Magrat Garlick
Global Moderator
I believe 1896 runs @ 79 in the first class season had something to do with it.Link said:
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Wisden Cricketers of the Year
- Thread starter Loony BoB
- Start date
a massive zebra
International Captain
Says the most unashamedly biased member of the forum.Scallywag said:
SJS
Hall of Fame Member
WOW !!a massive zebra said:Shane Warne is so overrated it beggars belief. Probably the most overrated bowler of all time, he constantly gets so many accolades/awards that he doesn't deserve, purely through a God like reputation galvanised by ill educated media hype. In truth, his career has been highly inconsistent, he has constantly failed against the best, benefited from the opportunity to nail tails after McGrath and co have dismissed the better batsmen, and his overall career figures fall short of the truely great category. Yet he is regularly labelled as the best spinner ever (usually without any supporting evidence), despite O'Reilly's much greater consistency, Laker's much greater form at his peak, and Murali's much better record against almost all teams under almost all circumstances despite playing in a much weaker side, and much greater reliability and peak performance.
Warne had a decent enough year but no better than dozens of other players and was a long way short of the world's best player.
End of rant.
I am impressed. I have not seen such sentiments expressed towards warne on this forum. Where were you all this time my friend.
By the way, I agree with most of what you say. I am amazed that Australians who have produced some of the greatest leg spinners the game has ever seen, well actually the two all time greatest as per me, should consider Warne as God, literally. I always have a leg spinner in my all time greatest test teams, its always an Australian but I keep shifting between Grimett and Orielly. I prefer take Grimett more often than Orielly in such a side because I always have Syd Barnes as a fixture in the team so Orielly being a similar type of bowler(being so much quicker) doesnt provide as much variety as Grimmett.
a massive zebra
International Captain
Thank you.
Have you not read any of mine/C_C's/ReallyCrazy's/Rik's well known Murali vs Warne arguments with TEC/Marc/Neil/Halsey?
I would always pick O'Reilly over Grimmett. He was almost universally recognised as the best of the two by contemporaries, and Grimmett was far less successful against the very best team of the time, England.
O'Reilly v England 19 7864 2587 102 7/54 25.36 1.97 77.0 8 3
Grimmett v England 22 9164 3439 106 6/37 32.44 2.25 86.4 11 2
This is what a leading 1930s journalist said shortly before he died in the early 80s:
``Grimmett was a short man who bowled with a low action, halfway to roundarm, which helped conceal the googly as you don't have to bend the wrist so far with a low action. He gave the ball plenty of air and spun it a lot, getting a great deal of movement off the pitch. However, his Test figures may be flattering as I think that, like Titch Freeman, he took advantage of the weaker teams and tail-enders contributed a lot to the total of his victims.''
``O'Reilly was unquestionably the greater bowler, and I am sure was the more feared by top class batsmen. He bowled a genuine medium pace, with an occasional fast-medium. He didn't turn the ball as much as Grimmett, but enough to beat the bat. His long loping run-up and general demeanour were the very picture of hostility, though he never descended to the level of bad temper and abuse of Lillee or Holding. Laker may have been the best spinner of all on a wicket that suited him but not otherwise.''
Have you not read any of mine/C_C's/ReallyCrazy's/Rik's well known Murali vs Warne arguments with TEC/Marc/Neil/Halsey?
I would always pick O'Reilly over Grimmett. He was almost universally recognised as the best of the two by contemporaries, and Grimmett was far less successful against the very best team of the time, England.
O'Reilly v England 19 7864 2587 102 7/54 25.36 1.97 77.0 8 3
Grimmett v England 22 9164 3439 106 6/37 32.44 2.25 86.4 11 2
This is what a leading 1930s journalist said shortly before he died in the early 80s:
``Grimmett was a short man who bowled with a low action, halfway to roundarm, which helped conceal the googly as you don't have to bend the wrist so far with a low action. He gave the ball plenty of air and spun it a lot, getting a great deal of movement off the pitch. However, his Test figures may be flattering as I think that, like Titch Freeman, he took advantage of the weaker teams and tail-enders contributed a lot to the total of his victims.''
``O'Reilly was unquestionably the greater bowler, and I am sure was the more feared by top class batsmen. He bowled a genuine medium pace, with an occasional fast-medium. He didn't turn the ball as much as Grimmett, but enough to beat the bat. His long loping run-up and general demeanour were the very picture of hostility, though he never descended to the level of bad temper and abuse of Lillee or Holding. Laker may have been the best spinner of all on a wicket that suited him but not otherwise.''
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a massive zebra
International Captain
a massive zebra
International Captain
He was voted one of the Five Cricketers Of The Year in 1994, an award you can only win once.
This year he was voted as the best cricketer in the world - a new award.
This year he was voted as the best cricketer in the world - a new award.
C_C
International Captain
muchos gracias.
That is the primary reason i dont rate Wisden Cricketer of the year award very well- you can win it only once and five of them are given out every year...over a 20 year period, that is 100 new people winning it.
Devalues the award IMO and if they had the clause of multiple awarding to the same person, i think the quality of players winning it would be a lot more limited.
That is the primary reason i dont rate Wisden Cricketer of the year award very well- you can win it only once and five of them are given out every year...over a 20 year period, that is 100 new people winning it.
Devalues the award IMO and if they had the clause of multiple awarding to the same person, i think the quality of players winning it would be a lot more limited.
Anil
Hall of Fame Member
good points...although he did play better against india in india this time around...a massive zebra said:Shane Warne is so overrated it beggars belief. Probably the most overrated bowler of all time, he constantly gets so many accolades/awards that he doesn't deserve, purely through a God like reputation galvanised by ill educated media hype. In truth, his career has been highly inconsistent, he has constantly failed against the best, benefited from the opportunity to nail tails after McGrath and co have dismissed the better batsmen, and his overall career figures fall short of the truely great category. Yet he is regularly labelled as the best spinner ever (usually without any supporting evidence), despite O'Reilly's much greater consistency, Laker's much greater form at his peak, and Murali's much better record against almost all teams under almost all circumstances despite playing in a much weaker side, and much greater reliability and peak performance.
Warne had a decent enough year but no better than dozens of other players and was a long way short of the world's best player.
End of rant.
marc71178
Eyes not spreadsheets
I'm fairly sure they've extended the 5 now so it's not just on performances in the English FC season (I seem to remember either last year or the year before 1 of the selected didn't actually play in England at all in the year)Loony BoB said:
Which award?Loony BoB said:
Certainly not the 5.
C_C
International Captain
An award loses its lusture if it was handed out to everybody.marc71178 said:
200 new faces over 10 years devalues the award.
Thats like the Victoria Cross being given each year to 10 new soldiers.
200 new players every decade is just too much and a short look at the list shows rather mediocre names winning it.
An award that isnt reserved for the best of the best isnt a very valuable award IMO.
a massive zebra
International Captain
Only in one match and most of their batsmen were out of form. He was still the most expensive Australian bowler in the series and the most expensive spinner on either side.Anil said: