World Crickets speed demons

[aussie]

aussie

Saqlain, except on a turning pitch, is like any fingerspinner - nothing special. On a turning pitch he's better than a normal fingerspinner because of his Doosra.
Hoggard is not a quality bowler, he's a bowler who will sometimes bowl well, and sometimes very poorly.
Ntini is not a particularly good bowler, yes he takes wickets, but he usually takes a while to take them, and sometimes sprays the thing all over the place, too - and even when he takes them it's mostly poor strokes.
Vaas when he bowls well is better than anyone; when he bowls poorly he's absolutely shocking. You cannot possibly say that Vaas is anything in general, because it really doesn't work like that.
Craig White had 1 period where he really, really bowled well (the batting-line-up of West Indies most certainly was not shocking, either - they were just made to look so by some exceptional bowling on some good pitches for seamers), that being 2000-2000\01. He also bowled OK in 2002\03, though obviously not as well as 2 years earlier.
In the 2000-2000\01 period he had 4 good matches (series are not the relevant thing).

And Lee is not a good bowler, and he's not made any improvement in accuracy, as anyone can see unless they've been wanting to see otherwise for ages and haven't seen him bowl for a while.
If you really can blame Lee's period of shockingly poor bowling in 2001-2003\04 on persistent injuries you're just looking to forgive any failing.
What it is about Lee that so many people like so much I just don't know. But there are so many people who will do anything to try to make it look like he's a superb bowler.

Then u follow it up with that crap

 

[marc71178]

good comment at last richard

I assume that was sarcasm?

 

[aussie]

aussie

yeah mate it was

 

[Langeveldt]

is that zimbabwe guy that quick r u sure i rememebr seeing him bowl when england were in zimbabwe last novemeber i dont recall him bowling at those speeds

I think you'll find I was joking mate

 

[wahindiawah]

An average of 30 is very poor? So the likes of Chaminda Vaas, Michael Kasprowicz, Makhaya Ntini, Matthew Hoggard, Andrew Flintoff, Danish Kaneria etc are very poor bowlers?

Lee's current average is in my view no more reflective of his abilities than the record of 42 wickets @ 16 with a strike rate of 32 he had before his first serious injury. A better measurement of his abilities will come out in the future as he plays more test matches. Personaly I'd expect him to finish with an average in the high 20s and an excellent strike rate, as one might expect from a quality fast bowler. Perhaps he will get the average down a bit further if he continues to develop through the later part of his career.

Are we talking about Pacers abilities ? or are we talking about who is the best in the world?

An ave of above 30 certainly suggest he isn't the best, how the guy is going to fare on future is based on assumptions. I'm not saying that the guy is crap, but untill he start delivering in test matches there is no way he can be called the best just coz some of you guys think he has the ability to deliver.

 

[wahindiawah]

Now you've got a point with the bowling, but the ODI batting?
Salman Butt, Yasir Hameed, Shoaib Malik, Inzamam-Ul-Haq, Yousuf Youhana is most certainly a very capable line-up and to call it otherwise smacks of anit-Pakistan prejudice.

Rubbish ! Inzi,Youhanna and Malik are good batters but Salman seems to be on his way out.

Pakistani batting is fragile, it has been the weakness of the team and it is going to remain a weakness.

 

[wahindiawah]

u cant be serious how can u say lee's perfromances in test cricket is embarassing, he has 130 odd wickets at an average of about 31 its not great but its good, cleary mate u dont know what ur saying

In the last ten test matches he averaged above 36 and that was certainly very poor and resulted in him being droppped. This should be very simple for anyone to get.

 

[wahindiawah]

akhtar is rubbish more often than not, not that you could tell because whenever he comes up against oposition who look like getting oon top of him he suddenly gets injured.

But then Lee happens to be rubbish almost all the time.

Also Lee happen to have the luxury of not bowling to Aussie batters, had he faced Ponting,Langer Hayden and others, he would had a real nightmare.

 

[wahindiawah]

. To u blokes who is the best for me its Brett Lee

The was the original question

Neither his current test average nor his early test average accurately reflect his abilities

Maybe he has loads of talent, but talent without actuall performance doesn't make you the best in world.

 

[social]

ahhhhhhhh yes richard another one of ur special comments, prove to me that lee is rubbish all the time, jeeeese mate how could you make such a poor comment. Have you looked at lee performances in the vb series and in the just concluded odi series in nz that same rubbish bowler had the paksitan, west indies and kiwi batsmen all jumping around with has pace and since i first saw him in 1999 home seies againts india i have never seen him bowl better.

