kaarthick/Pankaj Dharmani/NV Ohja into the fray.
Dinesh is the biggest hitter of the 3.

 

[ramkumar_gr]

Here's my team

Sachin
Sehwag
Saurav
Dravid *
Yuvraj
Kaif
D. Kaarthick +
Pathan
Harbhajan
Zaheer/Balaji
Nehra

I think the combination is perfect. Sachin, Sehwag, Saurav and Yuvraj can easily bowl ten decent overs amongst themselves. Yuvraj, Sachin and Sehwag have often bowled out their spell! Kaarthick or Dhoni..it's a tough choice, but I'd rather have the test keeper in the OD squad as well.

The batting is pretty competent, no place for Mongia or Laxman.

I dont really understand why you should select Kaif over Laxman or Venugopala for that matter.

Even India lose matches, why Indian batting is acclaimed all over the world is because of their style, class, etc.etc. Kaif is someone who does not possess technique. Can you tell me what is his favourite shot. He may be a good fielder, but the greatest single dimensional ODI player in the world. Because he only fields. He does not know how to bat or bowl. I see no other player of Kaif mould in any of the teams in the world, but the likes of Dion Ebrahim of Zimbabwe may challenge this argument.

 

[ramkumar_gr]

1. Ganguly is a ODI misfit, and so is Badani.
2. Sriram may not get a match.
3. Vidyut is the obvious choice.
4. Enough of Irfan- let some other newcomer get a chance or get back Nehra.

Otherwise, not too bad.

Pathan scored extra points because of his batting skills.

I definitely believe Badani, if given a longer run, will come good.

 

[Arjun]

Pathan scored extra points because of his batting skills.

I definitely believe Badani, if given a longer run, will come good.

If you're picking Pathan because of his batting skills, then play him at seven, as a regular six-hitter. No point playing him as a tailender to play out more overs- just send him out to hit sixes. As for Badani, with an average of 31 and a strike rate of 70 and just 4 scores over 50, he's not a good fit in the ODI side.

 

[honestbharani]

If you're picking Pathan because of his batting skills, then play him at seven, as a regular six-hitter. No point playing him as a tailender to play out more overs- just send him out to hit sixes. As for Badani, with an average of 31 and a strike rate of 70 and just 4 scores over 50, he's not a good fit in the ODI side.

Kaif has got the same stats.... How is he better than Badani?

 

[Arjun]

I believe if you had watched Dhoni play ball by ball, you would not be saying this.
It will be very tough for him to survive against decent bowling. He simply is a one-match wonder. Very much a hit or miss player, and cannot be considered as an all-rounder.

It will be good for Dhoni's fans if we dont discuss his keeping skills. he definitely is not a natural keeper, i would say even worse than Dravid.

It is time we bring in Dinesh Kaarthick/Pankaj Dharmani/NV Ohja into the fray.
Dinesh is the biggest hitter of the 3.

I have seen him for the whole series against Pakistan adn as a keeper, he was not spectacular, but did the basic things right. He just had one bad match in this series, but if you look at eleven matches he's played in a row, he's done decently as a wicketkeeping all-rounder and strike batsman.

All along fans, experts and selectors have been begging and pleading for a genuine wicketkeeper-batsman. You now have Dhoni, who plays the way a genuine wicketkeeping all-rounder should. If you have been following his performance for India-A, he has been averaging over 40 with a few centuries, at nearly a run-a-ball. Who cares if he's a hit-or-miss batsman? He serves the role of striker very well, and the Indian team needs some strikers in the batting if they have to come anywhere close to number one in ODI's. Give the man more time! He's worth it!

 

[Arjun]

Kaif has got the same stats.... How is he better than Badani?

Kaif has been batting at the wrong position for far too long, and that may have warped his batting. He's played a few match-winning innings which mattered- such as those in the Natwest final of 2002, then the fourth Samsung cup ODI in Lahore, then recently this match against WI in Colombo. He's got everything you need in an ODI batsman and his fielding/running skills are top notch, but he lacks power.

 

[honestbharani]

A hit or miss should not be a batsman... Symonds and the others do well because they hit more than they miss and this guy has missed almost everytime other than the one time he did hit. Plus, his wicketkeeping has been bad throughout the series, not just one match. I have been remarking about his keeping not being upto mark right from the first match.

 

[honestbharani]

Kaif has been batting at the wrong position for far too long, and that may have warped his batting. He's played a few match-winning innings which mattered- such as those in the Natwest final of 2002, then the fourth Samsung cup ODI in Lahore, then recently this match against WI in Colombo. He's got everything you need in an ODI batsman and his fielding/running skills are top notch, but he lacks power.

Couldn't the same argument be made out for Badani, who was forced to bat even lower than the inexperienced Rohan Gavaskar during the Aussie tri series?

 

[Arjun]

One major problem in the Indian batting lineup, depsite the presence of Sachin, Sourav (for the 10000+ runs scored), Dravid and Sehwag, is the obvious lack of power. Except Sehwag, none of the batsmen can strike hard enoyugh to launch an assault on the bowling side in the middle/late overs. Little wonder then that they falter to chase reasonable totals on flat pitches despite having seven batsmen in the team. Reason? All of them are trying to occupy the crease too much, but when the need for quick runs arises, they're either confused or their lack of power is found out. They're neither scoring big (which is why they're here) nor blasting quick runs (which the team needs sometimes), so quantity doesn't help here.

It's better to have just four good partnership-building batsmen in the side, in combination with four power players (Sehwag and three non-batsmen), to complement each other. While the strikers can score rapidly and look for as many fours, sixes ans scoring shots, the builders can take their time, get an eye in and easily play for big scores. Which makes the selection of one bowler with good batting basics and extra hitting power most appropriate. Maybe two, given the options at hand. It may look weak on batting, but that will only stretch the likes of Dravid, Yuvraj and Kaif to last longer, and also stretch the specially picked strikers to do their job.

 

[honestbharani]

Power is of no use if the guy who possesses it cannot use it well enough. Give me a cheeky Jonty type Dinesh Kaarthick (who is the better keeper) over a Dhoni any day of the week... You can bring up the Read/Jones thing of England but Dhoni (on the evidence so far) is not even as good as Jones...

 

[Arjun]

Power is of no use if the guy who possesses it cannot use it well enough. Give me a cheeky Jonty type Dinesh Kaarthick (who is the better keeper) over a Dhoni any day of the week... You can bring up the Read/Jones thing of England but Dhoni (on the evidence so far) is not even as good as Jones...

First let there be some power for the man to use well enough! That cheeky 'Jonty-like' Kaarthick isn't any different from Yuvraj, Kaif or Badani, except that he's never looked comfortable in the Tests he has played (and is nowhere close to Nayan Mongia with the gloves). Dhoni is a breath of fresh air in this stale batting lineup and fantastic raw material, and you have to make the best use of what you've got.