***Official*** New Zealand in Zimbabwe & Zimbabwe/New Zealand/India ODI Tri-Series - Page 101

Zinzan · 05-09-2005, 03:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Natman20

Well said. Exactly as it is. It was just a sort of practise match for New Zealand because they had already made it to the final. Scott Styris form is pretty good though. Daniel Vettori should be put up the order in around cairnsys place.

Agreed it was a bit of a practice, but you still want to win! I just found Fleming decision to bat at the toss (admittedly on a good track) even more bizaare given the weak and inexperienced bowling attack. In other words....bowling was definately going to be our weakness without both Bond and Vettori (and a rusty Oram and Cairns), so why not bowl first and back the batsmen to chase. With a full strength bowling attack it was probably the right decision to bad.

What annoyed me is that had we won that game we would have sneaked ahead of India in our head to head results against them in ODI's....but instead they move ahead

Zinzan · 05-09-2005, 04:12 AM

An article about Bond ...http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/video...ry/218145.html

and then an article written by Bond.....http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/video...ry/218149.html

Can't say he's a world beating writer

Loony BoB · 05-09-2005, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zinzan12

Agreed it was a bit of a practice, but you still want to win! I just found Fleming decision to bat at the toss (admittedly on a good track) even more bizaare given the weak and inexperienced bowling attack. In other words....bowling was definately going to be our weakness without both Bond and Vettori (and a rusty Oram and Cairns), so why not bowl first and back the batsmen to chase. With a full strength bowling attack it was probably the right decision to bad.

What annoyed me is that had we won that game we would have sneaked ahead of India in our head to head results against them in ODI's....but instead they move ahead

He could well have made the 'wrong' decision at the toss so he could see how his players would perform when batting first rather than last. Having said that, I'm not sure we've batted last at all...

Zinzan · 05-09-2005, 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loony BoB

He could well have made the 'wrong' decision at the toss so he could see how his players would perform when batting first rather than last. Having said that, I'm not sure we've batted last at all...

Hey no doubt your right Loony. Doesn't mean it was right from Flem though.

Yes we haven't batted last so far in this series....but have looked to chase mostly under Bracewell

Arjun · 05-09-2005, 07:35 AM

Here's a worrying stat for the Indian team. Their premier strike bowler, with over 200 wickets, averages over 42 in tournament finals. We're talking of all the finals he's played, not just the last few, often used to ridicule the Indian batting heroes. You can't win tournament finals with such a strike bowler. Maybe they can afford to try out RP Singh in the final, with the new ball, then bring on Nehra first-change, then Yadav/Bhajji.

honestbharani · 05-09-2005, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjun

Here's a worrying stat for the Indian team. Their premier strike bowler, with over 200 wickets, averages over 42 in tournament finals. We're talking of all the finals he's played, not just the last few, often used to ridicule the Indian batting heroes. You can't win tournament finals with such a strike bowler. Maybe they can afford to try out RP Singh in the final, with the new ball, then bring on Nehra first-change, then Yadav/Bhajji.

Why on earth would you want to leave out AA now, after he has done reasonably well so far? That is the sort of selection that would sniff out any ounce of confidence that the guy has and make sure he is useless for the rest of the season, and possibly his career.

Anil · 05-09-2005, 08:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honestbharani

Why on earth would you want to leave out AA now, after he has done reasonably well so far? That is the sort of selection that would sniff out any ounce of confidence that the guy has and make sure he is useless for the rest of the season, and possibly his career.

aa lose confidence? he has been useless for a significant portion of his career now...if you leave him out now, he knows he will be back 10 games later, whether the others perform in his stead or not...

honestbharani · 05-09-2005, 08:20 AM

But honestly, I don't think the others have performed anything better. And his fielding and his batting (in the odd game) still make him a better bet than those others that were tried out. Plus, he has been good in this series. We guys seriously knock him around too much. Of course, he still bowls rubbish when India is in good positions, but so do the others and at least, he contributes in other areas.

Arjun · 05-09-2005, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honestbharani

Why on earth would you want to leave out AA now, after he has done reasonably well so far? That is the sort of selection that would sniff out any ounce of confidence that the guy has and make sure he is useless for the rest of the season, and possibly his career.

Does the Indian team really need him? In the last five years, when Agarkar has been more or less a regular fixture in the side, they have won just two major tournaments- yet, Agarkar didn't figure in the Natwest final in England, while he missed all of the Samsung Cup ODI's in Pakistan.

He's only done well against minnows. Even though he's got a decent average against the Kiwis, on both occasions, the batting side have often got on top of him and he's bowled enough rubbish to get them off the hook and in a strong position.

What do you think matters more? One has-been's confidence or the cause of the team? He's done nothing of note for a long time that has helped the team, so they won't lose much. Moreover, does AA really matter so much more than RPS? Is RPS so much worse? He may not have much power, but he's done well for a new-ball bowler and is worth the risk.

honestbharani · 05-09-2005, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjun

Does the Indian team really need him? In the last five years, when Agarkar has been more or less a regular fixture in the side, they have won just two major tournaments- yet, Agarkar didn't figure in the Natwest final in England, while he missed all of the Samsung Cup ODI's in Pakistan.

He's only done well against minnows. Even though he's got a decent average against the Kiwis, on both occasions, the batting side have often got on top of him and he's bowled enough rubbish to get them off the hook and in a strong position.

What do you think matters more? One has-been's confidence or the cause of the team? He's done nothing of note for a long time that has helped the team, so they won't lose much. Moreover, does AA really matter so much more than RPS? Is RPS so much worse? He may not have much power, but he's done well for a new-ball bowler and is worth the risk.

No he isn't. He isn't even swinging the white ball as much as IKP and Nehra or even AA does.

Arjun · 05-09-2005, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by honestbharani

No he isn't. He isn't even swinging the white ball as much as IKP and Nehra or even AA does.

While Irfan can swing the ball, RPS can just move the ball a little off the pitch at the other end. The combination is definitely worth a try. Not sure if bowling at full pace is goign to help him much.

adharcric · 05-09-2005, 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arjun

While Irfan can swing the ball, RPS can just move the ball a little off the pitch at the other end. The combination is definitely worth a try. Not sure if bowling at full pace is goign to help him much.

no reason to even consider rp singh over agarkar right now. agarkar has been solid with the ball (average of 14?) and brilliant in the field in this series, while rp singh fluttered after two early wickets and strayed on the leg on many occasions himself. don't hate on agarkar because of his past inconsistency, he's actually helping the team at the moment.

SJS · 05-09-2005, 11:44 PM

AA is exasperatingly inconsistemt and bugs both his fans and detractors. who are legion -either group. Still the fact remains that RP Singh is not good enough to replace him. Just being young is not criteria enough. Otherwise I can conjure up a team of sixteen year olds from my street to play for India.

Seriously. We need a replacement for AA who even his more ardent fans are getting tired of even if they wont admit it. I know, I am one. But we dont have , in this team an adequate replacement. Thats sad but true.

PLUS he has bowled well on this tour, and is arguably one of the top fielders in this Indian side in the deep.

Natman20 · 06-09-2005, 02:16 AM

Need wicket soon!!!!!!!

Natman20 · 06-09-2005, 02:53 AM

India are walkin over the New Zealand attack

05-09-2005, 07:35 AM	#1505 (permalink)
Arjun Cricketer Of The Year Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Mumbai, India Posts: 7,837	Here's a worrying stat for the Indian team. Their premier strike bowler, with over 200 wickets, averages over 42 in tournament finals. We're talking of all the finals he's played, not just the last few, often used to ridicule the Indian batting heroes. You can't win tournament finals with such a strike bowler. Maybe they can afford to try out RP Singh in the final, with the new ball, then bring on Nehra first-change, then Yadav/Bhajji. __________________ "Talent is nothing without opportunity" "You're not remembered for aiming at the target, but hitting it" Twenty20 used to be boring. Sponsored...by...nothing!!!

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05-09-2005, 04:12 AM	#1502 (permalink)
Zinzan Cricketer Of The Year Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: cover point Posts: 9,734	An article about Bond ...http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/video...ry/218145.html and then an article written by Bond.....http://content-nz.cricinfo.com/video...ry/218149.html Can't say he's a world beating writer

05-09-2005, 08:20 AM	#1508 (permalink)
honestbharani Hall of Fame Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Columbus, IN Posts: 15,208	But honestly, I don't think the others have performed anything better. And his fielding and his batting (in the odd game) still make him a better bet than those others that were tried out. Plus, he has been good in this series. We guys seriously knock him around too much. Of course, he still bowls rubbish when India is in good positions, but so do the others and at least, he contributes in other areas.

05-09-2005, 11:44 PM	#1513 (permalink)
SJS Hall of Fame Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: Mumbai India Posts: 19,170	AA is exasperatingly inconsistemt and bugs both his fans and detractors. who are legion -either group. Still the fact remains that RP Singh is not good enough to replace him. Just being young is not criteria enough. Otherwise I can conjure up a team of sixteen year olds from my street to play for India. Seriously. We need a replacement for AA who even his more ardent fans are getting tired of even if they wont admit it. I know, I am one. But we dont have , in this team an adequate replacement. Thats sad but true. PLUS he has bowled well on this tour, and is arguably one of the top fielders in this Indian side in the deep.

06-09-2005, 02:16 AM	#1514 (permalink)
Natman20 International Debutant Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Auckland, NZ Posts: 2,710	Need wicket soon!!!!!!!

06-09-2005, 02:53 AM	#1515 (permalink)
Natman20 International Debutant Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Auckland, NZ Posts: 2,710	India are walkin over the New Zealand attack

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