Save your breath Aussie.

Youre dealing with someone that in one post praises Pakistans batting and in the next dismisses Lee's performances against them.

Anyone watching Lee bowl is able to instantly recognise the improvements that he has made. Unfortunately for Richard and TEC, they wear blinkers when he comes onto bowl.

 

[Choora]

Unless Lee start playing test cricket again, and unless he shows visible improvement in bowling at test level , he simply cannot be considered as the best!

 

[aussie]

aussie

Save your breath Aussie.

Youre dealing with someone that in one post praises Pakistans batting and in the next dismisses Lee's performances against them.

Anyone watching Lee bowl is able to instantly recognise the improvements that he has made. Unfortunately for Richard and TEC, they wear blinkers when he comes onto bowl.

yeah mate i dont get them and ur forgetting that indian bloke wahindiawah he seems to be in that category too

 

[social]

yeah mate i dont get them and ur forgetting that indian bloke wahindiawah he seems to be in that category too

Ill reserve judgement on wah..... because he may not have had the opportunity to watch Lee of late.

The sad part about Richard and TEC is that they claim to have watched every ball he has bowled

 

[wahindiawah]

yeah mate i dont get them and ur forgetting that indian bloke wahindiawah he seems to be in that category too

Stop getting personal, just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean you can bash him.

 

[aussie]

aussie

In the last ten test matches he averaged above 36 and that was certainly very poor and resulted in him being droppped. This should be very simple for anyone to get.

u got ur facts mixed up, lee was never dropped he got injured in sri lanka and then kasper bowled superly during that time, and its not like lee hasn't devastated batsmen in test cricket, his debut in melbourne was good, while he had some other good spells around the place but how could he devastate batsmen when he is always bowling in the shadow of mcgrath and gillespie, while akhtar his hugely inconsistent and bond hasn't played enough test for him to be touted has the best.

 

[wahindiawah]

Ill reserve judgement on wah..... because he may not have had the opportunity to watch Lee of late.

The unbelieveable thing is that it was none other than you who started this thread and posed the question as to who IS the best in the world. Considering that Lee is YET to play a test match the argument that he IS still th best in the world coz of his abilities is laughable.

 

[anzac]

A demonstration of how ridiculous the argument to get Lee into the side has become.
If anyone seriously thinks he's half the bowler Gillespie is they need psychiatric treatment.

i think what Cairns' point was in regard to the one paced nature of the AUS attack & that Border has expressed concerns over that lack of variety.............

with McGrath still able to do what he does & Kasper having his own distinctive abilities in his role as 3rd seamer, Gillespie could be 'vulnerable' having slowed himself down to bowl more like McGrath - particularly if he's not taking wickets nor showing any penetration.......

no one is disputing that Gillespie is a premier bowler, just that all the conjecture about the battle being Kasper v Lee may not be the case..........

 

[aussie]

aussie

Stop getting personal, just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean you can bash him.

i'm not being personal, its fact u and richard seem to think lee is rubbish and we are just agreeing to that fact, its not personal at all. come on mate dont overexaggerate

 

[wahindiawah]

u got ur facts mixed up, lee was never dropped he got injured in sri lanka and then kasper bowled superly during that time, and its not like lee hasn't devastated batsmen in test cricket, his debut in melbourne was good, while he had some other good spells around the place but how could he devastate batsmen when he is always bowling in the shadow of mcgrath and gillespie, while akhtar his hugely inconsistent and bond hasn't played enough test for him to be touted has the best.

He made a recovery and wasn't picked up in squad, if he wasn't dropped then he was considered for selection.

Playing alongside McGrath and Jason should be an advantage to a pacer, ever heard of saying "fast bowlers hunt in pairs"???

Akhtar may be inconsistent but still have fared better than Lee so far. If Lee ever devasted batsmen in test matches in the past then Akhtar had done that with greater effect in the past.

 

[wahindiawah]

i'm not being personal, its fact u and richard seem to think lee is rubbish and we are just agreeing to that fact, its not personal at all. come on mate dont overexaggerate

What is a fact? the only fact is that you are being silly over here because i have said and maintained that the guy has potential but unless he delivers in test matches he cannot be considered as the best


And not being the best in the world doesn't mean one is rubbish, hope ppl knew this simple fact