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Wisden Cricketers of the Year

Loony BoB

International Captain
Five Englishmen took the five spots. Leading Cricket In The World given to Shane Warne. Your thoughts? Did five Englishmen really deserve the five spots? Shane Warne - better than any other cricketer in 2004, or not?
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
Loony BoB said:
Five Englishmen took the five spots. Leading Cricket In The World given to Shane Warne. Your thoughts? Did five Englishmen really deserve the five spots? Shane Warne - better than any other cricketer in 2004, or not?
Hasnt Shane Warne already recieved the Wisden cricketer of the year award before ?

He got it in 1994. You cant get it twice.

I suppose most cricketers in the world have got it by now and English cricketers are the only ones left on the planet who have never got them before :p
 

Adamc

Cricketer Of The Year
Loony BoB said:
Five Englishmen took the five spots. Leading Cricket In The World given to Shane Warne. Your thoughts? Did five Englishmen really deserve the five spots? Shane Warne - better than any other cricketer in 2004, or not?
The point of the Five Cricketers of the Year is to show the top five cricketers in the English First-Class season, so it's unsurprising that there tend to be a fair few Englishmen every year. Given that none of the players from NZ or WI (the only teams to play Tests in England in 2004) performed particularly outstandingly, and that England won every Test, it is fairly reasonable for the five to be Englishmen. I don't really see the point of it though; cricket no longer revolves around the English FC season. The Player of the Year idea is good, but there should really be more than one I think.
 

Adamc

Cricketer Of The Year
SJS said:
Hasnt Shane Warne already recieved the Wisden cricketer of the year award before ?

He got it in 1994. You cant get it twice.

I suppose most cricketers in the world have got it by now and English cricketers are the only ones left on the planet who have never got them before :p
No: you can't be named one of the Five Cricketers of the Year award twice. The Player of the Year award is a new one (began last year with Ricky Ponting), so this is obviously the first time Warne's got it.
 

Loony BoB

International Captain
Adamc said:
The point of the Five Cricketers of the Year is to show the top five cricketers in the English First-Class season, so it's unsurprising that there tend to be a fair few Englishmen every year. Given that none of the players from NZ or WI (the only teams to play Tests in England in 2004) performed particularly outstandingly, and that England won every Test, it is fairly reasonable for the five to be Englishmen. I don't really see the point of it though; cricket no longer revolves around the English FC season. The Player of the Year idea is good, but there should really be more than one I think.
Ah, I see, I thought it was for the world in general. In that case, 'tis a shame they don't concentrate on the world rather than the English season these days. If they only started the international cricketer of the year last year, then they're well behind the times in my opinion.

No: you can't be named one of the Five Cricketers of the Year award twice. The Player of the Year award is a new one (began last year with Ricky Ponting), so this is obviously the first time Warne's got it.
I'm also quite sure that you're able to win this award more than once, too... not entirely sure, but I think I read it somewhere. Maybe I'm thinking of something else.
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
The choices seem fair enough. Only New Zealand and the West Indies were otherwise eligable, and considering they didn't win a test it's fair to say the England had a good time of it and all five were deserving. In fact, four of the five were among the top performers in the year the world over, Robert Key is probably the only one who wasn't anything special. And given that England's rise and Australia's win in India for the first time in over 30 years are the key stories of the year, England dominating things seems fair enough.

As far as the world player of the year thing is concerned, I thought you could only win it once. Perhaps this rule was changed when Wisden altered the focus of the other five players they chose last year? Anyway, Warne and McGrath were the two obvious candidates, having big years AND comebacks from a long absence, and McGrath's comeback has been much more brief, so Warne is a fair choice. Other possibles were Kallis, Kumble and Martyn.

edit: it appears Adam has cleared this up, although I was right about the award system being changed. ;)

It's a good award in my opinon - players who win it multiple times will certainly be revered for it, and it's an opportunity for Wisden to have an award that takes into account ONLY the past 12 months and picks the best overall player, rather than saying "well Lara had a great year, but Strauss was more of a revelation even if he wasn't quite as great, so we'll pick him".
 
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Dasa

International Vice-Captain
Loony BoB said:
Five Englishmen took the five spots. Leading Cricket In The World given to Shane Warne. Your thoughts? Did five Englishmen really deserve the five spots? Shane Warne - better than any other cricketer in 2004, or not?
Don't really have a problem with the five cricketers of the year... I can't think of too many international players who have had that much of an impact on the English FC season.
I don't really agree with Warne. IMO there have been bigger matchwinners throughout 2004, and other cricketers have performed just as well, if not better. I think Kumble would've been a better choice myself.
 

Adamc

Cricketer Of The Year
SJS said:
HUH .

What did I say ?
I was agreeing with you on that point. But I was saying that Warne was not one of the Five Cricketers of the Year this year. Rather, he was Player of the Year, which is a separate award altogether.
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
Sorry I didnt read the post properly.

here are the winners since 1994when warne got it. As can be seen most of the worlds top players have already got it.

1994 DC Boon, IA Healy, MG Hughes,SK Warne , SL Watkin.
1995 BC Lara, DE Malcolm, TA Munton, SJ Rhodes, KC Wessels.
1996 DG Cork, PA de Silva, ARC Fraser, A Kumble DA Reeve.
1997 ST Jayasuriya, Mushtaq Ahmed, Saeed Anwar, PV Simmons, SR Tendulkar.
1998 MTG Elliott, SG Law, MP Maynard, GD McGrath, GP Thorpe.
1999 ID Austin, D Gough, M Muralitharan, A Ranatunga, JN Rhodes.
2000 CL Cairns, R Dravid, L Klusener, TM Moody, Saqlain Mushtaq.
2001 MW Alleyne, MP Bicknell, AR Caddick, JL Langer, DS Lehmann.
2002 A Flower, AC Gilchrist, JN Gillespie, VVS Laxman, DR Martyn.
2003 ML Hayden, AJ Hollioake, N Hussain, SM Pollock, MP Vaughan.
2004 CJ Adams, A Flintoff, IJ Harvey, G Kirsten, GC Smith.
2005 AF Giles, SJ Harmison, RWT Key, AJ Strauss, ME Trescothick.
 

SJS

Hall of Fame Member
QUICK QUESTION :

Which was the last TOURING New Zealander to be one of the five Wisden Cricketers of the Year?
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
I really like the Wisden 40. I think it's a fantastic addition to the almanac, as is the number one player that comes as part of it.
 

Adamc

Cricketer Of The Year
FaaipDeOiad said:
I really like the Wisden 40. I think it's a fantastic addition to the almanac, as is the number one player that comes as part of it.
Whoops, forgot about the Wisden Forty. I retract my earlier comment: "The Player of the Year idea is good, but there should really be more than one I think." Consider it retracted. :happy:
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
Adamc said:
Whoops, forgot about the Wisden Forty. I retract my earlier comment: "The Player of the Year idea is good, but there should really be more than one I think." Consider it retracted. :happy:
Well, there is still only one player of the year, as he is the best of the Wisden 40. ;)

40 players might seem like a lot, but I think it an excellent historical resource in the making. The reason is, the Wisden Almanac is unquestionably the best text resource we have for judging the game from prior eras. We all know of the fundamental weaknesses of purely statistical analysis as it does not take into account the circumstances in which the runs and wickets were picked up, whereas Wisden does, utilising the best cricket writers we have in the process. The Wisden 40 will be an excellent resource in the future to reflect back on in terms of discussing who were the solid performers of an era. Obviously the best players may remain in it for years on end, while others will have a good year and come in only to fade again.
 

Scallywag

Banned
Congats to Warnie for a well deserved accolade, his performance has been nothing short of brilliant.

I think they need to change the title of the "five cricketers of the year award" to the "five cricketers of the year who have not won the five cricketers of the year award before award".
 

Link

State Vice-Captain
I dont think bobbie key deserved the prize as much as others like: sarwan, gayle or michael clarke. but hey i am not a selector or maybe they know something i dont. Also bit surprising to see names like martin bicknell and no chanderpaul
 

FaaipDeOiad

Hall of Fame Member
Link said:
I dont think bobbie key deserved the prize as much as others like: sarwan, gayle or michael clarke. but hey i am not a selector or maybe they know something i dont. Also bit surprising to see names like martin bicknell and no chanderpaul
The award is given based on impact on the English First Class season. Michael Clarke for one had no impact on it.
 

a massive zebra

International Captain
Shane Warne is so overrated it beggars belief. Probably the most overrated bowler of all time, he constantly gets so many accolades/awards that he doesn't deserve, purely through a God like reputation galvanised by ill educated media hype. In truth, his career has been highly inconsistent, he has constantly failed against the best, benefited from the opportunity to nail tails after McGrath and co have dismissed the better batsmen, and his overall career figures fall short of the truely great category. Yet he is regularly labelled as the best spinner ever (usually without any supporting evidence), despite O'Reilly's much greater consistency, Laker's much greater form at his peak, and Murali's much better record against almost all teams under almost all circumstances despite playing in a much weaker side, and much greater reliability and peak performance.

Warne had a decent enough year but no better than dozens of other players and was a long way short of the world's best player.

End of rant. :)
 
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Scallywag

Banned
a massive zebra said:
Shane Warne is so overrated it beggars belief. Probably the most overrated bowler of all time, he constantly gets so many accolades/awards that he doesn't deserve, purely through a God like reputation galvanised by ill educated media hype. In truth, his career has been highly inconsistent, he has constantly failed against the best and benefited from the opportunity to nail tails after McGrath and co have dismissed the better batsmen, and his overall career figures fall short of the truely great category. Yet he is regularly labelled as the best spinner ever (usually without any supporting evidence), despite O'Reilly's much greater consistency, Laker's much greater form at his peak, and Murali's much better record against almost all teams under almost all circumstances despite playing in a much weaker side, and much greater reliability and peak performance.

Warne had a decent enough year but no better than dozens of other players and was a long way short of the world's best player.

End of rant. :)
Yes I also think Warne is the greatest ever spin bowler.
 

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