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Matty Hayden is brilliant on seaming wickets !!

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
Mister Wright said:
Why not? They could get a lot of luck...
They'd need an amount never seen before - greater even than the amount England's batsmen got in the First "Test" against Bangladesh.
 

Slats4ever

International Vice-Captain
agreed matthey hayden is an amazing batsman on any wickets in my opinion though. i reckon he'll slaughter England along with all the other Australian batsman except Langer and Clarke who'll only avg about 20 for the series. Martyn, Ponting, Katich and Hayden on the other hand I believe will walk out've there with series avg's of above 60. Harmison's all talk he'll go back to just being regarded as an avg fast bowler after this series, Giles will lose credibility as a spinner once again, Hoggard will never be considered a world beater and I dunno who your other bloke is, and I probably won't after the series.
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
EnglishRose said:
matthew Hayden is a better player than he is given credit for on this forum. Debate.
is that good enough for you ? 8-)
Agreed there. Hayden has some faults, but inability to play on green wickets is certainly not one of them (his record at the Gabba shows that), and he doesn't get any of the credit he deserves on this forum. Partially I think it's because last time he went to England he struggled... and most (almost all) of those who deride Hayden on this forum are English.
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
EnglishRose said:
Matthew hayden is the world's best batsman on seaming pitches.

His reflexes, poise, and strength make him ideally suited to faciing the most challenging batting conditions anywhere in the world.
he is no where close to being the greatest batsman on seaming pitches, he record on seaming pitches isn't great nor is it poor, its just average
 

aussie

Hall of Fame Member
Richard said:
Err, I said bowlers can't be considered green-top bullies where? 8-)
I said that Harmison has a history of bowling extremely poorly on green-tops so he's not one.QUOTE]

its the total opposite richard, when their is assistance on the wicket Harmison has been menacing but when their is none the opposite happens has was shown in the Caribbean where he was menacing and in SA recently
 

_Ed_

Request Your Custom Title Now!
KennyD said:
Lol.

Tell you what Nath, I haven't been in CC for a while, but geez, sometimes you could cut the tension with a knife...
Indeed. You know what else you can cut with a knife? Ham.

Alright, back to OT for me.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
aussie said:
its the total opposite richard, when their is assistance on the wicket Harmison has been menacing but when their is none the opposite happens has was shown in the Caribbean where he was menacing and in SA recently
Harmison has wasted green wickets - the assistance in the pitches for the first 3 Tests in West Indies was overplayed, far more of his wickets came from poor strokes than seam or uneven bounce.
Yet at Trent Bridge 2003, Lord's (WI) and Edgbaston 2004 and The Wanderers 2004\05 he's wasted ideal seamer's conditions by pitching too short. And Flintoff has done the exact same thing.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
FaaipDeOiad said:
Agreed there. Hayden has some faults, but inability to play on green wickets is certainly not one of them (his record at the Gabba shows that), and he doesn't get any of the credit he deserves on this forum. Partially I think it's because last time he went to England he struggled... and most (almost all) of those who deride Hayden on this forum are English.
I'd be interested to see a summary of Hayden's record at The 'Gabba 1991\92-1999\2000, and how many of those wickets genuinely were seam-friendly.
All I know for sure is he averages 57 there in all domestic cricket.
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
Richard said:
I'd be interested to see a summary of Hayden's record at The 'Gabba 1991\92-1999\2000, and how many of those wickets genuinely were seam-friendly.
All I know for sure is he averages 57 there in all domestic cricket.
Since there isn't any empircal way of calculating a "seam-friendly" as opposed to a "flat' pitch, obviously you can't work out how many Gabba wickets in the 90s were seam friendly, but quite simply the Gabba in the 90s was as seam-friendly as any other wicket in the world, and far more than any other wicket in Australia. Gabba green-tops were regular, and it is impossible that one could average close to 60 there over a decade and not play on a fair few of them.
 

Richard

Cricket Web Staff Member
No, it's not impossible at all.
And likewise it's not impossible, given that the standard of bowling is not Test-match standard, to get away with faults in the domestic game while having them exposed in the Test-match game.
 

Eclipse

International Debutant
how is it not imposible ?

it's not like he was an Australian contracted player, he played everygame for the bulls during that time basicly.
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
Richard said:
No, it's not impossible at all.
And likewise it's not impossible, given that the standard of bowling is not Test-match standard, to get away with faults in the domestic game while having them exposed in the Test-match game.
How is it not impossible?

Think about it... if a) there were green Gabba wickets in the 90s, and b) Hayden played every game (bar one here or there) for Queensland during the 90s and c) every FC game at the Gabba had Queensland and therefore Hayden in it... he played on green tops. And if green tops were regular at the Gabba, he regularly played on green tops. If he averaged 57 despite regularly playing on green tops, he either succeeded quite well on them, or failed on them and absolutely brutalised bowling when the wicket wasn't green with a Bradmansque average. Either way, he is clearly capable of being a successful batsman when pitch conditions trend towards being bowler helpful, which is what counts.
 

Mister Wright

Cricket Web: All-Time Legend
Hayden scored over 1000 runs in his debut season which was either 1991 or 1992. In the late 80s and early 90s, actually infact through the whole 90s decade the 'Gabba was the greenest pitch in the land, and the ball swung from the first ball to the last, at least for the first two days. Hayden played just about every game up until 1995 at least and was the best domestic opener, if not best domestic batsman of that period. Trust me, he can bat on green tops.
 

vic_orthdox

Global Moderator
Domestic pace bowlers of 1995 and before who Hayden would have played against:

Jason Gillespie
Paul Wilson
Jo Angel
Brendan Julian
Damien Fleming
Tony Dodemaide
Mervyn Hughes
David Saker
Wayne Holdsworth
Geoff Lawson
Terry Alderman
Shane George
and plenty more who I've forgotten, who would have also been pretty darn good at exploiting good bowling conditions.
 

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