Black Caps generic thread

[anzac]

so far as the batting lineup goes - I'm not comfortable with any lineup that features Astle, Styris, Oram, McCullum & Vettori or combination of those players..............still smacks of 2nd innings brittleness for me...............I'd prefer to see Vincent or Hamish at #6..........or someone of that type..............

 

[anzac]

and equally I'm not convinced regarding the current top order of Cumming, James M, Hamish M & Fleming.....................their styles do not lend to an ability to accelerate the run rate or attempt to dominate the bowling....................at least not until the arrival of Fleming or at least until they have been at the crease for some time.................very much a 'safety 1st' lineup........and could place undue pressure upon the middle & lower orders to again force the pace

not the right balance for mind..............

 

[sportychic33]

so far as the batting lineup goes - I'm not comfortable with any lineup that features Astle, Styris, Oram, McCullum & Vettori or combination of those players..............still smacks of 2nd innings brittleness for me...............I'd prefer to see Vincent or Hamish at #6..........or someone of that type..............

I don't think that there is a brittleness in there with a line up of Astle, Styris, Oram McCullum and Vettori. They aren't all of a same mould, and as seen in past games they can stick around and have great partnerships, as seen with Vettori and Oram stciking it out in the 2nd Innings in the Pakistan game last year at Hamilton. Oram and McCullum have in the past had great partnerships with Oram's hitting power and McCullum's running. I'm quite comfortable with the line up as they all have the capabilities to stick it out in the 2nd Innings.

 

[Blaze]

I'd actually like to see Styris concentrate on developing his off spin as his primary bowling - Bracewell supposedly thinks he has what it takes and this is one area that I'd actually take his word for it
and he can then perform the same sort of role as Symonds - seam up or spin depending on circumstances.................and gives him a different bowling option to Astle so far as potential team selection goes.............

That would be excellent

 

[Macka]

Fleming starts his season for Nottinghamshire with a bang, out for a magnificent 4 ball duck. Good stuff.

No real surprise.

 

[sportychic33]

• The team can try out Peter Fulton, given his recent form and his impressive domestic record. Maybe some have their apprehensions- back-foot issues, for instance.

• 
  Is there really any need to have Peter Fulton in the squad, with the return of players such as Styris and oram, and having Marshall at 3 and Fleming at 4, as we have enough depth in the middle order.
  
  

  [*]About Jacob Oram, he should be played as a striker at number 6 and as a first-change seamer. With Oram as a bowler, there has to be a fifth.

  I agree with you there. Oram has the capability to be the first change and he has said that he would ideally like to take that role, and with Styris and Astle likely to be in the team there is more than enough bowling options.
  

  [*]With Styris and Oram not likely to return soon, they must get more runs out of Franklin and Vettori.

  Where are you getting this info from. Oram and Styris are targeting Zimbabwe or S.A (if the Zimbabwe tour doesn't go ahead)for a return to international cricket. Styris is playing county cricket and Oram is now bowling.

 

[anzac]

I don't think that there is a brittleness in there with a line up of Astle, Styris, Oram McCullum and Vettori. They aren't all of a same mould, and as seen in past games they can stick around and have great partnerships, as seen with Vettori and Oram stciking it out in the 2nd Innings in the Pakistan game last year at Hamilton. Oram and McCullum have in the past had great partnerships with Oram's hitting power and McCullum's running. I'm quite comfortable with the line up as they all have the capabilities to stick it out in the 2nd Innings.

true but I worry that their performances lack consistency..................

and then in comparison I look at the resistance & runs posted by Vincent in those 2 2nd digs I keep referring to..............and even when he & Fleming swapped positions for his double - Flem came in at #6 & made 80 b4 Vincent carried it further with partnerships with the lower order & tail.............

I know Vettori has been doing he same thing - but its a bit tough to have to do it basically from the tail.........

no disrespect intended but I'm not confident that the players would put their heads down to make it happen - otherwise why have we had so many bloody collapses - Macca hasn't been there all the time!!!!!!

I'd perhaps have more confidence if Oram was playing as a batsman so that he could concentrate more on just that discipline, but by the same token my intended role for him in the batting lineup is to put the bowling attack to the sword from either #5 or #7, but while in partnership with a more moderate style player - (much the same way that Gilchrist can go at you while Katich & Co secure the other end etc...........and I don't mean for Oram to try and slog or anything........), and not to be responsible for partnerships in the lower order.............

 

[anzac]

Fleming starts his season for Nottinghamshire with a bang, out for a magnificent 4 ball duck. Good stuff.

I'm presuming that ENG season conditions would follow a similar pattern to our own - lush at the begining of the season with plenty of seam & swing, and at the opposite end you have some pitches that flatten out etc - a bit like the season at The Basin perhaps................

this being the case then more often than not NZL players do not get to see the season thru' becasue of either intnl duties or the start of our season................

which then raises the question that apart from the money & match play - what benefits are they gaining for their skills if they are playing in conditions most similar to our own - as I haven't seen any 'real' improvement from any of the bowlers, let alone batsmen?????

if anything it would be reinforcing their limitations to being local heroes only - no wonder both batsmen & bowlers struggle technically with their skills & application!!!!!!!


or am I barking up the wrong tree??????

 

[Arjun]

Where are you getting this info from. Oram and Styris are targeting Zimbabwe or S.A (if the Zimbabwe tour doesn't go ahead)for a return to international cricket. Styris is playing county cricket and Oram is now bowling.

Not bad, but on one post on the Official Aus v/s NZ thread, I heard they would be out of action for more than one series. Is the NZ side taking a break? I'd like to know how Styris is doing for his county side.

Is there really any need to have Peter Fulton in the squad, with the return of players such as Styris and oram, and having Marshall at 3 and Fleming at 4, as we have enough depth in the middle order.

He may be good for the bench, as a reserve middle-order batsman. Better choice than Sinclair and an out-of-form McMillan.

 

[Ming]

There is no need for Fulton in a 15-man squad, because you would already have a reserve bat in Styris and a possible 6 in McCullum/Oram.

Styris hasn't played for his county yet.

 

[Kippax]

I'd be interested to know, how many people on CW agree with the assertion in the papers recently that Vincent will be "a certainty" in the next full-strength OD side Bracewell picks? Has the 224 and the promise that he's 'new and improved' already overwritten the 62 ODIs of Spearman-like stats?

Given Bracewell has said several times that he sees Hamish's future in a full-strength line-up at #5, where would Vincent most likely bat?

Fleming
Astle
? (J Marshall, Vincent, maybe an experimental choice like Taylor or Fulton in ZIM)
Styris
Hamish
McMillan (or Vincent, or one of the experimental options, or another seamer at #10-11)
Cairns
Oram
McCullum
Vettori
Bond

 

[Ming]

If Vincent could repeat the attacking attitude he demonstrated against Australia during his 40, and also his 224 against SL, he would be a certainty in the ODI team at either 3 or 5 depending on where Hamish Marshall bats. I would prefer to see Marshall at first-drop, the more he bats in a NZ innings, the better our total looks. Vincent would be a great asset at 5, where he could push the ball around, and his fast running between the wickets, would be a good change to the bigger hitting of Styris, Cairns and Oram.

Imagine a middle order of Marshall, Marshall, Vincent, McCullum....the speed between the wickets....

 

[psxpro]

I don't know yet if vincent is a odi player, he is capable though, he can run quickly and has shown when in form he can hit big too.
I think him james marshall and craig mcmillan may be competiting for a spot.

 

[Arjun]

There is no need for Fulton in a 15-man squad, because you would already have a reserve bat in Styris and a possible 6 in McCullum/Oram.

The kind of form Fulton's in, he may be picked for the bench, but Styris shouldn't play as a batsman, but as a full-fledged all-rounder, since he is more useful to the team that way. Besides, his batting hasn't been that good of late. Oram may be used as a striker at 7, then Vettori, then a genuine wicketkeeper (not another part-timer), then two bowlers. You then have batting till number 8.

 

[psxpro]

Mccullum isnt a part timer hes a good keeper.
He has been improving

 

[Arjun]

Mccullum isnt a part timer hes a good keeper.
He has been improving

Hopkins seems a better bet with the gloves, going by some comments by fans and his keeping in the only ODI he played.

 

[_Ed_]

McCullum's keeping is good enough I think, he was a bit of a liability at first but he has improved a huge amount in the last couple of years, much better than just a part-timer. I think he is a better option than Hopkins, his keeping isn't far behind Hopkins and his batting is so much better that he definitely deserves the spot I think.

 

[Arjun]

Why does James Franklin bat at the bottom three positions in the batting order? He has a good domestic records a batsman (including a century) and even got a 50 against the Lankans, so he can be considered a regular batsman at 7 or 8, particularly when Styris and Oram are out of action.

 

[Sir Redman]

Why does James Franklin bat at the bottom three positions in the batting order? He has a good domestic records a batsman (including a century) and even got a 50 against the Lankans, so he can be considered a regular batsman at 7 or 8, particularly when Styris and Oram are out of action.

Because he's not as good as the batsmen who currently occupy those slots.
With Oram, McCullum and Vettori at 6/7/8 or even 7/8/9 there's no reason to promote him.
He is a decent batsman though and if injuries do occur he does have the ability to move up to 8.

 

[Prince EWS]

Franklin definately does have the ability to bat number 8, but why bat him there when you have McCullum, Vettori and Oram 7-9? Who bats 10 out of that lot?